I don’t see any point in doing dumbbell presses unless you’re doing them light to stretch and pump some blood into the pecs.
The whole idea of them is to promote recovery and build the work capacity of the muscle in question. They’re not there to build strength. Let all the compeition lifts you’re doing take care of that.
To be honest I don’t think you should have the energy to do heavy dumbbell presses in addition to everything else!
[quote]Hanley wrote:
I don’t see any point in doing dumbbell presses unless you’re doing them light to stretch and pump some blood into the pecs.
The whole idea of them is to promote recovery and build the work capacity of the muscle in question. They’re not there to build strength. Let all the compeition lifts you’re doing take care of that.
To be honest I don’t think you should have the energy to do heavy dumbbell presses in addition to everything else![/quote]
Awesome, I defenetly get what you are saying and appreciate the help. I love the stretch I’ve been getting out of my flies after my bench. Thanks for commenting on my log again.
MDM
Week 1 Day 2
Deadlift 165 1x4 195 1x4 225 2x3 260 5x3
Bench press 110 1x6 135 1x5 150 2x4 160 2x3 175 2x2 160 2x3 150 1x4 140 1x6 135 1x8 110 1x10
Db Flies 5x10
Deadlift till knees 162.5 1x4 195 1x4 225 5x4
Goodmorning 5x5
Weighted Sit Ups 3 x10
Supersetted with Hanging Leg Raises
The lat work I am goign to work in after my Big Bench Days (Monday and Wednesday) just to be on the safe side so i have enough rest before them.
I got a quick question:
Whats the opinion on belts? My max is only 325 for Deadlifts and 275 for Squats but when should I know if I need one or not or will “I KNOW”…
I have straps used to use them way back when but now I like to get my grip going, and as for a belt I ask because my brothers wedding comming up and he can’t find me ANYTHING to buy as his best man… I dont’ drink so noooo flask and all the other gifts he was thinking about just weren’t working out he felt…
SO i was looking at EliteFTS and maybe he could hookkkk it up with a nice training belt. I’m not selfish I promise my dad is all about me getting something out of him.
Yea its defently a different situation.
OH and as far as the progressive goes Im going step by step to plan it out… and i realized it will be based off of the 3 compound lifts guaranteeeeeddddd and most likey squat and bench on same day just like the sheiko… but I will post a little every day to tell you how that is going
MDM
Week 1 Day 3
Bench press (Very Wide Grip) 110 1x5 135 1x4 150 2x3 175 5x3
Squat 140 1x5 165 1x4 195 2x3 225 5x3
Bench press (Pink on Ring (which is kind of close grip to me)) 115 1x5 140 1x4 160 5x3
Db Flies 5x10
Lat Pulldown 60 1 x10 90 1x10 120 1x10 150 1x5 120 1x10
Rows 3x10
Side Bends(DB) 25 x 1x10 45 1 x 10 50 2 x 10
Side Raises 3x8
Summary: My squats… were very odd… I was struggling with the first two sets of 220 then the they progressively got easier and the last one I blew threw. I entered this 1lb hamburger eating contest (with fries) at Fudruckers between my co-workers and I.
They didtn’ wnat to do timed but I would have one if it was timed I ate it in about 15 min (everything). I feel like since I’ve started Sheiko I just want to eat. and eat. and eat.
dude, how the heck do you put 161.3 on the bar?
Are you using plate mates or something?
[quote]mattwray wrote:
dude, how the heck do you put 161.3 on the bar?
Are you using plate mates or something?[/quote]
I just cut and copied these numbers and was rounding them to what I actually put on the bar… My bad again those were 160…
I’ll stop unrounding immediately because it makes me look a litttttle weird
Thanks for pointing it out
ohhhhh, hahahaah. I was like, what the fuck!
Little piece of advice, go up to the next 5, IE 165.
Friends don’t let friends use the 2 1/2’s.
[quote]mattwray wrote:
Friends don’t let friends use the 2 1/2’s.
[/quote]
That is one of the best things I’ve ever heard on T-Nation
Deadlift standing on boxes 165 2x3 195 4x2
Incline press
105 x 4
135 x 4
145 x 4
155 x 4
165 x 4
185 x 4 PR I haven’t tried that on flatbench before
Dips 5x6
Deadlift off boxes 195 1x4 225 2x4 260 2x3 295 4x2
Seated goodmorning 5x5 I don’t know how to do properly do it sitting so I did them standing up
my grip actually held up for the 295 I was very surprised
Are you saying that youve never flat benched 185x4 but you did it on incline??
As for the dumbell presses…I would lean towards not doing them as an assistance movement, considering you are benching 3x/week. If anything, Id throw them in as your bench movement once every week or two with some higher reps (around 8) to change things up and give your CNS a break.
Whatever program you are on…if you are getting stronger with it…then what’s the problem??
[quote0
As for the dumbell presses…I would lean towards not doing them as an assistance movement, considering you are benching 3x/week. If anything, Id throw them in as your bench movement once every week or two with some higher reps (around 8) to change things up and give your CNS a break.
[/quote]
I’d caution against this. Sheiko’s plans are written the way they are for a very specific reason. If deloading after 2 weeks was required you could be sure Boris would have wrote it so!
Once you’re not straining on the dumbbell presses I wouldn’t worry. I still think flys are the way to go tho.
Oh and RE: Week 1, Day 3 - Squats… It’s amazing how you get a second wind mid way thru the heavy sets isn’t it??? I was absolutey shocked when it started to happen to me and I remember writing about it!!
Keep up the good work.
[quote]BigD777 wrote:
Are you saying that youve never flat benched 185x4 but you did it on incline??
As for the dumbell presses…I would lean towards not doing them as an assistance movement, considering you are benching 3x/week. If anything, Id throw them in as your bench movement once every week or two with some higher reps (around 8) to change things up and give your CNS a break.
Whatever program you are on…if you are getting stronger with it…then what’s the problem??[/quote]
Nah… I’ve never TRIED to bench the flat but I would hope now that I could… or at least if AC Slater was there rooting me on. I’m trying to get as strong as possible so that I can catch up to this friend I know that really needs to get back into his training… eh hem to become more like mariuz
we’ll get you on a deadlift session when you come back
[quote]Hanley wrote:
[quote0
As for the dumbell presses…I would lean towards not doing them as an assistance movement, considering you are benching 3x/week. If anything, Id throw them in as your bench movement once every week or two with some higher reps (around 8) to change things up and give your CNS a break.
I’d caution against this. Sheiko’s plans are written the way they are for a very specific reason. If deloading after 2 weeks was required you could be sure Boris would have wrote it so!
Once you’re not straining on the dumbbell presses I wouldn’t worry. I still think flys are the way to go tho.
Oh and RE: Week 1, Day 3 - Squats… It’s amazing how you get a second wind mid way thru the heavy sets isn’t it??? I was absolutey shocked when it started to happen to me and I remember writing about it!!
Keep up the good work.[/quote]
Dude it is nuts, those rush of winds I’m not sure where they’re comming from…
I had some questions for you…
You replaced rack pulls with sumos and it worked out? (I’m not a big fan of them when I was doing them today and would rather just probably pull off the ground)
Did you sleep like crazy when you were doing your sheiko?
Don’t be too swift to squash anything that Boris did not mention. He also does not advocate any rowing/pulling movements or rotator cuff work, which would certainly be a mistake to leave out in the long run.
While I do like the ideas of the Sheiko programs basic heavy approach to lifting, I would certainly hesitate to prescribe them for extended periods for fear of imbalances.
In MDMs case, he has gained loads of strength in 2-3 cycles of Sheiko, particularly almost 50lbs on his bench alone. I have to ask the question whether he has even added 30lbs to his rowing strength in this short time span to accompany these gains.
My first and greatest concern with this would surely be shoulder health, but even beyond that one obviously cannot downplay the importance of lat strength in benching.
With the rack pulls being replaced by sumos…
I basically did this to be able to pull sumo more often since I was only getting into it. Actually what happened was I sumo 2x on the deadlift day, and then one of the other days had deadlifts standing on boxes (Which I just used for more regular sumo work) and eneded up dropping the rack pulls altogether. Since it was the MS/CMS cycle the workload was just too high.
It actually all worked out extremely well. I reckon I put (a conservative) 30kg onto my raw sumo pull over the time. I did 170 I think for a very hard and ugly set of 6 earlier in the year and pulled a really good set of 200kgx5 last night.
When I re-run the cycle now this time I’ll be concentrating on top end strength alot more since that’s wheere I’m starting to miss lifts when I get into my suit. I’ll probably do rack pulls 2x a week and sumos from the floor 2x and ditch the pulls standing on boxes altogether.
Bench press 110 1x5 135 1x4 150 2x3 175 3x3 185 3x2
Squat 135 1x5 165 1x4 195 2x3 225 5x3
Bench press 115 1x4 135 2x4 165 4x4
Db Flies 5x10 (30lb)
Bent Over Barbell Rows
65x10
85x10
95x10
105x10
115x10
135x6
Russian Twists
3x8
Roman Chair Twists
3x8
The squat was a big deal today, I got to 225 and wasn’t feeling into it but got back into the right attitude before I unracked the weight. The Previous sets of weight I used a close stance squat and then decided I couldn’t get as much power so I would switch to wide… My legs felt a massive pump. Soooo the 1st set of 225 was ok the 2nd was alright the 3rd… my legs started to buckle in along with the 4th the 5th i had someone spot me and ended up getting 4 without any problem what so ever no buckle or anything. I feel like I’m having a problem firing my muscles in my legs does anyone have any recomendations for this?
MDM
To be honest, only you know whether this is a mental thing or more of a fatigue/burnt out feeling.
I wont say much about the mental thing, but obviously you are going to be required to get a little fired up for your heaviest sets each workout along with a great deal of focus. You cannot just go through the motions with heavy lifting. I mean no disrespect because I know that you know this, but I also know how hard it is to maintain this high of intensity this many times each week.
Hopefully this isn’t the case, but you could be getting burnt out a bit. Anyone that has lifted for any length of time will tell you that squatting AND deadlifting twice a week is an extremely taxing endeavor, and you are into your 3rd consecutive cycle of this. Unfortunately, I would not be surprised if this were the case but again only you know how you feel and can determine this.
I’m not saying Sheiko is a bad program or too much, but I would have to raise the question of whether 3 consecutive cycles of sheiko is too much??
[quote]BigD777 wrote:
To be honest, only you know whether this is a mental thing or more of a fatigue/burnt out feeling.
I wont say much about the mental thing, but obviously you are going to be required to get a little fired up for your heaviest sets each workout along with a great deal of focus. You cannot just go through the motions with heavy lifting. I mean no disrespect because I know that you know this, but I also know how hard it is to maintain this high of intensity this many times each week.
Hopefully this isn’t the case, but you could be getting burnt out a bit. Anyone that has lifted for any length of time will tell you that squatting AND deadlifting twice a week is an extremely taxing endeavor, and you are into your 3rd consecutive cycle of this. Unfortunately, I would not be surprised if this were the case but again only you know how you feel and can determine this.
I’m not saying Sheiko is a bad program or too much, but I would have to raise the question of whether 3 consecutive cycles of sheiko is too much??
[/quote]
This is a good post.
Now I don’t think 3 Sheiko programs is too much, but it would be individual and depend on other factors such as are you using the proper weight (ie. based on a true raw max), life stressors, nutrition and recovery ability.
I am currently on my second Sheiko cycle and I will have a week off (vacation) before I complete two more cycles.
Regarding getting yourself fired up, I think you have to be careful with this. If you try to get fired up for every set you will burn yourself out.
There is a difference between firing yourself up and staying motivated. Usually you can only fire yourself up for maybe 10-15 minutes, staying motivated would be a more subdued state that can last throughout the session.
[quote]Ruggerlife wrote:
BigD777 wrote:
To be honest, only you know whether this is a mental thing or more of a fatigue/burnt out feeling.
I wont say much about the mental thing, but obviously you are going to be required to get a little fired up for your heaviest sets each workout along with a great deal of focus. You cannot just go through the motions with heavy lifting. I mean no disrespect because I know that you know this, but I also know how hard it is to maintain this high of intensity this many times each week.
Hopefully this isn’t the case, but you could be getting burnt out a bit. Anyone that has lifted for any length of time will tell you that squatting AND deadlifting twice a week is an extremely taxing endeavor, and you are into your 3rd consecutive cycle of this. Unfortunately, I would not be surprised if this were the case but again only you know how you feel and can determine this.
I’m not saying Sheiko is a bad program or too much, but I would have to raise the question of whether 3 consecutive cycles of sheiko is too much??
This is a good post.
Now I don’t think 3 Sheiko programs is too much, but it would be individual and depend on other factors such as are you using the proper weight (ie. based on a true raw max), life stressors, nutrition and recovery ability.
I am currently on my second Sheiko cycle and I will have a week off (vacation) before I complete two more cycles.
Regarding getting yourself fired up, I think you have to be careful with this. If you try to get fired up for every set you will burn yourself out.
There is a difference between firing yourself up and staying motivated. Usually you can only fire yourself up for maybe 10-15 minutes, staying motivated would be a more subdued state that can last throughout the session.
[/quote]
The fired up thing, it was because it was the last set of the day in squats so i tried to stay fired through the whole thing.
As for if I’m using the proper weight… I tested it raw… no belt or anyone helping me and i lifted 275 below parallel… I’m not sure if you’re referring to using a 3 rep max or 90% of my max or somethign else?
Thanks for the post
MDM
Deadlift standing on boxes 165 1x3 195 2x3 215 4x2
Bench press 110 1x5 125 1x4 155 2x3 175 3x2 165 2x3 155 1x4 135 1x6 110 1x8
Db Flies
2x10 25lbs
3x10 30lbs
Deadlift 165 1x4 195 1x4 225 2x3 260 5x3
Goodmorning 5x5
@95
105
115
(2)125
Side Bends Dumbells
25 x 10
35 x 10
45 x 10
50 x 10(2)
Summary: The goodmornings I went a little light on but kept my form VERrrrryyyy strict… besides that it was smooth sailing didn’t eat anything before I went so I felt a little low on energy.