Hi Jim!
Thanks for your great books! I have been following 531 for 9 cykles and just recently reset the weights for the 10th cykle. I have made good progress so far.
I find that I can lift more weight when I do the joker sets before the PR set. When I do so I still hit 10 reps on the 5+ week and so on. Would you approve of this way of training?
I am sorry about my english, this is not my native language…
Sounds like your TM is artificially low and / or you haven’t warmed up properly. I would add more warm up sets then do the sets as written. If you still feel peppy, Do some Jokers, if you still feel strong do the First sets last thing.
Maybe Jim will weigh in, but I think most people would tell you that since you’re following a blueprint prepared by someone else, you should follow it faithfully.
If you have your own ideas about training that you want to try out, you should go ahead and do it but at that point you’re going it alone, so it isn’t appropriate to ask for anyone’s approval.
If you think your idea will work for you, why not take the time to plan out a block of training for yourself and follow it and see what happens? Don’t ask, just do it. If you’re not confident enough to do that, then follow a plan as written until you are.
Jim gave me similar advice recently when I asked about an idea I had for my own training, and it was helpful.
Take a longer rest after the PR set?
strengthdawg: My TM is exactly 90 % of my 1RM as I just reset. I warm up good. The reason I think about doing the jokers first is that I think I can do some heawy jokers without doing much worse on the PR set but if I do the PR set first I can not do as well on the joker set. In conclousion I thing that I can do more and heawier work this way.
Ramo: I want to follow the program, that is why I am asking permission from Jim. If he tells me that it is stupid, then I will not do it. 
tsantos: That is a good idea but I have limited time to train so I would rather plan my training so that I do not have to rest as much…
You can do whatever you feel is in your best interest.
Doing the joker set first is similar to a supramax warm up. The PR set always feels really light the session after I do a joker set.
[quote]Thorney wrote:
Doing the joker set first is similar to a supramax warm up. The PR set always feels really light the session after I do a joker set. [/quote]
well no kidding. If I “warmed up” to 500 and then dropped back to 405 for reps no shit it’s going to feel light BUT 5/3/1 revolves around the PR set. The goal here is to better my PR set by reps or weight and maybe both. THEN if I feel good, get in some bonus rep Jokers. You guys seem to be missing the big picture here but I may be wrong.
Ultimately, do whatever the fuck you want to do. Its YOUR training, OWN it, just don’t come back here saying “5/3/1 sucks” or some shit because you went all experimental and theoretical on what “YOU” think is best. In fact, why don’t you all write a book and get your awesome training secrets out to the masses? Why do I feel like “Obama’s anger translator” from Key & Peele right now…lmao
I always push my PR set before Joker unless I know for a fact that I’m going for a 1-rep PR on a Joker Set. I figure if I can’t lift it after a PR set then I probably wasn’t going to lift it anyway. I will do my PR set, listen to a 3 or 4 minute song, and then start my first Joker set.
@StrengthDawg, I too focus on the PR set way more than jokers but whenever I do jokers my next session feels light, not any sets after the joker. I did 170kgx4 on 3 week followed by a few jokers up to 195kg, on 1 week I put 180kg up for 6 and it felt like I was moving nothing.
I experience nothing but goodness hitting 5-3-1 sets as laid out and then doing Jokers before doing my PR set and my FSL. Sure, it is a blueprint written by someone else - BUT…try it. My attitude is, the PR set is optional - depending on the day. I run “advanced” with my upper body lifts and do NEITHER a PR set nor jokers and my presses are finally moving and quite quickly I might add. So those tools are not necessary and you have to find what you respond to.
Regarding your idea - the same dynamic is involved with the whole concept of “first set last.” You work up heavier first - and then come back down and hit a rep PR. Same pattern with doing jokers and coming back down to the programmed top set.
Strength Dawg -
Who cares - it’s one of the oldest tricks in the book - it gets your nervous system firing - I often do shrugs in between my benches with 550 - drop down to my measly 320 and you are fuckin’ right it feels lighter and guess what? It counts. I am still lifting it. Before a PR set I sometimes also eat a big bag of hot fries and a large soda chased by a coke - oh yea I get a nice swollen bloat and shorten my bench range of motion by 4-6 inches. It fucking counts.
If working up to a heavy single helps you put a rep PR in the book - have at it.
[quote]Rave2.0 wrote:
Before a PR set I sometimes also eat a big bag of hot fries and a large soda chased by a coke - oh yea I get a nice swollen bloat and shorten my bench range of motion by 4-6 inches. It fucking counts.
If working up to a heavy single helps you put a rep PR in the book - have at it.[/quote]
That was funny shit there!