[quote]MuscleSoup wrote:
Professor X wrote:
urbanski wrote:
MuscleSoup wrote:
I mean ive put on close to 15 lbs this last year, and thats probably very realistic.
i’ve put on 35lbs in 6 months
A newbie could put on 15lbs in two months. It is hilarious how so many of these guys hold themselves back almost as if on purpose.
15lbs of fat in two months? I serioulsy doubt someone natural could put on lean mass of 15 lbs in 2 months. Im not saying your wrong Prof , just not your average gain in such a short time.[/quote]
You can. End of story
Take the number of pounds you think it will take you to even show a visible difference in the mirror and double it.
I think people grossly underestimate the amount of weight it takes to actually look bigger (or get leaner). I learned both of these things the very hard way…i was always 10 pounds away from being ripped and 10 extra pound away from being huuuuge.
Interesting post. I recently irritated my ulnar nerve and haven 't done biceps in almost 2 months…ironically my arms seems to be getting bigger than they’ve ever been.
[quote]MuscleSoup wrote:
Lol, its amazing how everyone is so much help on here. I don’t understand all the hostility. Just asking for some answers and thought some of you guys might be able to help me out.[/quote]
Its not hostility. Its frustration to reiterate the same thing over and over in every thread. Did you measure your arms one time after working out and not the next time? Was it a different amount of time after working out? Due to varying levels of pump my arms will be alot different. I always measure cold to get consistant results. BTW I have gained over 30lbs in 7 months dont give your mind and body such strict limits.
[quote]MuscleSoup wrote:
Lol, its amazing how everyone is so much help on here. I don’t understand all the hostility. Just asking for some answers and thought some of you guys might be able to help me out.[/quote]
This is the internet. You can’t expect much online. Everybody is somebody here…
[quote]MuscleSoup wrote:
Professor X wrote:
urbanski wrote:
MuscleSoup wrote:
I mean ive put on close to 15 lbs this last year, and thats probably very realistic.
i’ve put on 35lbs in 6 months
A newbie could put on 15lbs in two months. It is hilarious how so many of these guys hold themselves back almost as if on purpose.
15lbs of fat in two months? I serioulsy doubt someone natural could put on lean mass of 15 lbs in 2 months. Im not saying your wrong Prof , just not your average gain in such a short time.[/quote]
It depends on how much stronger you get in the hypertrophy zone on your exercises in that time… Which depends heavily on your diet… Etc.
Do we have to retype this in every single thread on here?
Someone Curling the 20’s will have small biceps. Once he curls the 60’s with good enough form, he will have significantly bigger biceps (yes, the numbers are just examples).
If your diet is off, you won’t be able to improve very fast/at all.
If your program is so horrible that it makes progression difficult, guess what.
Your body doesn’t just have a set max rate of muscle gain.
Sure you won’t exactly gain 100 pounds of lean mass in a month, but you can gain significantly more than you think. Else we’d all be doing something else instead of bodybuilding…
It almost HAS to be the measurement. Squats are not going to affect your arm size that much in the short term, unless you lose a good amount of fat.
Don’t worry about the measurement at this point. If your lifts are suffering or your progression has slowed, that’s the time to worry about it. Most of the time, it can be addressed with diet and rest.
It would also help if you posted your full arm routine.
And not accusing you, but: I’ve seen some people who claim to have progressed from curling 20’s for 10 to curling 45’s for ten, only to find out they were curling 20’s strict and cheating like hell on the 45’s. Watch your form and don’t sacrifice it for the sake of progression. If you fool yourself into thinking you’re progressing, you’re cheating yourself out of progress.
[quote]JayPierce wrote:
It almost HAS to be the measurement. Squats are not going to affect your arm size that much in the short term, unless you lose a good amount of fat.
Don’t worry about the measurement at this point. If your lifts are suffering or your progression has slowed, that’s the time to worry about it. Most of the time, it can be addressed with diet and rest.
It would also help if you posted your full arm routine.
And not accusing you, but: I’ve seen some people who claim to have progressed from curling 20’s for 10 to curling 45’s for ten, only to find out they were curling 20’s strict and cheating like hell on the 45’s. Watch your form and don’t sacrifice it for the sake of progression. If you fool yourself into thinking you’re progressing, you’re cheating yourself out of progress.[/quote]
There’s nothing wrong with some cheating assuming some beginner isn’t doing every set that way. Most of the people I have known who are extremely worried about their form tend to ignore the fact that they really aren’t progressing that much.
For the record, why is this board filled with so many beginners who won’t stay in the beginner forum?
[quote]Cephalic_Carnage wrote:
Professor X wrote:
For the record, why is this board filled with so many beginners who won’t stay in the beginner forum?
Dunno… I actually have to start reading that section and see what they tell people there…
[/quote]
I’m just tired of the discussions here centering around someone experienced saying something like, “there’s nothing wrong with some cheating”…and then getting hammered by 15 newbies who have 14" arms as they all tell you that strict form is essential in their 20lbs dumbbell curls.
The debates never range above any of that bullshit yet everyone here seems to think they are so advanced that they need some hyper-technical over-analyzed super program made for Olympic gymnastics.
Where can I get a pair of 14 inch arms? I’ve been thinking about trading in my 19’s for an economy pair to match the increased price of food. On a serious note, strict form may be essential for the beginners who don’t know what theyre doing and may hurt themselves, but for the veterans, cheat reps with heavier weight can be a great way to break through plateaus. Ignore the ignorance prof.
I didn’t read page 3 and 4, but I did notice someone on page 2 mentioning an injury preventing direct arm work and a size increase. I had a similar issue (sprained my ankle, have a cool video of it somewhere, too. My foot almost rolls completely around and touches the side of my leg)
Luckily it was pretty quick to heal up, but I avoided all leg work/biking/jogging for a little over 3 weeks.
After the first 2 weeks or so I noticed that my quads looked significantly bigger and felt harder to the touch than ever before. My weight fluctuated a few pounds up and down during those two weeks, but not nearly enough to explain such a dramatic difference. Anyone have any thoughts on the science behind it. The size has stayed to this point as well, about a month later.
I’m inclined to think that the extended rest period for the legs gave the muscle time to fully repair/adapt. I noticed only a marginal increase in strength though. Squeezing an extra couple of reps on my lighter back squat sets. (225X8 was an easy 225X11, 315X6 was 315X7)
Thanks to those who actually cared to give some insight. This is what i do on arm day usually, ive tried a few different ones but this is seems to really give me a decent pump.
[quote]JayPierce wrote:
X and CC: I wasn’t saying not to cheat at all, just that you shouldn’t measure progress with cheat reps.[/quote]
Well, cheat reps…
When I do BB curls, I don’t boost the thing up sky-high with my lower back and front delts only.
I sort of just don’t care whether my elbows travel forward, it’s not really important and imo locking your elbows down feels unnatural/distracts.
I explode the weight upward with my biceps and just make sure that my shoulders are back and chest out, that’s all. My body swings slightly with the weight (try curling above 185 lbs and staying still and with your elbows at your sides, ha! Chances are you’ll start swaying somewhat way before you hit 185 for 6-8)
I may lean back as necessary(through the knees mostly, no hyperextension as such) to get the weight up on my top set/later in the set but my biceps is always straining to the max…
Man this is really difficult to explain, it’s just something that a) you just find out for yourself and b) People all do it slightly different ways.
I don’t want people to just try to copy what I wrote above, it’s one of those things that you just have to learn through your own experience once you get to the heavier weights… Some things just can’t be taught to you by others.
#Edit: what I meant: People have vastly different opinions of what constitutes “cheating”…
[quote]Cephalic_Carnage wrote:
JayPierce wrote:
X and CC: I wasn’t saying not to cheat at all, just that you shouldn’t measure progress with cheat reps.
Well, cheat reps…
When I do BB curls, I don’t boost the thing up sky-high with my lower back and front delts only.
I sort of just don’t care whether my elbows travel forward, it’s not really important and imo locking your elbows down feels unnatural/distracts.
I explode the weight upward with my biceps and just make sure that my shoulders are back and chest out, that’s all. My body swings slightly with the weight (try curling above 185 lbs and staying still and with your elbows at your sides, ha! Chances are you’ll start swaying somewhat way before you hit 185 for 6-8)
I may lean back as necessary(through the knees mostly, no hyperextension as such) to get the weight up on my top set/later in the set but my biceps is always straining to the max…
Man this is really difficult to explain, it’s just something that a) you just find out for yourself and b) People all do it slightly different ways.
I don’t want people to just try to copy what I wrote above, it’s one of those things that you just have to learn through your own experience once you get to the heavier weights… Some things just can’t be taught to you by others.
#Edit: what I meant: People have vastly different opinions of what constitutes “cheating”… [/quote]
Agreed.
You don’t curl dumbbells heavier than 85lbs without ever cheating the weight up a little. I swing when I do heavy dumbbell curls. My arms got big that way which means there is nothing wrong with it other than random people on the internet claiming it’s wrong.
[quote]JayPierce wrote:
X and CC: I wasn’t saying not to cheat at all, just that you shouldn’t measure progress with cheat reps.[/quote]
That would depend on the exercise.
Cheat reps for compound lifts are fine and should be counted. They are more reps and volume and the more you can expose your muscles to heavy loads the better.
Cheat reps for isolation movements just take the focus off the prime mover, which means you are not getting as much exposure to the load. So I would not count cheat reps for isolations movements.
There comes a point when you stop giving a shit about textbook form, and learn how to cheat ‘properly’ and pound the shit out of your muscles with those last few loose reps that you would not be able to do otherwise.
Some people act like extreme technical precision is what builds huge cannons. This is not an operation table, and the emphasis should be on making sure you are blasting your chosen muscles to oblivion. Safety shouldn’t even be an issue because I think after enough experience you know when to end a set and when the amount of cheating has reached ‘diminishing returns’ as far as stimulation and safety are concerned.
I never lock out my legs on squats (or db presses for that matter). I am sure most people would consider that a form of cheating especially with the sort of rhythm and ‘momentum’ you get going when you are deep into the set. However it feels the best this way and I feel far more in the right places due to this ‘cheating’.
[quote]Der Candy wrote:
There comes a point when you stop giving a shit about textbook form, and learn how to cheat ‘properly’ and pound the shit out of your muscles with those last few loose reps that you would not be able to do otherwise.
Some people act like extreme technical precision is what builds huge cannons. This is not an operation table, and the emphasis should be on making sure you are blasting your chosen muscles to oblivion. Safety shouldn’t even be an issue because I think after enough experience you know when to end a set and when the amount of cheating has reached ‘diminishing returns’ as far as stimulation and safety are concerned.
I never lock out my legs on squats (or db presses for that matter). I am sure most people would consider that a form of cheating especially with the sort of rhythm and ‘momentum’ you get going when you are deep into the set. However it feels the best this way and I feel far more in the right places due to this ‘cheating’.[/quote]
Agreed. I don’t lock out when doing chest pressing movements. I also count every rep. If it didn’t work, my chest wouldn’t be this big without a major injury up to this point (knocking on wood).
Unless this is the beginner’s forum though, I don’t get why we have to even explain this shit over and over. There is a reason most of the biggest and strongest bodybuilders on the fucking planet also get accused of having loose form. If absolute perfect forum built muscles that big and strong, everyone would be training that way.