Im posting this in the conditioning forum as this question has been brought up due to the fact that i want to increase my conditioning work.
Question:
Im a football player and Im about to start pre-season. This year I want to focus on my conditioning and skills. Ive spent the past 5 years lifting decent weight so I feel that I am “strong enough” for my sport. Im 6’1, 97kg and Im guessing Im about 13-16%.
Anyway, I was thinking of drastically decreasing the time I spend in the gym, increase my conditioning and agility, and lose 4-5 kg. Saying all that I still want to maintain my strength.
What program would be best for my goals, westside for skinny bastards or5/3/1 for football or another program?
if i were you i would click on all the superstar footballers and look at their profile, and do what they do year round. modify it to meet your time and goals…bottom line is playing and practicing football.you wanna be the best at that , do that. skills, shooting, everything. cant be a great footballer riding a bike… stay in the gym only long enough to help your football. anymore and you are taking away football time and increasing your lifting time…not hard to figure out. what did george best do? franz beckenbauer? practiced football.
reading all your posts over the last year, it seems like you wanna be like lance on the bike, look like arnold, and play like pele. THAT AINT GONNA HAPPEN.sounds like you are training like a crossfit athlete. trying to be average at a ton of sports/exercises. you have to ask yourself if you wanna be a great or average footballer… then train accordingly…
It’s time for me to get back to basics. I was playing my best football when I was doing the least amount of lifting. Before my T-Nation days I remember doing 5x5 on the bench press/military press after getting home from training. It would only take me 20 minutes max, and I didn’t even consider accessory lifts.
[quote]Chris87 wrote:
I’ve used 5/3/1 to train for my sport for a few years. Here’s a good way to set this up:
Day 1- 5/3/1 lifting + conditioning
Day 2- skill practice
Day 3- 5/3/1 lifting + conditioning
Day 4- skill practice
Obviously take day off as you see fit, just listen to your body.
For the lifting, I would set it up as a full body template using 2 main lifts one week, and the other 2 main lifts the other. [/quote]
What lifts do you use?? What do you use for accessory work?
I’m thinking of using 531 before my team training session, as my team training sessions are not usually that tough, leaving me more time during the week to work on some skills. Considering maybe lifting 3 times a week, for example one single session on a Wednesday just for legs, and 2 upper body lifting before Tuesday’s and Thursday’s team training.
I have just got Wendell’s book on my e reader, and will be reading that over the next few days… hopefully will get a better idea of how it’s meant to work.
For accessory work, I use a template similar to Wendler’s article “the triumvirate” that he wrote for elitefts years ago. Basically it looks like this:
Squat
Hamstrings/lower back
Abs
Bench (chins bt sets)
push exercise
pull exercise
Deadlift
Quad exercise
Abs
Press (chins bt sets)
push exercise
pull exercise
For each of the assitance lifts categories, I just picked the best 3 I could think of (all big compound lifts, like dips, lunges, etc) and I just do whichever I feel like. This way I don’t just stuck or bored using the same exercises every time.
I generally just do 3 sets of 6-12 reps for each assistance movement. I also do hard conditioning work after each session, as well as stretching and plyo stuff before.
When I go inseason, I will just flip flop the assistance work and lift twice a week.
[quote]Chris87 wrote:
I use the basic bech, press, squat, and deadlift.
For accessory work, I use a template similar to Wendler’s article “the triumvirate” that he wrote for elitefts years ago. Basically it looks like this:
Squat
Hamstrings/lower back
Abs
Bench (chins bt sets)
push exercise
pull exercise
Deadlift
Quad exercise
Abs
Press (chins bt sets)
push exercise
pull exercise
For each of the assitance lifts categories, I just picked the best 3 I could think of (all big compound lifts, like dips, lunges, etc) and I just do whichever I feel like. This way I don’t just stuck or bored using the same exercises every time.
I generally just do 3 sets of 6-12 reps for each assistance movement. I also do hard conditioning work after each session, as well as stretching and plyo stuff before.
When I go inseason, I will just flip flop the assistance work and lift twice a week.[/quote]
[quote]Chris87 wrote:
I still use all 4, but just two each week. It looks like this:
week 1
day 1- Squat and bench assistance
day 2- Bench and squat assistance
week 2
day 1- Deadlift and Press assistance
day 2- Press and deadlift assistance
I should note that I only do the minimum reps inseason[/quote]
Do you find that only doing a movement once every 2 weeks impedes on your ability to progress? Do you still follow the 531 progression method, but in 2 week cycles? Also does only doing a movement once every 2 weeks have an effect on your ability to practice/keep good technique??
Im thinking of maybe doing it all in cycles, for example do bench press and squat for 6-8 weeks, and change to deadlifting and overhead pressing for a 6-8 weeks.
I’ll tell you what I’ve started doing, and am having amazing success. So, I did 5 years in the Marine Corps, and now that I’m out, I am focusing on getting my 3 mile time down.
My goals is to become a Commissioned Officer in the Marine Corps. Now, I love lifting heavy, and (use) to hate cardio. Heres what I do, and am having great success:
Monday: LSD 4-6 miles. Strong Lifts 5x5
Tuesday: 2 Mile Jog, Hill Sprints, 2 Mile Jog
Weds: 3 Mile timed. Strong Lifts 5x5
Thurs: 3 or 4 mile run
Fri: 3 Mile Timed. Strong Lifts 5x5
Sat: LSD
I am someone who HATES cardio, or did at least. Now I LOVE running. Ran 22:00 flat 3 mile today, which is a big improvement for me, seem the fact how I just got back into running. My rest times between lifting sets is 50-60 seconds. Starting with a run, then lifting, I keep my heart rate very high throughout my workout. Usually takes me about an hour. A bit longer on LSD days.
Again, most goals focus is Conditioning first, heavy lifts are secondary.
[quote]kidRiot wrote:
I’ll tell you what I’ve started doing, and am having amazing success. So, I did 5 years in the Marine Corps, and now that I’m out, I am focusing on getting my 3 mile time down.
My goals is to become a Commissioned Officer in the Marine Corps. Now, I love lifting heavy, and (use) to hate cardio. Heres what I do, and am having great success:
Monday: LSD 4-6 miles. Strong Lifts 5x5
Tuesday: 2 Mile Jog, Hill Sprints, 2 Mile Jog
Weds: 3 Mile timed. Strong Lifts 5x5
Thurs: 3 or 4 mile run
Fri: 3 Mile Timed. Strong Lifts 5x5
Sat: LSD
I am someone who HATES cardio, or did at least. Now I LOVE running. Ran 22:00 flat 3 mile today, which is a big improvement for me, seem the fact how I just got back into running. My rest times between lifting sets is 50-60 seconds. Starting with a run, then lifting, I keep my heart rate very high throughout my workout. Usually takes me about an hour. A bit longer on LSD days.
Again, most goals focus is Conditioning first, heavy lifts are secondary.[/quote]
Thanks for your input.
What is LSD?
I’m doing the couch to 5km program in the attempt to slowly get the legs used to the impact. Yesterday was my first run and this morning I’m feeling a couple of niggling previous injuries pop up, but I guess that is to be expected.
sounds like you’re far more interested in weight training than your soccer drills…i was curious as to what world class soccer players do so i went online…they run 5-10 miles a day, eat very well, lots of recovery when all the soccer specific training is done, do tons of short sprints, jog slow backwards and sideways, work on all parts of their game,dribbling, passing, shooting, balance, lots of scrimaging, and a bit of leg presses…reading all your posts, you dont sound like this at all…
Wendler wrote an article on conditioning a while back, it was this year, sorry can’t make a link, but it sounds like what your talking about. I rember the template was simple, mobility-strength-conditioning,might be same as football 531
[quote]spk wrote:
sounds like you’re far more interested in weight training than your soccer drills…i was curious as to what world class soccer players do so i went online…they run 5-10 miles a day, eat very well, lots of recovery when all the soccer specific training is done, do tons of short sprints, jog slow backwards and sideways, work on all parts of their game,dribbling, passing, shooting, balance, lots of scrimaging, and a bit of leg presses…reading all your posts, you dont sound like this at all…[/quote]
Take a closer look at my log buddy. Things are changing.
[quote]AnytimeJake wrote:
Wendler wrote an article on conditioning a while back, it was this year, sorry can’t make a link, but it sounds like what your talking about. I rember the template was simple, mobility-strength-conditioning,might be same as football 531[/quote]
Thanks buddy. I think i know the one your talking of.
[quote]Chris87 wrote:
I still use all 4, but just two each week. It looks like this:
week 1
day 1- Squat and bench assistance
day 2- Bench and squat assistance
week 2
day 1- Deadlift and Press assistance
day 2- Press and deadlift assistance
I should note that I only do the minimum reps inseason[/quote]
Do you find that only doing a movement once every 2 weeks impedes on your ability to progress? Do you still follow the 531 progression method, but in 2 week cycles? Also does only doing a movement once every 2 weeks have an effect on your ability to practice/keep good technique??
Im thinking of maybe doing it all in cycles, for example do bench press and squat for 6-8 weeks, and change to deadlifting and overhead pressing for a 6-8 weeks.
tweet
[/quote]
I thought it would, but no it hasn’t. Progression still happens (though it is slow inseason) and my technique is still fine. I still use the exact same 5/3/1 percentages.