[quote]Severiano wrote:
I always thought bjj would be good individual self defense, but in a situation where you don’t want to go to the ground, like at a concert or big event where people will kick your head in it’s not so ideal.
I tend to like Judo and boxing for self defense. Boxing you can dominate with quick short punches at risk of being grabbed, but with Judo you should have the advantage if anyone gets their hands on you. You can dominate clinch and standup and with Judo. If you must, you can drop people on their heads and do some real damage. [/quote]
[quote]yoitspmart wrote:
Come on guys we all know BJJ works in the streets all day you just have to pull these moves off
[/quote]
Word. I got into a 18 on 1 last Saturday and took out 11 guys with an airborne flying armbar combo. Got one more double armbar before they started stomping me out.
Thankfully MMA/K1 legend Mark Hunt was nearby and helped out by beating the piss out of the remaining six.[/quote]
werd… and good thing it was Hunt- that guy can take a punch!!!
ps judo FTW
pps I wasnt sure if at first that 18 to 1 was some kind of mmmmmmmmmfmmmmmmmmm
[quote]Severiano wrote:
I always thought bjj would be good individual self defense, but in a situation where you don’t want to go to the ground, like at a concert or big event where people will kick your head in it’s not so ideal.
I tend to like Judo and boxing for self defense. Boxing you can dominate with quick short punches at risk of being grabbed, but with Judo you should have the advantage if anyone gets their hands on you. You can dominate clinch and standup and with Judo. If you must, you can drop people on their heads and do some real damage. [/quote]
Judo is very underrated. Cool, cool art.[/quote]
Agreed; I’m also falling VERY much in love with catch wrestling.
[quote]yoitspmart wrote:
Come on guys we all know BJJ works in the streets all day you just have to pull these moves off
[/quote]
Word. I got into a 18 on 1 last Saturday and took out 11 guys with an airborne flying armbar combo. Got one more double armbar before they started stomping me out.
Thankfully MMA/K1 legend Mark Hunt was nearby and helped out by beating the piss out of the remaining six.[/quote]
[quote]Severiano wrote:
but with Judo you should have the advantage if anyone gets their hands on you. You can dominate clinch and standup and with Judo. If you must, you can drop people on their heads and do some real damage. [/quote]
And that’s the beauty of Judo And since a judoka’s instinct is never to go down, he’ll be tough to drop if the other guy can’t really do so by striking him. An Ippon or Morote seonage and, even Osoto Gari will definitely daze the other guy or massively hurt him, especially if he lands on concrete. More chance then to either ‘‘finish’’ him or run.
I’ve learnt Judo before BJJ and never, will I consider using Jiu Jitsu in real life situation. Nowadays, I much prefer Krav Maga over JJ and Judo though.
Anyways, as it’d been said before, the most sensible thing to do is not to be where trouble is at in the first place.
Also, the good thing about judo is that on camera, it’s hard to tell what you’re doing, and it might look like the other guy tripped, or fell, or slipped… hell, who really knows HOW that guy ended up on the ground with a broken arm and slipped disk?
[quote]legendaryblaze wrote:
Would it be better to get in to judo or get in to BJJ if one has 0 knowledge of BJJ?[/quote]
Personally, I think starting with Judo will be more appropriate. You master your standup and grappling techniques, and your throws. And I really loved randori sessions.
I had years of experience on ground work with judo,(I started age 7), so BJJ was practically easy for me to learn. There a few differences between both but they are necessary as each other depending on the situation.
It’ll be the same with my kids. I’ll have them start with Judo before training BJJ.
[quote]FightinIrish26 wrote:
Also, the good thing about judo is that on camera, it’s hard to tell what you’re doing, and it might look like the other guy tripped, or fell, or slipped… hell, who really knows HOW that guy ended up on the ground with a broken arm and slipped disk?
[quote]legendaryblaze wrote:
Would it be better to get in to judo or get in to BJJ if one has 0 knowledge of BJJ?[/quote]
Personally, I think starting with Judo will be more appropriate. You master your standup and grappling techniques, and your throws. And I really loved randori sessions.
I had years of experience on ground work with judo,(I started age 7), so BJJ was practically easy for me to learn. There a few differences between both but they are necessary as each other depending on the situation.
It’ll be the same with my kids. I’ll have them start with Judo before training BJJ.
[/quote]
Agreed. The experienced Judo guys (~brown belts and above) that come to us always have a decent base to start with. They still suck of course, but they know good posture, good balance, how to hip thrust, and are relatively explosive.
In contrast, none of our long time guys are any good in standup grappling. On that end, there’s zero carryover other than, I don’t know, wrist control and collar ties.
[quote]Robert A wrote:
Well, technically it did come from judo, so originally there was likely more focus on throwing and standing based tactics. Again, a lot of what we see now as modern BJJ has been influenced strongly by the sport of submission grappling/BJJ.
Jujutsu was a catch all term for fighting. Because of this there is a huge variety in technique from striking to grappling to throwing. Still, most of the "traditional"ish systems are going to contain atemi(hitting tender parts), standing techniques, and ground work with various degrees of emphasis.
Regards,
Robert A[/quote]
I’m fortunate to train jujutsu in a club that is quite modern. We do all the traditional stuff (formality, self defence, weapons) as much as required, but we also spar a lot in boxing, kickboxing and ground game with punches. There’s also plenty of throwing training which almost always end in some sort of lock/finish or continues to grappling. To top it of the same club train also BJJ, so the ground game is included also in the jujutsu training (not only the BJJ classes). So my point is kind of twisted as I see that not all clubs train “traditional jujutsu” the same. Not even in my country inside the same jujutsu school.
What I’m trying to say is that traditional or “plain” jujutsu is great art in real life situations, if it is trained the way Robert A wrote in above quote or as our club does. Every field gets covered, while not being great necessarily in anything, but being better than average joe in every area, which should be almost always enough.
[quote]Brotha123 wrote:
Hey guys, I was just wondering how effective bjj would be in a street fight. I mean if you come across a strong dude about 5’10 230 squatting and dead lifting over 500 and the guy doing bjj is around 5’8 165, what the outcome would be? Do you think the bigger dude would be screwed?[/quote]
Real life situation. My friend Alejandro lives in Uruguay and his best friend was a long time BJJ-er. One day, the friend sees an altercation between a young thug, a 60-ish year old man and the man’s 80 something mother. The thug was trying to take her purse. The friend does a take down on the guy and pins him. Problem is that in Uruguay, using a firearm in a crime will get you a much harsher sentence, so generally thugs work in pairs, with the backup guy waiting with the gun. Backup guy is on a scooter, walks over and pumps a few rounds in the friend’s head at point blank range. After all, he’s tied up on the ground with thug #1, and extracting yourself from a good lock takes a bit (in a bout, the pin ends the encounter: on the street that is about the time all Hell breaks loose.) Both thugs flee on the scooter, not getting caught. Friend dies at the scene. Unclear if they got the purse.
Yes. This happened. Point is that even a good martial art with a competent practitioner still has a very wide training gap. My experience is that people who I think are scary good and can handle themselves in a live fire situation can be aided by some martial arts training, but if you are a sitting duck without it, you will just be a cockier sitting duck with it.
– jj
Edit: I suppose I’ll answer your question. You describe a duel, South American style. In the US, we punch each other out. Sure, as long as he’s willing to roll around on the ground with you and understands enough about arm locks to tap, go for it. Boys will be boys. If he doesn’t, you get to foot the medical bills (Bad armlock = dislocation and e.g. if the guy was in med school to be a surgeon, you will might damages for the rest of your life, even if he did start it.) Yes, good BJJ/floorwork is hard to deal with as long as they play your game. As Irish said, biting changes it, as do eye gouges and all that stuff your girlfriend will do to you if you really piss her off.
[quote]yoitspmart wrote:
Iv heard good things about Sambo anyone?[/quote]
The club I train with does judo, sambo, and shingitai jiu-jitsu. Sambo’s basically judo with leglocks and a few other minor differences. At least the stuff you’ll learn at a club. The military version involves more striking and whatnot.
[quote]yoitspmart wrote:
Iv heard good things about Sambo anyone?[/quote]
The club I train with does judo, sambo, and shingitai jiu-jitsu. Sambo’s basically judo with leglocks and a few other minor differences. At least the stuff you’ll learn at a club. The military version involves more striking and whatnot. [/quote]
Sambo is an acronym from Russian. During Stalinist times, any foreign affiliations were deemed subversive, so the judoka claimed that they had a suddenly created a national wrestling system based on native fighting systems from the various Soviet republics. Technically though, it is mostly judo with some pretty slick leg locks. Good stuff and Sambo players are really good.
Any training employed against some dude swinging wildly will prove effective to a certain degree, Jiu Jitsu is a great thing because it offers a chance to subdue an opponent who attacks you without breaking your hand, without being sent to prison for giving someone braindamage, gives a weak guy a great defence to preturb an attacker till someone walks by or someone jumps in, attacker gives up etc.
The whole you can’t pull guard on concrete, multiple attacker scenario stuff is in my opinion redundant, anyone who is outnumbered is getting his ass kicked, Anderson silva would be demolished by three drunk dudes on the way home from the bar, so why worry about such scenario’s, buy a gun if thats a possibility you face on a regular basis
Having said that Judo is a cool defence system, I imagine Kimura used to walk around with gold draped on him in the harsh winter, eyeing up peoples winter coats and itching to slam people into the ground haha.
I got into a fight a month ago after some guy came walking over to me drunk and looking to hurt someone, despite being truly shit at BJJ and sucking like paris, the fact I am used to training in a simulation of a fight to the death for a couple hours every week meant i could react to a bigger attacker, not panic get side control, hold his arms, let him calm down and then get up and leave quickly.
Now imagine being good at jiu jitsu, it must be like having your own life size strech armstrong to contort when you get your hands on someone totally untrained in any martial art
[quote]yoitspmart wrote:
Iv heard good things about Sambo anyone?[/quote]
The club I train with does judo, sambo, and shingitai jiu-jitsu. Sambo’s basically judo with leglocks and a few other minor differences. At least the stuff you’ll learn at a club. The military version involves more striking and whatnot. [/quote]
Sambo is an acronym from Russian. During Stalinist times, any foreign affiliations were deemed subversive, so the judoka claimed that they had a suddenly created a national wrestling system based on native fighting systems from the various Soviet republics. Technically though, it is mostly judo with some pretty slick leg locks. Good stuff and Sambo players are really good.
– jj[/quote]
Yea Sambo sounds legit Leg Locks are crazy painfull plus the stand up throws from judo roots… Does anyone know of any good Sambo gyms in the States preferably in Arizona?
And since a judoka’s instinct is never to go down, he’ll be tough to drop if the other guy can’t really do so by striking him. An Ippon or Morote seonage and, even Osoto Gari will definitely daze the other guy or massively hurt him, especially if he lands on concrete. More chance then to either ‘‘finish’’ him or run.