Why would we attack Iraq? That is a good question for someone that does not understand the world affairs. I think that the reason that we would want to attack Iraq for the following reasons:
1- Once Saddam has weapons of mass destruction, who do you think he will unleash them on? That is right he will find some way to get them in the US and he will hit us were we would not expect it.
2- Bush #43 wants to finnish the job that his father did not do, aka, get rid of Saddam.
3- The only thing that the people in that reason have ever known in that part of the world is war. I think that Bush #43 is thinking that if they get rid of the dynasty of Saddam and company that it will bring peace in that part of the world (excluding the whole Isreal thing).
4- Did someone say oil???
5- Why would we worry about other people on the world platform critizing us. If it was not for us having the attitude of “saving the world” most of the people would not have jobs, money, or anything to eat. Think about it!!! What other country would feed their enemy while they are fighting a war? You guessed it!! The USA.
These are some of the reasons that we would consider taking on Iraq over other hot spots in the world (North Korea).
You raise very good points cloakmanor. While I agree whole-heartedly that Israel has the right to defend herself, the way Israel was carved out of the Middle East 50 years ago was simply not well thought out. In many ways, I believe the problems the Israelis are facing right now can be blamed on the bonehead Westerners who decided where Israel would be. However, I am the furthest thing from an expert on those matters, so I’ll just stick with my original sentiment that Israel has the right to defend herself.
I also agree with your World War II analogy. History has a nasty way of being repeated, and while I wouldn’t put Iraq on par with Hitler’s military and ideological juggernaut the Third Reich (much of Saddam’s own freaking army won’t even back him) if he does in fact acquire nukes, then even if he was by himself he would pose a serious threat.
In light of 9/11, I agree that the US has the right to prevent future acts of terror. And considering the US military build-up reported in the Gulf as we speak, Iraq’s fate is already sealed. I truly hope (for all of us) that this is the best course of action for the US to take…
Cloakmanor, just because Israel is the only democracy in the Middle East doesn’t mean we should back her up or support her or stand by her or give her billions and billions of dollars of military aid every year. The Arabs should be blamed for the problems in the Middle East. The Israelis should be blamed for the problems in the Middle East. You need to awaken from your dreamy and delusional idea that Israel is perfect. Cloakmanor, it is in OUR interest not to involve ourselves with Israel. The only reason Arabs hate America is because we nurture Israel like it is our own baby. The only reason Arab terrorists target America is because we give Israel jet fighters, helicopters, tanks, artillery, and the list goes on and on. Do we have to get involved in other people’s business? Do we have to support a country just because it is a democracy when that country is fighting a seemingly endless war? We are America. America is a different country than Israel. Does Israel give billions of dollars of weapons to other countries? Does Britain? Canada? No! Why should we? If you don’t know the answer, then let me tell you why we shouldn’t: September 11, 2001. That’s right. As long as we attach our name to Israel, we might as well put a sign across our borders that read “ARAB TERRORISTS - WELCOME!” or “TERRORISTS - YOU CAN STAY HERE AND SAVE 10% WHAT YOU WOULD SPEND IN ISRAEL”…In other words, understand this formula: Support for Israel = Invitation for Terrorists.
Dreamy…interesting “observation” John G. First off I do not recall associating Israel with “perfection”. I have not known a human yet (including myself) who is. Secondly, the Islamic world does not hate us simply due to our relationship to Israel but in fact they dislike our whole way of life. It does not fit into Islamic traditions etc.
I’d also like to add that we should not be told by other countries who should or should not be our allies via threat of terroristic activities and bloodshed. Basically that would be letting the Arab world dictate American policy; something I don’t think Americans would or shouldn’t want.
Worse we would be letting terroristic regimes know that everyone will be more than willing to back down and give into what they wish (again my reference to what Europe did as Hitler’s power grew in Europe at that time) as long as they are threatened.
Incidently should police leave serial killers alone to do their evil deeds and simply “mind their own business” instead of tracking them down to potentially save lives? And in my opinion these terorists are far more dangerous than a lone serial killer. They are financed with weapons and even hidden and protected by regimes that support this type of cowardice.
Lastly, I agree brian. Saddam may hold the seat of power in Iraq but I do not believe that he completely owns the hearts of his countrymen as Hitler did (something that was truely terrifying even looking back). If one owns the masses hearts, one owns true power. However they both desire Israel’s total destruction and even the demise of the west (Israel or no).
I’d like to add that if I were a tiny nation surrounded by hostils I’d definetly want support. Perhaps we could tell Israel to fend for herself and wish her luck but what would this say about us as a nation who would not even be willing to support other democracies? Obviously nations would not be willing ot acept such a government and perhaps turn to dictatorships and monarchies. The more of the latter two regimes that exist the greater the chance for a large scale war due to power humgery men willing to stop at nothing to achieve military and economic glory and power at the expense of the conquered nations citizens and even their own.
Everyone will decide for themselves but it simply depends on where ones priorities lie.
In closing it is very tempting even to myself to be selfish and simply “stay away” from “their” problems but from my point of view giving into terrorists demands only encourages further atrocities. I, for one, am not willing to do that…
Cloakmanor, I did not try to make an interesting observation, but glad you found it that way. Obviously, in the most strict definition of the world, you don’t associate Israel with perfection. But you hold Israel higher than what she is worth. How do you know the Islamic world hates us for our way of life? That is BS and something you grasped from watching television. The Arab world hates us mostly for wiping Israel’s ass everytime she takes a shit. There are other political reasons that they hate us, but they don’t hate us for our way of life. That is propaganda that you heard spewed from the media. Many are jealous, no doubt, but jealousy doesn’t create terrorists. You say that we shouldn’t let the Muslim world dictate our policies. I say you missed the point. The point is that the situation in the Middle East is so heated and boiling, has been and will be, that it is almost incomprehensible as to why any country (Read: USA) would want to involve itself in the mess. If the year was 1967, and I told you that we should get out of Vietnam because it is unwise to fight another country’s civil war, you would say that that would be giving in to Viet Cong. In other words, you wouldn’t understand my point. The bottomline is, there is an almost endless war over religion and land there, and it is not in our interest to get involved. It isn’t a matter of giving in to the terrorists targeting America, Cloakmanor. It is a matter of having never given them a reason to target us in the first place.
You can do anything in Canada that you can do in the US? Hmm. I was recently there for a while and read an article in the local paper about the “free and accessable” health care. Kids that need oral surgery have to wait up to 4 months to get it done, these are mostly kids from low income families. The article also mentioned in other places the wait for the same treatment was up to a year. I can imagine a kid that needs treatment for a painful condition waiting a year to get treated. That must make paying attention in school that whole time a breeze, huh? Free health care that you can’t get to in a reasonable time is just as bad as no health care. I like Canada and Canadians but every place has it’s problems. I see the free health care touted while Canadians with money come here to see the doc because they can do so before they die in line. Can everyone get rich in America? Nope. Is it more possible here than in a place that takes 60-75% of the money you make as taxes? I’d hazard a guess that it is. There are a lot of good countries out there, each has the one or two things that really stand out. I just wish the beer in Canada was less expensive…how can you live like that?
I don’t want a war, especially this one. There is no way to carry it off at this time without catching a lot of grief from the rest of the world. We should just close our borders and concentrate on minimizing terrorist acts at home. I suspect that in a few years after terrorists blow up the Eiffel Tower, Big Ben, and the Colliseum that we’ll have a few other nations to support us in this war effort.
Unfortunately, I don’t think that we can ever control that area of the world unless we completely supress all of the arab factions that live there, but do we really want to do that? Instead, we need to hit them where it really hurts - in the wallet.
Think about it, if the nation that used the most oil in the world suddenly wasn’t using oil, they would have nothing. Stop sending aid to their governments, refuse any political contact with them, stop all trade with them, freeze their govermnments financial transactions outside their own border and let them rot.
And maybe it’s not Iraq that we should be attacking, maybe the focus of our attacks should be our “friends” in Saudi Arabia.
How does that old addage go? Hold your friends close and your enemies closer? How close have the Saudis been holding the US?
Treat the whole region like a child put in the corner for a time out. Cordon them off from the rest of the and just let them squabble amongst themselves.
I rarely watch television (I’m too busy studying these days and frankly only thing that is on is crap for the most part). This is an assumption on your part (Television is the last thing I get information). You do not think they despise our way of life? I find it interesting that Islamic militants are performing Islamic jihad in not only Israel but Kashmir and even the Sudan against the Christians in southern Sudan; and niether of these places have any relation to Israel.
I myself would rather not have a war but I’m really not comfortable with a man like Saddam having access to biological and nuclear weapons. If I missed your point I’m sorry (just as you missed mine).
First off, Sadaam is a terrorist leader developing nukes and willing to use them at any time. He already has bio and chems that he has used against his own people. On top of that this motherfucker pays the families of suicide bombers. Are you telling me he doesn’t support terrorism. These fuckss are out to destrot the world and the good ole USA is the only country that can stop them. Any of you motherfuckin pussies that don’t support our leader and the decisions he makes so that we can live with the freedoms that we have…FUCK YOU. Go live in fuckin Irag or Afghanistan then tell me if we should be over there kicking ass. USA love it or leave it!
Cloakmanor, I am not suggesting that Islamic Fundamentalism is limited only to the US. Far from it. However, the terrorism in Kashmir is occuring over a dispute of land, similar to the situation in the Middle East. I hardly doubt Pakistani militants are targeting Indians because of their way of life. Now, I am not familiar with details pertaining to the persecution of Christians in Sudan, although I have heard of it. Obviously, the Muslims in Sudan are not targeting the Christians due to their way of life, as they are both Sudanese and living in the same country. There is no doubt in my mind that the atrocities are genocidal in nature, in terms of both the purpose and the process. This must be stopped, much the same way the persecution of Muslims in Bosnia was stopped. I’m with you on overthrowing the Iraqi regime. Saddam has to go. We just have to do it the right way.
MDLP, I agree with you. We should nuke Iraq from orbit. It would be precise, clean, and efficient. A great strategic move. Our allies will understand. After all, just imagine the horror of Saddam developing a nuclear bomb and setting it off.
Saddam has shown a historical willingness to use weapons of mass destruction against HIS OWN PEOPLE (the city of Halabja). Any tyrant willing to slaughter his own people with poison gas, and a history of invading weaker neighbors must be stopped before he has the means to deliver nukes beyond his own borders. Before Gulf War I he was within 6-8 months of a working nuclear device. The Europeans will always pussy out, with the exception of the UK, unless the threat is dire. They have a history of it. Remember a harmless ‘lil fella named HITLER? They showed their true colors when they told Hitler in 1938 “sure, take whatever part of Czechoslovakia you want, just promise us you’ll be nice thereafter.” We ended up bailing them out wwith our blood; so if it weren’t for our willingness to confront tyranny with a strong fist, all the European pussies who are telling us that we’re bein’ mean to 'ol Saddam would be eating weiner schnitzel & sauerkraut.
WE CANT NUK’EM because of a little thing called fallout. The country is about 2x the size of Idaho, and the fallout would not be contained just to the target. That’s the whole problem with the nukes - they’re not precise in their destruction. They’re totally unusable for a country like us cause we’re not crazy. If we nuked Iraq we wouldn’t even be able to go in afterwards and get the oil - even if it was free.
To John G. I wasn’t suggesting that Islamic jihad was being performed in Kashmir and the Sudan but simply an (as we both agree) observation of how troublesome (in a very serious way of course) the militants are. Whichever way the US choses to deal with this issue I sincerely hope it is the correct one. Take care John and everybody…
CIA dir. quoted as saying under current US policy, nuke attack is “inevitable.”
Thus, given the circumstances and relation to 9/11, I believe Hussein is tremendous threat to our safety. Priorities have changed people. The world is growing more evil by the day.
Oops…I mean to say “I wasn’t suggesting that Islamic jihad was being performed in Kashmir and the Sudan because they disapprove of their way of life in those places but…”
I am sorry to say that CM’s statement,“The US backs Israel because it is the ONLY democracy in the middle east.” Is not completely true. The real underlying matter is that the Jewish population in the US of A. Is and will continue to be quite active when it coming to donating to political parties that support their goals. This was true at the beginning and is still true today and will be true tomorrow. Why else would “Billy Boy” offer to fight for Israel, when he wouldn’t for his own county? He is after their money!
Back to the original questionof this post,“What advantage is it to us when just DISCUSSING THE POSSIBILITY”. It is at least two fold, first is political and military it is a “Show of Force” abet a weak one.
Best of Luck.
To Old Lifter…I never meant that this is the ONLY reason (I should have clarified) but it is certainly a factor IMO. Actually we’re not after “Israeli money” we’ve but have been kissing the Arabs rears and insisting (in the past) that Israel do nothing when attacked but talk (which is absurd of course). Case in point was The Persian Gulf war. They simply stood still while Saddam launched scud missles into their cities. They did this out of respect for the US and abided by our wishes. I wonder how Britain would have felt if we insisted that they sit still and simply take the London blitz without retaliation in WWII. The reason for being, at times, a borderline ally to Israel is due to what else but oil.
As far as international critisism…
Unfortunately no matter what the US does it gets the short end of the stick. We know why this is. Most countries are anti-semetic. In Europe anti-semitism is now at it’s highest point that it’s been in a long time. Later…
Thanks for the support everyone, especially Cloakmanor. I believe I’ve already said this, but I’ll have to repeat it again. Americans have NO reason to care what the fuck the Europeans think about them. They can’t and they won’t do shit about it. They depend on the U.S. for their economies, and they won’t do anything but talk. That’s it. Case closed.
As for the support of Israel, let me lay out this scenario. The U.S. completely stops supporting Israel tomorrow. Within a year, all the Arab nations in the Middle East and Africa attack Israel. Israel, a country with a population of 6 million, can not withstand an attack by over 500 million muslims by using conventional means. Israel is no frayer, and she launches all the Nukes she’s got at the Arab countries, even if it means going down herself. Let me make one thing very clear to you- The Jewish people were almost completely wiped out less than 60 years ago. It WILL NOT happen again, not with out retaliation.
everybody who stops to think about not attacking Iraq, can as Ted Nuggent would say “You can turn around and get the fuck outta here”, there’s a better seat …Anyway, people I tried of hearing all this BS about attacking and rights , hey those pieces of shit in CUBA prison camp live better there and in their homeland, what gives, and Was I the only one who seen the villager dead when Saddam tested his new toy, “chemical weapons” shit man he kills his own people, look shit hammer them all them, Isreal, what are yo waiting for, LOOK if someone enters my backyard and starts to destory my property, all of us would kick their ass,…so if they mess your people …pound them into the ground…I guess you need to establish you presence, shit hammer them get them all. These cry babies will cry another tune when it’s to late and we recieve a cargo container with a nuke or some nerve agent and kills their love ones, then what,…TAKE CARE OF BUSINESS…