(Mighty) Stu Yellin, WNBF Pro Updates n Q&A

If I could be indulged in one more, probably silly question. it’s really less a question and more just getting your opinion:

Considering that I’m now 155 pounds and pretty pathetically weak (it is incredible how much mass the body can lose with bedrest combined with an inability to eat over a prolonged period), is it even realistic to think that I can get to a point where competing is possible two years ahead? I know it seems arbitrary, but I’d always set 30 as my goal age to compete (turning 28 this year).

[quote]MinusTheColon wrote:
If I could be indulged in one more, probably silly question. it’s really less a question and more just getting your opinion:

Considering that I’m now 155 pounds and pretty pathetically weak (it is incredible how much mass the body can lose with bedrest combined with an inability to eat over a prolonged period), is it even realistic to think that I can get to a point where competing is possible two years ahead? I know it seems arbitrary, but I’d always set 30 as my goal age to compete (turning 28 this year).[/quote]

What is your diet like now? What are you capable of eating, and how efficient is your body at processing food? While I’m not 100% on what happened to you, your username is a pretty strong hint. So with that, your body’s ability to break down nutrients (macro and micro) is likely compromised to some degree. How much?

Can your body efficiently process protein, fat and carbs? Can you eat enough to gain strength/weight?

I don’t have answers, but if you could give some more information, I bet Stu could provide you with a better set of answers.

–Me

[quote]kravi wrote:

What is your diet like now? What are you capable of eating, and how efficient is your body at processing food? While I’m not 100% on what happened to you, your username is a pretty strong hint. So with that, your body’s ability to break down nutrients (macro and micro) is likely compromised to some degree. How much?

Can your body efficiently process protein, fat and carbs? Can you eat enough to gain strength/weight?

I don’t have answers, but if you could give some more information, I bet Stu could provide you with a better set of answers.

–Me
[/quote]

To be honest, I’m still figuring that out right now. A lot of this is idiosyncratic and involves testing/experimenting with food tolerances. My anatomy is so screwed up that my doc really could only recommend lean meats and said I’d have to find what worked.

For the month before Xmas, I’d literally been only on 1 fat-free yogurt, 2 rice cakes and 3 egg whites. I was drastically losing weight and knew it wasn’t long term sustainable.

Lately I’ve been incorporating some new things. I have to avoid fiber to the extent that I can and should only do fats to the extent that I can tolerate them. Been experimenting with fat free cottage cheese, chicken breasts, some lean cuts of beef and pork, whey protein, cereal and small amounts of “quick oats” that are more processed/chopped up. I’ve been explicitly warned against vegetables (which, let me tell you–sucks).

So really I was asking Stu those questions with the background assumption that I can, in fact process some of these things in the longer term, as otherwise this is all a fool’s errand that I’m trying out.

[quote]MinusTheColon wrote:

[quote]kravi wrote:

What is your diet like now? What are you capable of eating, and how efficient is your body at processing food? While I’m not 100% on what happened to you, your username is a pretty strong hint. So with that, your body’s ability to break down nutrients (macro and micro) is likely compromised to some degree. How much?

Can your body efficiently process protein, fat and carbs? Can you eat enough to gain strength/weight?

I don’t have answers, but if you could give some more information, I bet Stu could provide you with a better set of answers.

–Me
[/quote]

To be honest, I’m still figuring that out right now. A lot of this is idiosyncratic and involves testing/experimenting with food tolerances. My anatomy is so screwed up that my doc really could only recommend lean meats and said I’d have to find what worked.

For the month before Xmas, I’d literally been only on 1 fat-free yogurt, 2 rice cakes and 3 egg whites. I was drastically losing weight and knew it wasn’t long term sustainable.

Lately I’ve been incorporating some new things. I have to avoid fiber to the extent that I can and should only do fats to the extent that I can tolerate them. Been experimenting with fat free cottage cheese, chicken breasts, some lean cuts of beef and pork, whey protein, cereal and small amounts of “quick oats” that are more processed/chopped up. I’ve been explicitly warned against vegetables (which, let me tell you–sucks).

So really I was asking Stu those questions with the background assumption that I can, in fact process some of these things in the longer term, as otherwise this is all a fool’s errand that I’m trying out.[/quote]

It isn’t a fool’s errand, it is more a question of knowing your limitations and basing your goals around them. I mean, assuming judges won’t judge you for having scars, if you can’t get big in the first place…

Do you eat any organ meat? Since you are limited to vegetables, it seems, you need to get nutrition from somewhere. You can get liver, kidneys, hearts, etc which pack quite a nutritional punch!

As for whether judges will deduct points because of your scarring, I’ll leave that to Stu to answer :slight_smile:

–Me

EDIT: I wasn’t trying to answer the questions you had for Stu. I wouldn’t dare, and even if I did the answers would likely be crap. I was just asking some questions which I figured might (or might not) help Stu with his answer.

[quote]MinusTheColon wrote:
Really appreciate that advice, Stu.

I hope you won’t mind two more questions, one short and idiosyncratic and one that’s longer:

  1. I started seriously training about seven years ago. I always told myself that I wanted to compete in a BB competition when I am 30. The problem now is twofold, one of which is manageable and the other I wanted your opinion on. The first is that I have to be very careful about lifting because I am highly susceptible to hernias now. The second (and related) issue is that I have severe abdominal scarring, including a large incisional scar running down from my sternum to right above my genitals but also scarring on both sides of the incision relating to tubes that had been inserted into me (four total) over the course of the operation and my recovery.

The question is: what type of effect does this type of medical situation and resultant aesthetic abnormalities have on bodybuilding judging and competing? I know the answer will ultimately be that it is a competition against myself and that I should do a contest if I want without worrying about the judging components, but I’d at least like to know what I’m getting myself into.[/quote]

I know I’ve probably mentioned my friend Phil sometime before, but he had a horrific motorcycle accident that shattered his lower leg in 12 places. As a competitor, he was initially devastated, but through hard work, dedication, and just the most dogged perseverance I have ever seen, he not only regained his form, but continued to improve, winning his Wnbf pro card and a Musclemania pro card at 47 years of age.

Now, obviously as a contest judge, I’ve seen plenty of competitors with surgery scars, and even natural issues that leave them… a bit unsymmetrical. I can tell you that I personally never hold such issues against people, and I’m pretty damn sure that the other judges don’t either.

Phil, being a smart bodybuilder, did his very best to not only even out his physique as best as he could, but as I always did myself, posed in a way that allowed him to hide his weaknesses while showcasing his strengths.

So I guess my final answer here would be that I personally wouldn’t let it factor in to a decision on whether to step onstage or not.

[quote]
2. If I could ask something else that’s been bugging me, literally, for years haha:

I’ve been reading T Nation for years, including your thread and Sloh’s old thread. It’s interesting in coming back to these boards that the top two threads are yours and Sloh’s, because you both have very different approaches to bodybuilding development in general, with his being more of a set-point, traditional bulking approach. I also think of your approach and general philosophies you discuss as being very different from what I have been listening to on Iron Radio over the years with Lonnie Lowrey.

I’ve always been interested in the difference and whether you are all really talking about the same basic principles but just in different terms, or whether it’s that there’s simply more than one way to skin a cat, to the extent that seemingly diametrically opposed principles relating to strength and muscle gain can both lead to success. Wanted to get your thoughts.[/quote]

Well, obviously you’re always going to find people with different approaches. I’m a big fan of pointing out that just because new methods or information becomes widespread doesn’t suddenly negate older methods and their ability to produce results.

Many an old school bodybuilder built excellent physiques with the bulk/cut/bulk/cut approach. Of course over the years as “gym science” and “lab science” started intermingling, certain biological truths became as common a gym rat discussion as best methods to remove hair, or how to make protein pancakes. Now Im far from suggesting that you should only believe something if you read it on pubmed, but, I am saying that you’d be foolish to ignore methods that are not only supported by science, but utilized by the vast majority of top competitors.

The longer I competed, and the more people I interacted with, the more I realized that many of the approaches I decided to bank on myself were also used by so many of the top Wnbf Pros that I had and still do respect and look up to.

Maybe it’s because I read too much when I first started training, but it was mind blowing to find out that “expert advice” I had been repeating myself to anyone willing to listen, wasn’t all it was cracked up to be. My buddy Brad always laughs when I joke about how bodybuilding “ain’t rocket science.” It’s not, but there are also a few basic premises that you can count on, no matter who you are.

Lonnie Lowery was one of the guys I used to print out his articles way back when. I still respect the guy. That doesn’t mean that I will always agree with him, or Sloh, or anyone else on here. When I did well in many successive contests, I reluctantly had to acknowledge that maybe I kind of understood how “all of this” works. When people started coming to me to prep them for contests, or professional athletes coming to me to help them hit certain weights or recompose their bodies, I also was somewhat reluctant, because who the hell was I? But having done as well as I have, and having had so many clients do well in their own endeavors, I can’t really doubt that what I believe works. Again, that doesn’t mean it’s the only answer, merely that I’m doing right by making the recommendations that I routinely do.

[quote]If I could be indulged in one more, probably silly question. it’s really less a question and more just getting your opinion:

Considering that I’m now 155 pounds and pretty pathetically weak (it is incredible how much mass the body can lose with bedrest combined with an inability to eat over a prolonged period), is it even realistic to think that I can get to a point where competing is possible two years ahead? I know it seems arbitrary, but I’d always set 30 as my goal age to compete (turning 28 this year).[/quote]

Strength is a relative thing. I was strangely very strong with very little time under the bar. Size, however, took much more time, and controlling of a lot more variables. I’ll tell ya though, there are plenty of not-impressively-strong competitors and no one would ever suspect. To me, “perceived resistance” is much more important than actual resistance. What that means is that while the iron on the bar may not seem all the impressive to onlookers, if it’s enough to seriously tax your muscles optimally, and your diet is spot on, sleep locked down, and all else being equal, you’re gonna do just fine.

I made more progress over the few years I competed than at any other time in my life. And lemme tell ya, a solid, 100% muscle gain of 2-3 lbs can make a huge impact when you’re in contest shape!

S

If I may add a bit onto the question of why so many reputable sources seem to offer “conflicting” advice:

I think if I’ve learned anything in the last 10 years of doing this myself, helping others, and being in the community… Its that basically EVERYTHING “works” to some degree or another. So much of the stuff you hear people discuss is about the last 5-10%, if that even.

When I say “everything works” obviously I dont mean PB&J’s with chocolate milk is a great contest diet or that 1 set of 1 rep is going to get you strong and shredded, but I think we all know that if you “eat right” and “exercise hard” on any reputable program results are almost guaranteed long term. If you want to get contest shredded you obviously need to put in more work figuring this stuff out for yourself (Although really it almost is as simple as Eat Less, Move More there too)

I’ve dieted and bulked on a number of different macros and training programs… Keto, High Carb, pound-a-week weight gain, slow-and-stead weight gain, High Frequency training, High Volume, HIT training… And honestly they all work about the same as long as you are “following the rules” (again, push yourself in the gym and eat the amount of calories in line with your goals from healthy food). None of them magically opened new doors for me or skyrocketed fat loss, muscle growth, or strength gains. Just work your ass off and eat right for a long time and you’ll eventually get to wherever it is you are suppose to be.

tl:dr Hard Work and consistency is the common factor in all of the programs.

[quote]Lonnie123 wrote:
If I may add a bit onto the question of why so many reputable sources seem to offer “conflicting” advice:

I think if I’ve learned anything in the last 10 years of doing this myself, helping others, and being in the community… Its that basically EVERYTHING “works” to some degree or another. So much of the stuff you hear people discuss is about the last 5-10%, if that even.

When I say “everything works” obviously I dont mean PB&J’s with chocolate milk is a great contest diet or that 1 set of 1 rep is going to get you strong and shredded, but I think we all know that if you “eat right” and “exercise hard” on any reputable program results are almost guaranteed long term. If you want to get contest shredded you obviously need to put in more work figuring this stuff out for yourself (Although really it almost is as simple as Eat Less, Move More there too)

I’ve dieted and bulked on a number of different macros and training programs… Keto, High Carb, pound-a-week weight gain, slow-and-stead weight gain, High Frequency training, High Volume, HIT training… And honestly they all work about the same as long as you are “following the rules” (again, push yourself in the gym and eat the amount of calories in line with your goals from healthy food). None of them magically opened new doors for me or skyrocketed fat loss, muscle growth, or strength gains. Just work your ass off and eat right for a long time and you’ll eventually get to wherever it is you are suppose to be.

tl:dr Hard Work and consistency is the common factor in all of the programs.[/quote]

Spot on post.

So I recently found out that a good number of students at the school I teach at have been watching the few videos I’ve thrown up on youtube over the years. This prompted me to check my channel, something I haven’t really thought much about since I originally put a few clips up just to share (I’m certainly not trying to make a living knocking out countless of videos on every silly little thing even remotely related to fitness).

Well, earlier today, thinking about how you can now have a bit of a preview video of your channel, I quickly put together short clips from various contest and training videos I had on my laptop. Not too shabby if I do say so myself -lol :slight_smile:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UQtn0JPX5FA

S

Hey Stu, what’s your e-mail? Starting August and up until late November last year I had quite a few muscle strains (started crossfit and playing soccer) that didn’t let me train properly. My last injury was a right hamstring strain (4th or 5th time I strained it since August).

I have avoided most training since then because I just wanted to recover my muscles and get them fit for any type of movement (I ALWAYS strain a muscle when I try and sprint, I used to have an 11.9 100 meter run in high school without training and I think that that explosiveness might be a risk factor in my injuries).

I feel like I will be able to train pretty hard within 2-4 weeks so I’m ready to start doing everything I can to get myself prepared to start training really fucking hard. I pretty much just want to look great and have extremely efficient muscles (think soccer for cardio and football for power). So I basically want to be a good looking athlete lol.

Anyways I was thinking of hiring you or doing a thread here in the bodybuilding forum, which has been dead for a while, and doing everything in one of those ways in order to motivate myself. I just need some guidance and to bounce some things off of you, as well as to get your advice.

Stu,

I have a diet question for you. I am a type 1 diabetic, so anything over 100 carbs a day are a real challenge. I’m trying to cut weight (I am in the 20% - 25%, methinks).

My challenge is balancing fats and carbs while not over-eating protein. Too much protein leads to gluconeogenesis (which obviously raises the blood sugar) because surplus protein (beyond what the body needs) gets turned into glucose by the liver. If I am too high in fats, it makes it hard to lose weight (it is hard for ME to lose weight on a high fat diet), but that leaves carbs which mess with my blood sugars and impact my health.

So I’m trying to find some sort of balance and could use some guidance on what to aim for. What is too high fat? What is too high protein? In a perfect world I’d keep both carbs and fats under 100 grams a day, and proteins under 200, but I’m afraid there is a bit too much of a calory deficit there.

I’m 5’9", 213 pounds, lift 4 x a week (just switched to a 531 routine) - which has jump roping, farmers walks and boxing after lifting, plus two days of HIIT a week. I’m guessing that 2.5k kcals is where to start for cutting, and I’m not looking for a diet plan from you.

Just some help figuring out what target macros should be, or at least how to deal with the “need more calories, but less protein, fat and carb” issue :slight_smile:

–Me

Stu,

This may have been addressed above, but I have two related questions:

Have you coached someone for a physique competition? How would you say that training and prepping for a physique competition differs from a bodybuilding competition?

[quote]kravi wrote:
Stu,

I have a diet question for you. I am a type 1 diabetic, so anything over 100 carbs a day are a real challenge. I’m trying to cut weight (I am in the 20% - 25%, methinks).

My challenge is balancing fats and carbs while not over-eating protein. Too much protein leads to gluconeogenesis (which obviously raises the blood sugar) because surplus protein (beyond what the body needs) gets turned into glucose by the liver. If I am too high in fats, it makes it hard to lose weight (it is hard for ME to lose weight on a high fat diet), but that leaves carbs which mess with my blood sugars and impact my health.

So I’m trying to find some sort of balance and could use some guidance on what to aim for. What is too high fat? What is too high protein? In a perfect world I’d keep both carbs and fats under 100 grams a day, and proteins under 200, but I’m afraid there is a bit too much of a calory deficit there.

I’m 5’9", 213 pounds, lift 4 x a week (just switched to a 531 routine) - which has jump roping, farmers walks and boxing after lifting, plus two days of HIIT a week. I’m guessing that 2.5k kcals is where to start for cutting, and I’m not looking for a diet plan from you.

Just some help figuring out what target macros should be, or at least how to deal with the “need more calories, but less protein, fat and carb” issue :slight_smile:

–Me[/quote]

Not Stu obviously, but…

  1. Have you and/or your endocrinologist considered whether you might have developed insulin resistance; ie, so-called ‘type 3’ diabetes?

  2. Consider talking to your endo about adding metformin to your regimen. While off-label in type I DM, in select pts it has been shown to promote weight loss.

[quote]EyeDentist wrote:

[quote]kravi wrote:
Stu,

I have a diet question for you. I am a type 1 diabetic, so anything over 100 carbs a day are a real challenge. I’m trying to cut weight (I am in the 20% - 25%, methinks).

My challenge is balancing fats and carbs while not over-eating protein. Too much protein leads to gluconeogenesis (which obviously raises the blood sugar) because surplus protein (beyond what the body needs) gets turned into glucose by the liver. If I am too high in fats, it makes it hard to lose weight (it is hard for ME to lose weight on a high fat diet), but that leaves carbs which mess with my blood sugars and impact my health.

So I’m trying to find some sort of balance and could use some guidance on what to aim for. What is too high fat? What is too high protein? In a perfect world I’d keep both carbs and fats under 100 grams a day, and proteins under 200, but I’m afraid there is a bit too much of a calory deficit there.

I’m 5’9", 213 pounds, lift 4 x a week (just switched to a 531 routine) - which has jump roping, farmers walks and boxing after lifting, plus two days of HIIT a week. I’m guessing that 2.5k kcals is where to start for cutting, and I’m not looking for a diet plan from you.

Just some help figuring out what target macros should be, or at least how to deal with the “need more calories, but less protein, fat and carb” issue :slight_smile:

–Me[/quote]

Not Stu obviously, but…

  1. Have you and/or your endocrinologist considered whether you might have developed insulin resistance; ie, so-called ‘type 3’ diabetes?

  2. Consider talking to your endo about adding metformin to your regimen. While off-label in type I DM, in select pts it has been shown to promote weight loss.
    [/quote]

Fair questions. I am type 1, so my body does not produce any insulin. I take novolog and levemir as my two insulin types. Due to regular exercise and careful control of carbs, I know for a fact that I have not developed insulin resistance. My HbA1C is 5.1 due to me being a bit neurotic about my health :wink:

My real question (for anyone who can share, not just Stu) is how do I meet my calorie requirements (ie not eat too little) while minimizing carbs and fat. What is the minimal acceptable balance.

Today, so far, I am 500 calories short, but am already at 62 grams of carbs, 93 grams of fat, and 205 grams of protein. I want to lose weight, but without sacrificing both the muscle I’ve earned nor my health. How would I get the next 500 calories without eating too much fat or carbs? Just eat more protein? At what point does the protein become carbs because I just don’t need it?

–Me

EDIT: Edited for updating numbers and clarity.

[quote]myself1992 wrote:
Hey Stu, what’s your e-mail? Starting August and up until late November last year I had quite a few muscle strains (started crossfit and playing soccer) that didn’t let me train properly. My last injury was a right hamstring strain (4th or 5th time I strained it since August).

I have avoided most training since then because I just wanted to recover my muscles and get them fit for any type of movement (I ALWAYS strain a muscle when I try and sprint, I used to have an 11.9 100 meter run in high school without training and I think that that explosiveness might be a risk factor in my injuries).

I feel like I will be able to train pretty hard within 2-4 weeks so I’m ready to start doing everything I can to get myself prepared to start training really fucking hard. I pretty much just want to look great and have extremely efficient muscles (think soccer for cardio and football for power). So I basically want to be a good looking athlete lol.

Anyways I was thinking of hiring you or doing a thread here in the bodybuilding forum, which has been dead for a while, and doing everything in one of those ways in order to motivate myself. I just need some guidance and to bounce some things off of you, as well as to get your advice.[/quote]

Okay, a few question/replies here, so I’ll try to get through 'em all as I’m able (some days I have a bit more time to answer stuff then others).

First, I know in the past I’ve seen the forum mods remove people’s emails so posts, so I’ll just point out that there’s a “contact” link on my personal web site, which is VERY EASY to find. Feel free to hit me up there if you want to discuss things that you’d rather not have in a public forum, or even if you just want to inquire about working together.

Believe me when I tell you that there are plenty of gym rats who seem to hurt themselves a lot. This can be from overuse, poorly designed programs that don’t allow for proper warm ups or any sense of slow and intelligent progression, or sometimes even just an individual’s natural balances/imbalances in terms of strength and flexibility. Obviously I’m just throwing out a few generalities here.

I’ve had a good number of athletes approach me about how they look. I remember a line I used in one of my seminars about how performance athletes (compared to what I call asthetic athletes) and their coaches shouldn’t care about how they look, unless it’s somehow affecting their performance, but to be honest, we’re all human, and despite what some people may publicly say, no one wants to be embarassed about how they look.

A couple of years ago I had an NFL Defensive Lineman contact me to help him with his diet. He confided that despite needing to keep his playing weight within a certain range, he didn’t feel good taking his shirt off. Luckily he was willing to shift his views on nutrition’s role in the big picture and pay careful attention during many of our hour long phone conferences. Long story short, we were able to maintain his weight (~290 lb) yet totally recompose his lean muscle to fat ratio, giving this world class athlete a much better sense of confidence in the process.

So while I can’t say for certain “you need to do…”, I can always listen, see if I’ve got a suggestion or answer, or if need be simply suggest others with much more medical related credentials (despite so many injury questions I get at the gym, I’m not a doctor -lol).

S

[quote]MinusTheColon wrote:
Stu,

This may have been addressed above, but I have two related questions:

Have you coached someone for a physique competition? How would you say that training and prepping for a physique competition differs from a bodybuilding competition?[/quote]

Yes, I actually have! I may joke about the MPD guys I see at Bev’s walking around with “IFBB Pro” printed on everything they own, but honestly, the Physique division is simply training with a different end goal (physical proportions) in mind.

I recently worked with one young man (21 I believe) for his first show, and the very first thing we did - as I always do - is to take a solid look at his current plan, and see if he’s training his body in a way that addresses difficult as well as easy to grow bodyparts properly to come as close as possible to that ideal look.

Diet wise, despite what some people say, you still need to be damn lean. Of course being lean at the expense of muscle and symmetry isn’t going to win you a contest, no matter what division you enter!

The posing was a huge difference though. This is where some guys who first start training wanting to be bodybuilders feel a little let down. You don’t get as many, or even as cool poses in Physique. If you’ve ever watched the women’s Figure classes, Men’s Physique is more like that. You get your Quarter Turns, and if you’re comfortable, you learn a few hip shifts to not only prevenmt cramping, boredom, and just bring a little attention to yourself (hopefully!) from the judging panel.

You really have the same “tools” though whether you do bodybulding or physique:
-Training
-Diet + Supplementation
-Posing and Stage Presence

If you’re smart, and willing to do the work (suffer a bit of discomfort?), definitely pick the division that best fits your physique - At least for the time being :slight_smile:

S

Kravi,

If I could gather a bit of info from you I think Stu may be able to help you out a bit easier:

  • According to your posted numbers, you are eating 1905 calories a day. Are you currently losing weight? If so, for how long and at what rate per week?

  • How did you arrive at that 2500 calorie numbers that puts you at “500 calories short” ? You want to be “short” if your goal is fat loss… So this might not be a terrible thing.

  • Why are you so afraid of manipulating your fat intake? This is like the only variable available to you, and for diabetics fat intake is really not that big of an issue if its a couple dozen grams higher or lower than it currently is.

  • Do you NEEEEDDD to keep your carbs at under 100 a day according to your endo, Or is this something you have decided on your own? If so, how did you arrive at this number? I work with type 1 diabetics (I’m an RN) and this seems particularly low unless a low carb diet is specifically part of your individual treatment plan and cannot be manipulated.

Lets start there.

[quote]Lonnie123 wrote:
Kravi,

If I could gather a bit of info from you I think Stu may be able to help you out a bit easier:

  • According to your posted numbers, you are eating 1905 calories a day. Are you currently losing weight? If so, for how long and at what rate per week?

  • How did you arrive at that 2500 calorie numbers that puts you at “500 calories short” ? You want to be “short” if your goal is fat loss… So this might not be a terrible thing.

  • Why are you so afraid of manipulating your fat intake? This is like the only variable available to you, and for diabetics fat intake is really not that big of an issue if its a couple dozen grams higher or lower than it currently is.

  • Do you NEEEEDDD to keep your carbs at under 100 a day according to your endo, Or is this something you have decided on your own? If so, how did you arrive at this number? I work with type 1 diabetics (I’m an RN) and this seems particularly low unless a low carb diet is specifically part of your individual treatment plan and cannot be manipulated.

Lets start there.[/quote]

Lonnie,

Thanks for the thoughtful (and curious post). I’d be delighted to share what I can!

Good math on the numbers. I am eating (for the past week) 2,500 calories a day because it seemed like a good place to start. I’m not entering a competition, just wanted to stop being a fatass (should that be one word or two). I figured that by starting at 2,500 and keeping it for 2 weeks I could evaluate and adjust from there. When I posted yesterday the day wasn’t over and I was at about 2,000 calories (I plugged the hole with peanut butter at the end of the day). I’ve only been at 2,500 for a week and have lost 1.4 lbs. So it seems like it is ok for now.

BTW, I mean that the 2500 calories a day is possibly 500 short of 3k which I’m guessing is my daily burn rate. That is what I’m testing. If I’m optimistic about how much I’m burning per day I can always adjust down later. I figured better to start high and lower calories than start too low. Maybe I’m wrong.

I’m not afraid of fat, nor am I afraid of saturated fat. At all. But… And this may be in my head. I got my genome tested (mostly for ancestry purposes) and fed it through promethease to get the medical evaluation. I have SNP Gs285 which, apparently, means I do better on low fat diets for weight loss. Sadly, I have not yet found the actual research studies (nor analyzed them yet) so it may all be crap. But a summary is here: These 5 Genes Predict What Kind of Diet and Exercise is Best For Your Body (I apparently do best with HIIT and low fat diets). This may all be crap, btw.

As for your last question, I’m afraid that you hit a bit of a hot button with me. /startrant I am lucky enough to have a brilliant and reasonably endocrinologist who let’s me do things my way, and gives her blessing. How many Type 1 diabetics do you know with an HbA1C of 5.1? I’m in the non-diabetic range, and my blood sugar numbers are not lowered by frequent bouts of being sugar low, either.

All type 1 diabetics (and type 2, for that matter - though different reasons) should be on low carb diets. For type 1 diabetics, the less insulin you need (because of low carb) the less sugar spikes and lows you will get. IE 3 units of novolog/humalog can only lower it so much, and if you are not eating alot of carbs, you can only raise it so much. The “conventional wisdom” of giving type 1 diabetics high carb diets was from back in the old days when we couldn’t test blood sugars, so better to be sugar high than die (or go into a coma) from a sugar low. That is old and outdated, and bad medicine. /endrant.

Regardless, my plan is encouraged by my endocrinologists, the results for the past 3 years speak for themselves, and I dare you to find another type 1 diabetic in great control of their blood sugars who is not on a low-carb diet. :slight_smile:

Normally I keep my carbs to ~50 a day, btw. I’m allowing myself to balloon carb intake to 100 grams a day for the sake of dropping weight, not because it is ideal for my health. Granted, if I can lose weight with higher fats and lower carbs, I’ll do that instead. I just don’t want to lose strength, and the gene test (and its unproven science) scared me into upping carbs a bit so I could lower fats.

–Me

Lonnie- here’s a question you might have a better background to answer than I do in discussing Kravi’s questions:

We all know that excess protein can eventually be broken down and used to create sugars (carbs), but in such cases, do we see a lesser, if at all, insulin release than if straight carbs were ingested via food sources?

KRAVI- You’re right to guess higher in regard to cal intake to start with. It’s always easier to take small steps downward as you observe reactions. Speaking of reactions, I know you feel that you do better on low fat diets, but I’ve seen many people who have had to take different approaches to cutting up at different points in their lives. Sure, there are plenty of factors, but in the case of intelligently adding a bit more healthy fats to your daily intake, especially if you spread them out, it can not only add a nice healthy benefit, but it will be much easier to fit in the extra 500 cals you’re looking for than if you tried to wedge in more proteins or carbs.

I’m sure you’re finding that there’s always going to be a ton of info out there that doesn’t always line up. I think the best anyone can do is to take everything into consideration, and pay attention to how approaches pan out on an individual basis. Obviously talking to people like Lonnie (RN), or even Brick on here (RD) will always get you opinions that reflect not just a medical background, but an understanding of what any health and physique conscious person would want or need.

S

To my knowledge, there is little to no evidence supporting the notion that gluconeogenesis rates are driven to a significant extent by the amount of available substrate (ie, protein/amino acids). Protein-rich/carb-poor meals prompt glucagon release, which in turn causes the liver to release stored glycogen into the circulation. It is this release of glycogen that causes elevation of BG after a protein meal, not gluconeogenesis.

See, eg, “The relationship between gluconeogenic substrate supply and glucose production in humans”

http://ajpendo.physiology.org/content/258/2/E288.short

Edited to include the research-paper info

[quote]EyeDentist wrote:
To my knowledge, there is little to no evidence supporting the notion that gluconeogenesis rates are driven to a significant extent by the amount of available substrate (ie, protein/amino acids). Protein-rich/carb-poor meals prompt glucagon release, which in turn causes the liver to release stored glycogen into the circulation. It is this release of glycogen that causes elevation of BG after a protein meal, not gluconeogenesis.

See, eg, “The relationship between gluconeogenic substrate supply and glucose production in humans”

http://ajpendo.physiology.org/content/258/2/E288.short

Edited to include the research-paper info[/quote]

Bah, you are quite right. I somehow crossed wires in my brain. But I do see what happens to my blood sugar when I cross the magic threshold of “enough protein” to “more than enough protein” :slight_smile: The end result is the same!

–Me