Ok. I’ll be posting this in the bodybuilders, olympic lifting, power lifting and strong man forums to see what kind of advise I get.
I know it’s long but hear me out.
I’m a football player at a solid 185 right now and it’s my ultimate goal to over 205 lbs BY AUGUST/during the summer before my last high school season starts. My head football coach is McKinley Rolle, brother of Myron Rolle if any of you are familiar? He’s working with me to bring my weight up without losing speed so I’m that much more appealing to colleges. I’ve been lifting since middle school so I have a pretty good strength base. Keep in mind I’m a pretty experienced guy under the bar, but I’m humbled by any opportunity to learn something new or trying something different.
Here’s the 1 rep max’s so far.
325 lb Bench
415 lb Squat
Here’s my problem… I’ve always been able to make strength gains, but I struggle to pack on size and that leg girth regardless of how I modify the exercises, loading methods or stance. I’m a running back/linebacker so if I’m gonna pack on the lbs. I want it on my lower body. At 5’9 I’m built to squat. I have decent leg size with a pretty great lower body strength. But as a football player I really want the leg size that makes a defense think twice about going low on me. I’m in need of some functional hypertrophy. What are the secrets? I do a lot of eccentric - less training as well. I DO implement a lot of sled and stadium work on my upper body days. How did these Olympian guys and the competitive bodybuilders that most know of today… get their leg development to shoot through the roof? All bull shit and complexities aside… real talk, I want to know what these guys really do for their tree trunks. I’m beyond frustrated with myself because I bust my ass on leg days, I can’t seem to get my leg size where I want it. I can’t express how bad I want my legs to look like a body builders when I pull on those game pants.
Here’s my routine
Day 1 Core Upper Body
21’s ( 3 way DB raises for shoulders )
Flat Bench
OH Shrug
Barbell Rows/DB Lawnmowers
Day 2. Core Lower Body
Box Squat & Leg Press super set
Power Clean
Good Morning and GHR super set
Snatch or Clean Jump from the floor
Hang Snatch or Clean Pull
Day 3. Core Upper Body
1.Rack Lockouts or Jerk Press
2. Incline or Decline Bench
3. Military Press DB or Barbell
4. Power Shrugs
Day 4 Core Lower Body
Front Squat & Leg Press super set
Rack Pulls or Dead Lift
RDL scoop & shrug w/ GHR super set
Snatch or Clean Jump from the floor
Hang Snatch/Clean Pulls
Chest Assistance
Board Press or Close Grip Bench
Floor Press
DB Bench
Back Assistance
1.Pull Ups or Lat Pulls
2.Supine Rows
3.Chest Supported Rows
Leg Assistance
Calf Raises var.
Walking Lunges
Leg Extensions or Leg Curls
fuck the sets and reps I’ll let you guys prescribe them and modify the routine as you see fit
Keep in mind I’m a pretty experienced guy under the bar, but I’m humbled by any opportunity to learn something new or trying something different because what I’m doing obviously isn’t getting all my potential out of me.
I’d be really grateful for input
Thanks.
You are a football player. Your training, while it may include some bodybuilding type training, should be and appears to already be centered around big lifts, power and lower reps.
What are you eating? Daily caloric intake?
Well, I understand why you want more mass. It’s awesome. As a football player, though, you need to be more concerned with performance. Javon Ringer was a running back at MSU and is now playing for the Titans. He doesn’t have huge legs, but I’ve seen a video where he squatted a legit 675. He’s a monster.
All I’m saying is, yeah, someone like Mojo makes people think Fuck, this guy has horse legs but you may also have to realize that that may be genetically influenced.
Plus, think about this. Train the best way to perform optimally for your sport. If you do general additional hypertrophy exercises in the off-season (see: leg extensions, leg curls, high-rep close-stance squats or wide-stance, etc.,) you may see some decent hypertrophy results. I guarantee Michael Pittman, Thomas Jones, Joey Porter and a bunch of other swole ass football players are avoiding isolation work. …at least the ones who are legitimately BIG (comparatively speaking, of course.)
What position are you? Are your goals ultimately to become a better football player or simply get bigger legs? By becoming a stronger athlete, your legs will inevitably get bigger, and if you are actually squatting 415 for a clean rep, your legs should already be a relatively good size.
Bodybuilding training may not actually improve your performance, but the visual result of all the extra hypertrophy will definitely make you stand out from a scouting / tryout perspective.
If you want to look like a bodybuilder, don’t train like an athlete. Add leg curls, extensions, and try close stance and toes-out variations. Calves are also impressive (and ‘functional’), don’t neglect them.
The extra mass may slow you down slightly, but even a 10-15lb gain of lean mass offseason will make an ENORMOUS difference to your tackling ability. You will actually be a wrecking ball at a lean 205 in High School.
Lastly, and I may get hated on here, but as far as being a middle linebacker goes, steroid use isn’t just prevalent, its mandatory, at least at or above the college level. I won’t preach to you, but I will say that there is a wealth of information available to you, and to research carefully, considering both your age and your goals.
[quote]SSC wrote:
Well, I understand why you want more mass. It’s awesome. As a football player, though, you need to be more concerned with performance. Javon Ringer was a running back at MSU and is now playing for the Titans. He doesn’t have huge legs, but I’ve seen a video where he squatted a legit 675. He’s a monster.
All I’m saying is, yeah, someone like Mojo makes people think Fuck, this guy has horse legs but you may also have to realize that that may be genetically influenced.
Plus, think about this. Train the best way to perform optimally for your sport. If you do general additional hypertrophy exercises in the off-season (see: leg extensions, leg curls, high-rep close-stance squats or wide-stance, etc.,) you may see some decent hypertrophy results. I guarantee Michael Pittman, Thomas Jones, Joey Porter and a bunch of other swole ass football players are avoiding isolation work. …at least the ones who are legitimately BIG (comparatively speaking, of course.)[/quote]
All Great examples. And like I said, I’d like some more functional hypertrophy. If that’s the correct terminology, hence why most my routine are based on compound lifts. Notice on my upper body days I only have 4 lifts. It saves time and energy to throw in that kind of “functional stuff” I might do 3 way cleans ( Clean, front squat, and press ) Kneeling Squats, pull throughs for hip flexion and low back explosion. Or tire flipping and sled dragging. For Abs which I train every day as well I do everything except a crunch or any kind of supine isolation. I just want to maintain my mobility and flexibility at the same time grow some tree trunks. Thank you for the input. Is there anything you would change up on my routine or anything YOU would do?
[quote]ebomb5522 wrote:
What position are you? Are your goals ultimately to become a better football player or simply get bigger legs? By becoming a stronger athlete, your legs will inevitably get bigger, and if you are actually squatting 415 for a clean rep, your legs should already be a relatively good size.
[/quote]
Ebomb I play both ways. Tailback/Fullback depending on down and distance and inside linebacker.
My goal is to be the best player I can be to the best of my ability. But, I think getting bigger, stronger legs and faster, more explosive hips will do me some good. See where I’m coming from?
On leg days, I keep my squatting normally in the higher rep rape, 10-15. I stay heavy and explosive on hamstring work because don’t the hamstrings really account for speed? lower back and hip work because isn’t that where you’re explosion really comes from? I’m talking like the Good mornings, RDLs, dead lifts, clean variations and box jumps?
What’s the advise? My legs are actually pretty well shaped. The rectus femoris and vastus medialis are well defined I just want the thickness now. I’ve tryed ramping, drop sets, straight sets, pyramids, high reps lower rep ranges.I don’t know what else to do. I’m looking for someone to just give me a recommendation personally for me to get my legs up to par. I’d be so grateful if Thibs would read this. Lol I even downloaded his book. I’ve tryed 5-3-1 Jim wendler shit too. Don’t get me wrong I’ve seen some impressive gains and some things have sent my power out put skyrocketing. But for some reason, it seems my upper body responds better to hypertrophy techniques than the lower body.
Ebomb I play both ways. Tailback/Fullback depending on down and distance and inside linebacker.
My goal is to be the best player I can be to the best of my ability. But, I think getting bigger, stronger legs and faster, more explosive hips will do me some good. See where I’m coming from?
On leg days, I keep my squatting normally in the higher rep rape, 10-15. I stay heavy and explosive on hamstring work because don’t the hamstrings really account for speed? lower back and hip work because isn’t that where you’re explosion really comes from? I’m talking like the Good mornings, RDLs, dead lifts, clean variations and box jumps?
What’s the advise? My legs are actually pretty well shaped. The rectus femoris and vastus medialis are well defined I just want the thickness now. I’ve tried ramping, drop sets, straight sets, pyramids, high reps lower rep ranges.I don’t know what else to do. I’m looking for someone to just give me a recommendation personally for me to get my legs up to par. I’d be so grateful if Thibs would read this. Lol I even downloaded his book. I’ve tryed 5-3-1 Jim wendler shit too. Don’t get me wrong I’ve seen some impressive gains and some things have sent my power out put skyrocketing. But for some reason, it seems my upper body responds better to hypertrophy techniques than the lower body.
Lastly, and I may get hated on here, but as far as being a middle linebacker goes, steroid use isn’t just prevalent, its mandatory, at least at or above the college level. I won’t preach to you, but I will say that there is a wealth of information available to you, and to research carefully, considering both your age and your goals.
I wish you the best of luck.
[/quote]
use of steroids is mandatory? don’t post that shit here
I second the notion above. Since WS4SB involves both low rep (5-1 rep) maxes, it also has a repetition day. Since you say that you generally keep your squat reps in the 10-15 range the low rep max day may be what you need for size gains. With a squat max of 415 you could also try multiple sets, say 3-5, with lower reps, about 1-5 and load the weights in waves. I.e. week 1; 365x4 reps x 3 sets. Week 2; 380x2 reps for 4 sets, ect. Just raising weight while lower reps, adding sets, trying to keep the reps pretty even for each week, lowering a little each week.
Or do something like Starting Strength (which would be a huge decrease in volume, but works) or Bill Starr’s 5x5, which is also a proven system that gives unreal gains for most people.
Whatever you choose to do, good luck and be smart about it.
Lol Ebomb I would if I wasn’t a skinny bastard.
Alders I never really thought of using wave loading for the weight.
Could you give me workout write up for lower body using this method?
Sure, I’m no licensed professional so don’t let what I say.be the only option.
I’ll just write for the squat, whichever type you use, be it front, back, overhead, etc. So this would be after warmups and the first exercise.
Week one:5rm minus 20 pounds for 3 sets of 5
Week two: 5rm minus 10 for 4 sets of 4
Week 3: 5rm for 5 sets of 3
Week 4: 5rm + 10-15 pounds for 6 sets of 2.
Then take a ‘deload’ week where you fo your 5rm for 1 set of 1, and back off for an EASY set of 15-20 reps.
Of course you may want to subtract 5 pounds from each week to make it a little easier. But you’ll want to add 5 pounds to each weeks weight until progress stalls, then you can start over or choose another program if you didn’t like it.
This is strength based, but strength will bring size.
[quote]Chase44 wrote:
Lol Ebomb I would if I wasn’t a skinny bastard.
Alders I never really thought of using wave loading for the weight.
Could you give me workout write up for lower body using this method?[/quote]
Huh?
I would give WS4SB a serious consideration. It is probably one of the best templates out there for athletes, especially football players.
lol my bad I meant if I was* a skinny bastard.
and thanks Alders! I’m going to give it a shot when school starts back up again, that way I can afford to lift sub maximal weight because I’ll have spotters.
Question, do any of you see any problem with super setting squats with leg press? If I get the volume low and intensity high on squats, I can still grind out some sets of 10 on leg press right?
[quote]Alderslodge wrote:
I second the notion above. Since WS4SB involves both low rep (5-1 rep) maxes, it also has a repetition day. Since you say that you generally keep your squat reps in the 10-15 range the low rep max day may be what you need for size gains. With a squat max of 415 you could also try multiple sets, say 3-5, with lower reps, about 1-5 and load the weights in waves. I.e. week 1; 365x4 reps x 3 sets. Week 2; 380x2 reps for 4 sets, ect. Just raising weight while lower reps, adding sets, trying to keep the reps pretty even for each week, lowering a little each week.
Or do something like Starting Strength (which would be a huge decrease in volume, but works) or Bill Starr’s 5x5, which is also a proven system that gives unreal gains for most people.
Whatever you choose to do, good luck and be smart about it.
Alders[/quote]
You need the low rep days as described above. Either 3 x 5 or 5x5. I would squat Twice a week and do the 3x5 or 5x5 one day and then do a standard pyramid on your second squat day something like 8-6-4-3 you could also do this workout as a 3 x 3 .
For the 3x5 or 5x5 you need to use 85 percent of your 1rep max for all your sets, the 3x3 should be done at 90 percent. when you can get all of your reps increase the weight by 20 percent.
Also, sprinting and hill running would be a good idea as it will increase your thigh size as well.
[quote]Alderslodge wrote:
I second the notion above. Since WS4SB involves both low rep (5-1 rep) maxes, it also has a repetition day. Since you say that you generally keep your squat reps in the 10-15 range the low rep max day may be what you need for size gains. With a squat max of 415 you could also try multiple sets, say 3-5, with lower reps, about 1-5 and load the weights in waves. I.e. week 1; 365x4 reps x 3 sets. Week 2; 380x2 reps for 4 sets, ect. Just raising weight while lower reps, adding sets, trying to keep the reps pretty even for each week, lowering a little each week.
Or do something like Starting Strength (which would be a huge decrease in volume, but works) or Bill Starr’s 5x5, which is also a proven system that gives unreal gains for most people.
Whatever you choose to do, good luck and be smart about it.
Alders[/quote]
You need the low rep days as described above. Either 3 x 5 or 5x5. I would squat Twice a week and do the 3x5 or 5x5 one day and then do a standard pyramid on your second squat day something like 8-6-4-3 you could also do this workout as a 3 x 3 .
For the 3x5 or 5x5 you need to use 85 percent of your 1rep max for all your sets, the 3x3 should be done at 90 percent. when you can get all of your reps increase the weight by 20 percent.
Also, sprinting and hill running would be a good idea as it will increase your thigh size as well.
Best of luck!
pars[/quote]
Sorry-meant to say increase weight by 20 pounds, not 20 percent.
