[quote]shawninjapan wrote:
I think the whole point is that there is nothing wrong with not liking men to wear eyeliner because it is feminine,in this culture, not gay. Just because men don’t like other men to look feminine doesn’t mean they hate fags.
Why does (man wears eyeliner and another man doesn’t like it’ = ‘the second man believes the first wants it in the butt.’
I don’t like the fact that some guys dye their hair green. This makes me uncomfortable. Not because the green haired dude tosses another guy’s salad, but because it is so far from the cultural standard (which tends to exist for good reason) that it just makes me feel like it isn’t right. That doesn’t mean that it is or it isn’t “right,” either. But it also doesn’t mean that I suddenly hate punks, or gays, or guys with hairy backs, or any other social group.
You are the only one that seems completely determined to attach homosexuals to femininity.
[/quote]
Well said.
However, be honest: When the issue of a guy wearing eyeliner comes up, how long does it take before some insinuation of him being gay occurs? How long before the guy wearing it is called a “fag”?
From my observations, it very quickly becomes associated with homosexuality.
Okay, I’ve read the article. I doubt a single person among us hasn’t had a “man crush” according to the definition used by the author. This is his humorous way of discussing admiration for another man. Have you ever admired a man before? If not, then I apologize to you on your father’s behalf.
P.S: This was a hysterical, 2-part episode of Seinfeld called “The Boyfriend.” Check it out.
Wait a second, The guy is saying If I admire another man I have a crush on him? This author looks like he’s trying to come out of the closet yet wants to think everyone is like him.
[quote]CappedAndPlanIt wrote:
Just an answer: Do you agree or disagree that being uncomfortable with guys wearing eyeliner is rooted in homophobia because wearing eyeliner is assoicated with gays?
[/quote]
Well, I can’t answer the question in the way that it is framed because of the fallacy that you created when you framed it.
The fallacy is that wearing eyeliner is associated with gays.
I associate wearing eyeliner with women. Therefore when a man wears eyeliner It does appear odd to me.
So, to your question, I would have to disagree that the discomfort associated with seeing a man wearing eyeliner is rooted in homophobia, and I would disagree that it is associated with gays. I would categorize it as trans-gender.
I would aslo take issue with the use of the word homophobic, as the implication that there is an unreasonable or irrational fear of homosexuals may not be true.
There is not necessarily any fear in anybody on this thread. There could be a disliking for any number of subjective reasons, but not any fear.
Kind of like asparagus. I don’t like asparagus, but I don’t have any fear of it either.
The article was a take-off on the idea of a “girl crush”, which has been popularized the past few years.
From the NY Times, August 2005: “She’s So Cool, So Smart, So Beautiful: Must Be a Girl Crush”
"Ms. Buice, who lives with her boyfriend, calls her attraction a girl crush, a phrase that many women in their 20’s and 30’s use in conversation, post on blogs and read in magazines. It refers to that fervent infatuation that one heterosexual woman develops for another woman who may seem impossibly sophisticated, gifted, beautiful or accomplished. And while a girl crush is, by its informal definition, not sexual in nature, the feelings that it triggers - excitement, nervousness, a sense of novelty - are very much like those that accompany a new romance.
[quote]Professor X wrote:
AlphaDragon wrote:
“Action figures”
“Dolls”
I mean, what’s the difference between them? Nothing. The name given to them seems to define them as appropriate for the target gender.
If you called “action figures” “action dolls,” you’d never sell any.
Yes, action figures and dolls are the same thing…just geared toward different genders.
Was this an epiphany for you? What is your point? That you don’t understand that the function for both genders is different even though they may technically be “dolls”? How many boys do you think play “tea party” or “house” with their GI Joe’s and Transformers? How many people do you think are getting fake shot and blown up in Barbie’s playhouse?
What the fuck is this debate even about? That some of you seem to think that defining male characteristics is now wrong? If that isn’t your argument, then what the fuck is?..and why?
[/quote]
Apparently some people who posted before me didn’t know that dolls and action figures are, simply dolls.
That is the only reason.
Thanks for asking instead of assuming.
[quote]CappedAndPlanIt wrote:
Now, I dont mean this as an attack, at all, just a question: Do you think its possible that your discomfort with the idea of gay sex causes you to be uncomfortable with guys “seeming gay”? I’m not asking this to insinuate that you hate anyone or anything like that.
To be honest, it seems to me like you genuinely dont want to have any issues with gay people, but are still uncomfortable because them being gay naturally brings up the issue of gay sex (the idea of which you find unpleasant).[/quote]
I have no issues with any gay person that I know, I have no problems being around them, they are not some disgusting factor in my life that drives me crazy as it seems like you think they do.
When i think of a gay person i do not respond with disgust because it brings the idea of gay sex to mind.
So in answer to your question, no guys “seeming gay” do not bother me. I however will say yes to the second part of your post, homosexuality makes me uncomfortable. Do i fear it? no. Do it hate it? no. Do i wish homosexuals any restrictions in society or harm? No. I just don’t think about it because it is an uncomfortable thought for me. Nowhere am i lobbying for anything against gay people because of this though, they are free to do as they wish, it does not mean i have to like it.