Kanye West

Off Topic Politics & World Issues
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The meaning of this thread is to say that what was said was inappropriate, and it has nothing to do with whether anyone cares less about his comments. If it aint his domain than why does he make a comment on something he doesnt know about? I think it seems so easy to say Bush hates black people. I want to know what Kanye West is doing to help people? I am not discussing his success as an artist or how good he is, that is off topic.

We are discussing how being as smart and talented as he is, I think he would know how to conduct himself in an appropriate manner and keep opinions to himself. You guys are essentially excusing a news reporter for giving biased comments when in fact you should state the facts and let people make their own decisions. If he was professional, he should have kept his mouth shut. If a white person were to say what Kanye said ( in the opposite situation), than he would be the racist. So if he was so great he would know what he should keep to himself.

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[quote]provy07 wrote:
You shouldn’t even be posting on the topic of Kanye West because you obviously don’t have a clue about him or his music. You’re what they refer to as a “hater” and please don’t get on here trying to defend yourself. You will make yourself look like an even bigger fool. I think you have done a good enough job of that already. You also try to claim your comments aren’t racist while it’s completely obvious your a racist redneck. Also those throwning out excuses for doogie are being completely ignorant.

He isn’t the only closeminded person on this thread either.

…
[/quote]

Looks like you fit the bill too.

West made an ass of himself with his comments. He deserves the heat he is getting.

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[quote]provy07 wrote:
You shouldn’t even be posting on the topic of Kanye West because you obviously don’t have a clue about him or his music. You’re what they refer to as a “hater” and please don’t get on here trying to defend yourself. You will make yourself look like an even bigger fool. I think you have done a good enough job of that already. You also try to claim your comments aren’t racist while it’s completely obvious your a racist redneck.
[/quote]

  1. Did you see the performance last night? I did. It was definitely not “genius”. If you think it was, please explain why.
  2. What is brilliant about “And I know the government administer aids”? (Those were the only lyrics that were really discernable).
  3. I’m white trash, not a racist redneck.
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[quote]Professor X wrote:

I could care less about his comments because I don’t look to entertainers for political opinions, but your comment makes me wonder…do you even listen to that genre of music? If not, then critiquing it is like me saying Garth Brooks sucks. I truly don’t think he is that talented, but since he has an immense following, obviously there are quite a few people out there that think he is extremely talented. Do you get my point?

[/quote]

First, did you see his performance last night? If so, please explain why you don’t think it was a crappy performance.

Beyond that, you’ve made a crappy arguement. You wouldn’t have to be a fan of country music to know that a song like Achy Breaky Heart was total crap and not genius, just like you could hear Patsy Cline sing “Crazy” and know that was genius. Just like you could hear Monk or Coltrane or Miles play and know that was genius.

I wouldn’t call myself a fan. There are some songs I like, some I don’t. I do have a copy of The Chronic (it’s required by law), but other than that the closest thing I have is a bunch of King Pleasure CDs and vinal.

For the big fan of rap, provy07, King Pleasure started rap when he started singing making up lyrics for Jazz solos (a style called vocalese).

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[quote]doogie wrote:
First, did you see his performance last night? If so, please explain why you don’t think it was a crappy performance.[/quote]

I didn’t see the performance, but you criticized his lyrics. I am sure I probably like the SONG even though I have seen some of most gifted entertainers choke on stage.

[quote]
Beyond that, you’ve made a crappy arguement. You wouldn’t have to be a fan of country music to know that a song like Achy Breaky Heart was total crap and not genius, just like you could hear Patsy Cline sing “Crazy” and know that was genius. Just like you could hear Monk or Coltrane or Miles play and know that was genius.[/quote]

Bullshit. Patsy Cline’s “Crazy” is NOT universally accepted. Anytime I hear that song I think of some redneck bar in Texas where the people are wearing boots and big ass belt buckles even though they all DROVE. That little mis-step just proved my point. I hate most of Metallica’s songs. I say most because there are a couple I “appreciate”, but overall, I wouldn’t drop a tear if they never existed. I “appreciate” the shear talent in the Rolling Stones and simply can’t deny their place in history…but I would be lying if I claimed I actually like their music. Not one Rolling Stones CD is in my possession.

However, ask me about Tina Turner, Ray Charles, Marvin Gaye, Sam Cook, The Delfonics, Good Gawd…AL GREEN, or Smokey Robinson and you are talking about people who CHANGED music. They came in, took control and created something that wasn’t there before…and really hasn’t been seen since. I didn’t name those artists just to throw them out there either, this is what I have playing in my clinic all day long whenever I go to work all on a few MP3 file disks.

However, Kanye West is also on a couple of those disks, along with Talib Kwali, Mos Def, Nas, Jill Scott, Musiq, and someone who I think is about to really tear shit up…John Legend. Those are the people who I think are helping to change music right now in terms of “Hip Hop” and New Soul. There are others, but those are just a few.

You clearly don’t listen to the music, but have decided to open your mouth about it. Cool, but expect it to piss some people off.

For instance, I could log on and claim that Motley Crue sucked. Maybe I could pick apart a few lyrics and throw them on screen laughing at them. How many Motley Crue fans do you think that would piss off? All of them?

You don’t know Hip Hop, so don’t pretend that your “critique” won’t stand out to anyone who actually does.

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[quote]mindeffer01 wrote:
jon_lamfers wrote:
accuse West of racism (although I’m not sure how accusing someone of being racist makes you a racist),

Thats easy. When you prejudge someone based solely on their skin color, and form a negative opinion based only on that, You’re a racist. It happens all the time. Say for example there is a white guy somewhere in your general area. You look at him and based solely on the fact that he is white conclude that he is a racist-Bingo you just became a bigotted racist.

Does that clear it up for you a little?

Now I’d like to stick around and chat, but I have to go have a wonderfull and easy life with beautifull people who will never understand pain or strife because we are white. sarcasm intended.

[/quote]

Wow, I must have dozed off during the two second snippet when West said, “George Bush doesn’t care about black people BECAUSE HE’S WHITE.” Bush’s actions, or rather, complete lack thereof, in responding to this emergency are what prompted West’s comments. But thanks for clarifying shit for me with that stellar explanation of West’s racism…hopefully we can eradicate racism against the white man in our life time…

147

BostonBarrister:

You were calm, dispassionate, and logical, so I’ll do my best to respond in kind, but again, I have to disagree.

Hindsight is 20/20. I’m not for alleviating local governments from blame(although that’s definitely the latest tactic the Bush administration is employing in hopes of shifting blame for the enormity of their fuck-up), but cronyism now runs rampant in administrations such as FEMA, which used to be a highly competepent, professional agency. Bush claims he called the governor of LA on Saturday, questioned her on the lack of evacuation orders and whatnot, encouraged her to get a move on. Fine, fair enough, she fucked up. But then Bush is woefully unprepared when the shit hit the fan? If he was aware of the potential destruction on Saturday, why the fuck wasn’t he prepared on Monday? I don’t think Bush hates black people, but I can’t disagree that he doesn’t care. It’s a moot point, ultimately, because Bush is no different in this regard from the majority of the power structure in America. Poor people don’t matter. Never have, never will. I respect this modern incarnation of Conservatism for pulling the greatest bait and switch in modern political history, and I hate the American public for falling for it time and again.

And FYI: I am white, not black, and we found out that Aunt did indeed die. Barrister, hope you don’t take this as a personal attack; you seem like a reasonable man, but I am sick to death of the latent racism exhibited by posters such as Mindeffer.

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Anyone that really thinks George Bush hates black people and that is why the local, state and federal response to this tragedy was slower than desired must be a moron.

Ray Nagin must hate black people too. That is why he refused to use the school buses to evacuate.

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[quote]Zap Branigan wrote:

All music after Led Zeppelin pales by comparison.[/quote]

Absolutely correct.

150

The only reason I regret West making these comments is that it gives you assbags a reason to deflect attention from the Bush administration’s totally fucked up handling of this situation. I love the arguments that we shouldn’t question what’s going on because we’re not experts. Kanye dropped out of college, so what the fuck does he know?
WHAT THE FUCK does Michael Brown does know about managing an emergency? Overseeing horse shows…managing the recovery after a natural disaster…shit, if Kanye’s a racist, I guess they ARE equivalent. FEMA positions, like so much in the Bush administration, have become nothing more than patronage jobs.

Now maybe…just MAYBE…if Brown had been “recalled” before this shit hit the fan the search and rescue efforts could have started before, say, oh, people were dropping dead in the streets.

So go ahead…make fun of rap, blame the victims in New Orleans, shift blame to local authorities, whatever…you redneck assbags won, Bush is still in the White House until 2008, so what the fuck are you all so worked up about? To quote Chris Rock, if yall are losing, who’s winning?

The most fucked up part is, most of you will never even see past your own limited life experiences to be able to truly empathize with the plight of another and most of you are fortunate enough that you’ll never encounter the sort of events and situations that would force you to come to grips with what you’re actually saying.

Ultimately though, I guess I can’t be too critical of any of you, since I’m sure if I lived my entire life in a redneck town in Pennsylvania or Texas, I’d have the same limited vantage point that so many of you have exhibited. And now I’ve become as guilty as the rest of you in turning this forum into a never-ending political debate that only the now defunct Crossfire could rival for inanity, so this is the penultimate post. Bash away.

Bottom line: Bush fucked this up. Denying it don’t change that.

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[quote]jon_lamfers wrote:
…

but cronyism now runs rampant in administrations such as FEMA, which used to be a highly competepent, professional agency.
[/quote]

FEMA actually appeared to respond to this better than they do most disasters. FEMA is not a first responder organization.

FEMA has never been known as highly competent.

FEMA has been slow to respond to every major disaster that has hit this country.

I don’t know if there is any more cronyism in FEMA now than there was in previous administrations.

I don’t want to appear like I am protecting FEMA, they certainly appear to be as incompetent as any other bloated bureaucracy, but much of the charges leveled against them are misplaced.

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[quote]Professor X wrote:

Bullshit. Patsy Cline’s “Crazy” is NOT universally accepted. Anytime I hear that song I think of some redneck bar in Texas where the people are wearing boots and big ass belt buckles even though they all DROVE. [/quote]

Fine. Throw out Patsy Cline. That was the only country thing I could think might apply. I don’t listen to it. You still have to admit that even though you don’t listen to country, you are qualified to say ACHY BREAKY HEART is not genius, just like you could say WHO LET THE DOGS OUT is not genius.

What about Miles and Monk and Coltrane? Are you going to tell me you have to really like jazz to hear the genius of those three?

I don’t have any Metallica or Stones CDs either. I don’t really get why you brought them up, though. I never said they were genius.

You could have thrown in Phil Specter there to better argue that maybe Kanye is a genius as a producer. Or the Beatles. Or Brian Wilson.

I listen to a lot of stuff that I like, but that doesn’t mean it’s genius. How are the above artists changing music for the better? What will never be the same about “hip hop” and New Soul after they are gone?

[quote]

You clearly don’t listen to the music, but have decided to open your mouth about it. Cool, but expect it to piss some people off.[/quote]

Like I sit around worrying if I’m going to piss people off on the internet.

I really find it hard to believe that you’ll find anyone claiming Motley Crue is genius.

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[quote]doogie wrote:
I listen to a lot of stuff that I like, but that doesn’t mean it’s genius. How are the above artists changing music for the better? What will never be the same about “hip hop” and New Soul after they are gone?

[/quote]

Why are you stuck on a word? Genius? I don’t consider music as “genius” material in the first place unless we are speaking strictly of child prodigies. Musical talent is a gift. While you are stuck on one adjective, it doesn’t erase the fact that the kid is talented whether you listen to that style of music or not.

In fact, let’s talk about his comment since that seems to give you carte blanche to critique even musical stylings that you can’t even “get” or appreciate. Bush cheerleaders are trying hard to downplay what is glowing to everyone else as an apparent dislike (or rather blind eye) for the working class in America. Perhaps Kanye should have said “poor people” instead of “black people”…but considering the media has ONLY focused on the black population of New Orleans for the past two weeks in majority, who is really to blame? I am really laughing at what sets some of you off. We can have a raving racist on this board posting for days and no one says anything aside from a select few. Kanye West, a performer who most of you don’t respect in the first place simply because of the genre of music (as if that’s not biased)…in spite of not even listening to any of it in depth…comes on and says “Bush doesn’t like black people” and, Dear Lord, the floodgates of hell just opened and accusations begin to fly.

I don’t get it. Is anyone here going to pretend that Bush’s focus in government since he bagan his term has been the working class? Big Business is apparently his master and I don’t see how anyone can argue that…at least not without being insane.

Back to music, though

I mean, we got how many “rap is crap” statements in this thread? Many in this thread come across like some pretty damn bigoted bastards. To then get pissed over Kanye’s statement is ridiculous.

I can’t tell you the number of times I walk into my local gym and the gym manager has found his favorite “scream metal” station. You know, the type of music that involves no vocal talent AT ALL, plenty of random guitar chords played at max volume and some guy screaming his ass off in inaudible “lyics” that don’t even rhyme? THAT’S CRAP. If you want to talk about crap, talk about Brittany Spears’ entire greatest hits album. Crap? How about every wannabe “rock artist” who hits the scene, all sounding the same.

Hip Hop has had its dark days as well, however, anyone who would describe that entire genre as “crap” is either a dumbass, extremely biased, or clueless. Maybe they are all three.

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Oh btw, he has an IQ of 160, which is probably higher than everybody on this thread.
But yeah, what an idiot.

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[quote]MuscleMachine17 wrote:
“Play a race card” HAHA I’M FUCKING LMAO HERE!
How the hell do all you closet racists manage to turn everything around and put the focus on kanye, saying that he’s an idiot and whatever, but COMPLETELY IGNORE WTAT MADE HIM SAY THOSE THINGS. Don’t you see what happend during this whole fiasco? do you really belive that if this sort of thing would have happened in a mainly white and/or wealthy area things would ave handled the same way by the goverment?
Fucking BS!
The people that sufferd through this were poor, they were black, and as such their lives were treated as expandble.[/quote]

If it wasn’t a poor area all the people would have evacuated, so you are correct in your statement that things would be different. Unless you are saying that black people are incapable of evacuating. I really don’t think that the color of your skin should determine whether or not you should get the hell out of the way of a major storm when you are below sea level. The bottom line is that everyone should have left and because they didn’t/couldn’t the entire tragedy is magnified.

What I think is funny is that if the leveys didn’t break things wouldn’t be that bad. So really this is a man made failure and a by product of the huricane not due to the storm itself. I guess the politicians have something to answer for. Your ever notice how the guilty person usualy makes the biggest rucus blaming other people, where is that mayor letsask him some questions and look at his budget.

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[quote]MuscleMachine17 wrote:
Oh btw, he has an IQ of 160, which is probably higher than everybody on this thread.
But yeah, what an idiot.[/quote]

Damn, kiddo - instead of staring at a picture of Kayne West every night when you pleasure yourself, you might want to try a Playboy. or Hustler, or a Victoria’s Secret catalog.

Unless you are as gay as your posts seem to indicate. Not that there’s anything wrong with that.

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[quote]MuscleMachine17 wrote:
Oh btw, he has an IQ of 160, which is probably higher than everybody on this thread.
But yeah, what an idiot.[/quote]

Kanye West is 7 feet tall. Kills men by the hundreds. And if HE were here, he’d consume the Hurricane with fireballs from his eyes, and bolts of lightning from his arse.

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[quote]Khickey wrote:
rainjack wrote:

I’m not doogie, but if the guy is as much of a genius as everyone is saying - why can;t he put together a coherent sentence? I mean Mike Meyers was standing right next to him and at the very least he sounded lucid.

Kayne West sounded like an idiot - and had he been white and been as incoherent, I think ‘crack head’ would be an applicable description of the white idiot as well.

Crying “racism” whenever the idiot in question is black is just pure ignorance.

After watching the posted video clip, Kayne reminded me of the door-to-door sales man in Office Space that tried to sell magazines to Peter at his apartment. Ends being a former programmer who makes more money. If memory serves me, I believe the dude said he was a former crack head or crack addict.

Had I not known who hell Kayne was, I would have thought he was a crack addict. In all honesty, my girlfriend and I were channel surfing and stopped when we saw the clip being played. Seeing Mike Myers, we both assumed it was a comedy skit when Kayne said what he did. It took about two seconds and the reactions of Mike Myers and Chris Tucker to realize that it was live and for the benefit of the hurricane victims.

While I believe in free speech and all the BS we tend to hear with it, I dont believe a live national benefit was the right forum for his rant.

What really gets me though, is that this post has turned into a rant about racism. It seems to me that anyone on this board who makes any critical remarks about anyone of the African American race, is bound to be labeled a racist within a few posts. And anyone who comes to their defense, is a raciest as well.

Criticism is defined as “disapproval expressed by pointing out faults or shortcomings” This in no way points to the race of the person; it is only an opinion of one person in regards to another. If anything derogatory about race is mentioned, then yes, we have a racist. In this case, nothing like that was mentioned.

People may have seen his rant as one from a moron, idiot, or as mentioned above, a rambling crack head similar to the one in Office Space. But because they are critical of a “black artist” and the comments he made at a rather inappropriate time, they are automatically labeled as racist. THAT in my eyes is total BULL S***.

In my eyes, the person who throws out the race card is more than likely to be the who is racist.
[/quote]

Thats a lot to assume when you say that Kayne is a crackhead just b/c he wanted to rant on tv.

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[quote]Professor X wrote:

I can’t tell you the number of times I walk into my local gym and the gym manager has found his favorite “scream metal” station. You know, the type of music that involves no vocal talent AT ALL, plenty of random guitar chords played at max volume and some guy screaming his ass off in inaudible “lyics” that don’t even rhyme? THAT’S CRAP. If you want to talk about crap, talk about Brittany Spears’ entire greatest hits album. Crap? How about every wannabe “rock artist” who hits the scene, all sounding the same.

Hip Hop has had its dark days as well, however, anyone who would describe that entire genre as “crap” is either a dumbass, extremely biased, or clueless. Maybe they are all three.
[/quote]

Damn Prof, I usually like your posts but you basically just called yourself a dumbass, extremely biased, or clueless. I’m gonna go with extremely biased.

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[quote]storey420 wrote:
Professor X wrote:

I can’t tell you the number of times I walk into my local gym and the gym manager has found his favorite “scream metal” station. You know, the type of music that involves no vocal talent AT ALL, plenty of random guitar chords played at max volume and some guy screaming his ass off in inaudible “lyics” that don’t even rhyme? THAT’S CRAP. If you want to talk about crap, talk about Brittany Spears’ entire greatest hits album. Crap? How about every wannabe “rock artist” who hits the scene, all sounding the same.

Hip Hop has had its dark days as well, however, anyone who would describe that entire genre as “crap” is either a dumbass, extremely biased, or clueless. Maybe they are all three.

Damn Prof, I usually like your posts but you basically just called yourself a dumbass, extremely biased, or clueless. I’m gonna go with extremely biased.[/quote]

No, you just labeled yourself as illiterate. I listen to some rock music, therefore, I would never call all Rock “crap”. Go kill yourself.