I think I have a bit of a story to add to this tread.
I have a friend very much like the OP, and he always claims he works his ass off everyday. Well after reading through this thread I decided to invite him to one of my workouts. He said he would keep pace with me and do everything I do.
Today was my chest/tri day, and just a standard day for me. For him…well he had to a puking break half way through. To his credit he did the workout but I am thinking he won’t be able to pick up a pencil tomorrow much less go lift again.
He has since realized that my results are from pure sweat and tears, and not some trick/genetics. I will be amazed if he does another day with me. He said he would be joining me on friday for my back/bi day but my guess something will come up lol.
Why not? How does more days in the gym, more calories burned and more muscle stimulus for growth NOT sound like a better use of calories if you gain fat easily?[/quote]
it’s already hard to get in 4x/week so 5x will have to wait until summer),
[/quote]
[/quote]
Even though you left out any text…I agree, there is no way in hell someone is training at the level of intensity I am referring to with that mentality.
I trained as much as I needed to…during finals, mid terms, board exams and many other life crisis.
If you want it bad enough, you make it happen.
If you don’t…you make up random excuses and pretend you have tried everything.[/quote]
I would echo this. There really is always a way to make some kind of time for lifting enough days a week.
Also, I have never pretended that I was making the most progress I could during times when I hardly made it to the gym 3 days a week and didn’t eat enough food. There have been some pretty long stretches of time where I made zero progress, but I don’t look back and cry that I have tried everything and it just isn’t working, because I know that (a) I was completely inconsistent, and (b) my intensity sucked.
When I am in the gym 5-6 days a week with a lot of intensity, and making every workout and day of eating count, progress is fast and satisfying and completely within my control.
If I am intense only once in a while, and/or don’t eat enough food every single day… my body tends to say “fuck you” and then nothing happens
This thread is a train wreck. Feel kinda bad. pumped has been around for a while. Always respectful, always trying to learn, and never giving out advice he isn’t qualified to give just so he can post. So I think his treatment has been a bit harsh. Not really from prof x for example but from the hoards of other people that jump in to join the mob… Assuming his lifts are legit and I assume they are I bet he is in better shape than some of those who attack him.
Pumped post some pics so at least maybe you can learn something from this thread and get it on track. I don’t know how this thread turned into a tryout for T-cell alpha or a place to brag about how intense you are. Everyone is intense on the internet.
Why not? How does more days in the gym, more calories burned and more muscle stimulus for growth NOT sound like a better use of calories if you gain fat easily?[/quote]
it’s already hard to get in 4x/week so 5x will have to wait until summer),
[/quote]
[/quote]
Even though you left out any text…I agree, there is no way in hell someone is training at the level of intensity I am referring to with that mentality.
I trained as much as I needed to…during finals, mid terms, board exams and many other life crisis.
If you want it bad enough, you make it happen.
If you don’t…you make up random excuses and pretend you have tried everything.[/quote]
I would echo this. There really is always a way to make some kind of time for lifting enough days a week.
Also, I have never pretended that I was making the most progress I could during times when I hardly made it to the gym 3 days a week and didn’t eat enough food. There have been some pretty long stretches of time where I made zero progress, but I don’t look back and cry that I have tried everything and it just isn’t working, because I know that (a) I was completely inconsistent, and (b) my intensity sucked.
When I am in the gym 5-6 days a week with a lot of intensity, and making every workout and day of eating count, progress is fast and satisfying and completely within my control.
If I am intense only once in a while, and/or don’t eat enough food every single day… my body tends to say “fuck you” and then nothing happens[/quote]
Just to enforce the point…I doubt most of these fuckers could last one day with me when it comes to how I eat, how I plan ahead, the focus I put into what I will be doing days in advanced, or the intensity in the gym. I am not half assing this. I eat several times a day EVERY DAMN DAY. The ONLY time I didn’t was when I was in the military training and literally couldn’t.
There are no days of me not eating anything. There are no weeks that have gone by aside from when I had surgery that I have not made it to the gym AT LEAST 4 days a week with 99% of the other weeks being the usual “6” where I take a day off when needed.
I seriously doubt all of these people crying about their progress are doing the same.
There is also no way in hell I would have ever written that it is hard to make it to the gym 4 days a week and that making it any more than that would have to wait until summer.
Someone like that is NOT very serious about this. College majors don’t have shit to do with it when I did the same thing and still made it.
Sorry to get the quotes out of context but I’m no good with this multiple quoting thingy. I’m internet challenged lol.
To piggy on what’s been posted, we all have those friends that look at us and say “Steroids; Genetics; food” but it all comes back to you’re doing anything but working harder than the next guy. Its the same thing about people that make more money or have a better lifestyle. We all work hard to get what we have. I worked for years making little and doing more than colleagues to get to the point where I am now. Satisfied NO!! but I’ll be damned if I’m going to let someone crap on my progress by saying I got it cause I’m BLACK (Genetics reference to keep the rant relevant).
OP, why don’t you have any pics of your progress? I would think that after working out hard for five years at 18% BF you would have something to show for those years of “intense” training. Not to make a comparison but looking at your stats, we have similar builds and I’ve only been working out for about 2 years now after a 5 year layoff.
[quote]DJS wrote:
This thread is a train wreck. Feel kinda bad. pumped has been around for a while. Always respectful, always trying to learn, and never giving out advice he isn’t qualified to give just so he can post. So I think his treatment has been a bit harsh. Not really from prof x for example but from the hoards of other people that jump in to join the mob… Assuming his lifts are legit and I assume they are I bet he is in better shape than some of those who attack him.
Pumped post some pics so at least maybe you can learn something from this thread and get it on track. I don’t know how this thread turned into a tryout for T-cell alpha or a place to brag about how intense you are. Everyone is intense on the internet.[/quote]
On some level I agree…but Pump upped the anti himself when he tried to act like I was asking for pics but hadn’t produced any myself until recently.
Yeah, yeah, I guess pumped got the message.
It’s funny how all those lickspittles and yes-men seem to come out of hiding to step on the bandwagon.
Out of curiousity, pumped: how much sleep do you get in average per night. Let me rephrase that: would you say you get enough sleep?
Now, the following is only tangential to your concerns, but maybe I’m somehow on the right track with this:
in the first half of 2009, I was doing about 8-10 cardio sessions (50:50 SS vs IV) and lifted about 4 times a week. And I wasn’t making any decent headway in terms of fat loss, although my daily caloric intake had been below 2000 kcal. And I only slept 3-4 h a night. Now, my progress never stalled out: my HIIT got better from session to session and my lifting numbers were on the up and up. So, IMHO, training progress alone isn’t a surefire indicator for fat loss.
Another anecdote: all things equal, my body tends to accumulate fat if it’s become too stressed:
-lack of sleep
-hard and progressive training
-yadda yadda yadda
Also: stimulants (ephedrine/ephedra/yohimbine) mean additional stress for your body.
Let’s try to inject some good vibrations into this thread, shall we? Peace and love. Or my fist.
[quote]DJS wrote:
This thread is a train wreck. Feel kinda bad. pumped has been around for a while. Always respectful, always trying to learn, and never giving out advice he isn’t qualified to give just so he can post. So I think his treatment has been a bit harsh. Not really from prof x for example but from the hoards of other people that jump in to join the mob… Assuming his lifts are legit and I assume they are I bet he is in better shape than some of those who attack him.
Pumped post some pics so at least maybe you can learn something from this thread and get it on track. I don’t know how this thread turned into a tryout for T-cell alpha or a place to brag about how intense you are. Everyone is intense on the internet.[/quote]
You’re right. I’ve been guilty in the past of creating a dumb ass forum. Blame it on boardom, too much test, protein difficiency - whatever you’d like. After I sobered up though, I didn’t keep ranting. I realized the error and let it go. But for someone to say they want the same things you do/have but aren’t willing to work for it - sounds kinda Hillary Clintonesq and not OK in my book.
[quote]DJS wrote:
This thread is a train wreck. Feel kinda bad. pumped has been around for a while. Always respectful, always trying to learn, and never giving out advice he isn’t qualified to give just so he can post. So I think his treatment has been a bit harsh. Not really from prof x for example but from the hoards of other people that jump in to join the mob… Assuming his lifts are legit and I assume they are I bet he is in better shape than some of those who attack him.
Pumped post some pics so at least maybe you can learn something from this thread and get it on track. I don’t know how this thread turned into a tryout for T-cell alpha or a place to brag about how intense you are. Everyone is intense on the internet.[/quote]
I agree completely, although I do think pump has really, really short changed himself. 5 years and not 200 pounds at 6’ isn’t great. At all.
But yeah, overall he seemed like a pretty good dude and now I feel bad for telling him pics or GTFO.
OP - What supps are you taking? I’ve found the best results for me are Creatine & Glutamine with some BCAA’s. I also take Whey protein in the morning & Post workout (morning time also). Before going to bed I down some Whey and Cassien Protein (half milk and half water -lactose issues). I like to add chocolate syrup to my shakes to help with taste and calories. Additionally, I lift for mass when I’m training to get big. I pyramid up in weight until my working set of 3-6 reps. If I can lift the weight more then I’m not lifting heavy enough. I also focus on compound moves when gaining: Squat; Deadlift; Benchpress; Clean & press or Military. I do these all on the same workout. Essentially, I lift like a powerlifter for that growth cycle and then back to traditional splits.
[quote]FattyFat wrote:
Out of curiousity, pumped: how much sleep do you get in average per night. Let me rephrase that: would you say you get enough sleep?
Now, the following is only tangential to your concerns, but maybe I’m somehow on the right track with this:
in the first half of 2009, I was doing about 8-10 cardio sessions (50:50 SS vs IV) and lifted about 4 times a week. And I wasn’t making any decent headway in terms of fat loss, although my daily caloric intake had been below 2000 kcal. And I only slept 3-4 h a night. Now, my progress never stalled out: my HIIT got better from session to session and my lifting numbers were on the up and up. So, IMHO, training progress alone isn’t a surefire indicator for fat loss.
Another anecdote: all things equal, my body tends to accumulate fat if it’s become too stressed:
-lack of sleep
-hard and progressive training
-yadda yadda yadda
Also: stimulants (ephedrine/ephedra/yohimbine) mean additional stress for your body.
[/quote]
That’s what I’ve been trying to get at lol. If stress levels (e.g. cortisol) are high like from bad sleep/outside influences/lack of food, then it becomes a viscous circle…until adequate rest is taken…THEN one can become a “crazy unleashed animal” and get good results from it. Until the point where proper rest is taken, the individual will continue to get mediocre muscle gains and excessive fat.
There’s a difference between making OK progress (like when lifts are extremely slowly crawling up), and GREAT progress where you gain minimal fat with maximal muscle. You may still be making OK progress in the gym, but there’s usually always ways you can optimise it.
People on here have said: “Unless you’re a liar, I just don’t understand why you aren’t making the same sort of progress as I did when doing the things you SAY you’ve done”. This is where people are getting confused; an individual could be eating enough for bodyweight increases, and exercising “enough”, but it doesn’t make a difference to lean muscle gaining mass if the hormones are screwed up.
I do think that some of the treatment he’s gotten was a bit uncalled for…after all, as has been mentioned, he’s a respectable member. Also, he has lost A LOT of fat before he started…something I have respect for since hardly any in this world seem to care enough to make the effort. I’ve seen many slackers/weekend warriors in life, I don’t feel that Pumped is one of them.
All this talk about intensity means crap if you aren’t progressing in weights, and as far as I can tell, the OP hasn’t said anything about lifts stalling.
[quote]DJS wrote:
This thread is a train wreck. Feel kinda bad. pumped has been around for a while. Always respectful, always trying to learn, and never giving out advice he isn’t qualified to give just so he can post. So I think his treatment has been a bit harsh. Not really from prof x for example but from the hoards of other people that jump in to join the mob… Assuming his lifts are legit and I assume they are I bet he is in better shape than some of those who attack him.
Pumped post some pics so at least maybe you can learn something from this thread and get it on track. I don’t know how this thread turned into a tryout for T-cell alpha or a place to brag about how intense you are. Everyone is intense on the internet.[/quote]
I agree completely, although I do think pump has really, really short changed himself. 5 years and not 200 pounds at 6’ isn’t great. At all.
But yeah, overall he seemed like a pretty good dude and now I feel bad for telling him pics or GTFO.
Sorry, pumped.
But still, you should post pics.
[/quote]
Guys…I’m like, tearing up over here. Can we just cuddle?
I’ve got bottom.
PS, pump, you are in the T-Cell because you are NOT a dummy. However, I do think most of us have gotten called out about our progress at least once.
I don’t have anything personal against you but my comments in this thread remain the same.
Prof. X, I was going by peoples posts in the past. It’s not like I’ve been following you around this site since you joined.
And you didn’t answer the question, again. After how many years roughly do you think is an average time at 5’11-6ft to hit a lean 200lb.?
Pro-a-ggression, I wasn’t asking you. And why would you care if I’M in the t-cell, doesn’t affect you at all. This is a damn forum, you’re acting like you’re trying to be accepted into a house of gods…relax. And stop sucking up to PX.
[quote]Professor X wrote:
The first I ever posted here back in 2001
Since then, my pic has been used as my avatar countless times.
Your move Pumped.[/quote]
Yea I’ve seen your pics. Since it doesn’t seem to be getting through that I don’t have pictures maybe I should draw one
I’m not about to go through the trouble of posting up pictures for your sake. Especially since it’s not even relevant to the original point of thread.
I actually like that pic more than some of your recent ones, but I’m sure once you lean out it’ll be more aesthetic. How many years after training was that?
[quote]LankyMofo wrote:
Lol, the second I read pumped340s last post I started to feel bad about how wrong he was. [/quote]
What part? I think I pretty much just stated I ate high protein and sleep is disrupted
FattyFat, I could only post up pictures 2-4 years old. I don’t really see a point in that though
[quote]its_just_me wrote:
[quote]FattyFat wrote:
Out of curiousity, pumped: how much sleep do you get in average per night. Let me rephrase that: would you say you get enough sleep?
Now, the following is only tangential to your concerns, but maybe I’m somehow on the right track with this:
in the first half of 2009, I was doing about 8-10 cardio sessions (50:50 SS vs IV) and lifted about 4 times a week. And I wasn’t making any decent headway in terms of fat loss, although my daily caloric intake had been below 2000 kcal. And I only slept 3-4 h a night. Now, my progress never stalled out: my HIIT got better from session to session and my lifting numbers were on the up and up. So, IMHO, training progress alone isn’t a surefire indicator for fat loss.
Another anecdote: all things equal, my body tends to accumulate fat if it’s become too stressed:
-lack of sleep
-hard and progressive training
-yadda yadda yadda
Also: stimulants (ephedrine/ephedra/yohimbine) mean additional stress for your body.
[/quote]
That’s what I’ve been trying to get at lol. If stress levels (e.g. cortisol) are high like from bad sleep/outside influences/lack of food, then it becomes a viscous circle…until adequate rest is taken…THEN one can become a “crazy unleashed animal” and get good results from it. Until the point where proper rest is taken, the individual will continue to get mediocre muscle gains and excessive fat.
There’s a difference between making OK progress (like when lifts are extremely slowly crawling up), and GREAT progress where you gain minimal fat with maximal muscle. You may still be making OK progress in the gym, but there’s usually always ways you can optimise it.
People on here have said: “Unless you’re a liar, I just don’t understand why you aren’t making the same sort of progress as I did when doing the things you SAY you’ve done”. This is where people are getting confused; an individual could be eating enough for bodyweight increases, and exercising “enough”, but it doesn’t make a difference to lean muscle gaining mass if the hormones are screwed up.
I do think that some of the treatment he’s gotten was a bit uncalled for…after all, as has been mentioned, he’s a respectable member. Also, he has lost A LOT of fat before he started…something I have respect for since hardly any in this world seem to care enough to make the effort. I’ve seen many slackers/weekend warriors in life, I don’t feel that Pumped is one of them.
All this talk about intensity means crap if you aren’t progressing in weights, and as far as I can tell, the OP hasn’t said anything about lifts stalling.[/quote]
Thanks for the kind words. It’s funny actually, everyone I know in person knows me as “that guy”, the guy who’s always serious about lifting, never starts talking to random people in the gym because he’s focused, doesn’t miss meals, etc… so if people on a random forum want to talk shit I really don’t care.
I must have missed everything you quoted, I didn’t see that anywhere. I do believe that my sleep/stress has limited progress to some degree, although I couldn’t really say how much.
to you and Fatty, I get “7-8” hours of sleep per night, but it’s not a good night of sleep. I may lie down at say 12:00am and get up at 7:30 but really I may fall asleep at 12:15 and then get up for 5-10 minutes to go to the bathroom twice. As far as time goes that’s still just around 7 hours (sometimes more, sometimes less) but the quality of the sleep is what sucks, which is an important detail. Doesn’t seem like there’s much I can do about that though unfortunately. I’d be open to ideas but I’ve already tried not drinking a few hours before sleeping, covering my eyes so no light comes in and taking Mg+Ca+Zn pills (Mg is supposed to help, although apparently it competes with one of the other substances listed I think)
Edit: Just realized I skipped the 10th page lol…
[quote]Professor X wrote:
Even though you left out any text…I agree, there is no way in hell someone is training at the level of intensity I am referring to with that mentality.
I trained as much as I needed to…during finals, mid terms, board exams and many other life crisis.
If you want it bad enough, you make it happen.
If you don’t…you make up random excuses and pretend you have tried everything.[/quote]
Considering I haven’t tried to lift 5 days while being here that’s not really a valid point at all. I also didn’t want to train 5x per week while here. So someone who doesn’t train 5+x per week isn’t intense. Yea, that makes sense…
[quote]countingbeans wrote:
I still don’t understand how anyone would gain fat pulling a sled 3x a week and lifting at least 3 times the other days.
The math just isn’t working in my head. Were you eating icecream & milkyways for lunch?[/quote]
Just to enforce the point…I doubt most of these fuckers could last one day with me when it comes to how I eat, how I plan ahead, the focus I put into what I will be doing days in advanced, or the intensity in the gym. I am not half assing this. I eat several times a day EVERY DAMN DAY. The ONLY time I didn’t was when I was in the military training and literally couldn’t.
There are no days of me not eating anything. There are no weeks that have gone by aside from when I had surgery that I have not made it to the gym AT LEAST 4 days a week with 99% of the other weeks being the usual “6” where I take a day off when needed.
I seriously doubt all of these people crying about their progress are doing the same.
There is also no way in hell I would have ever written that it is hard to make it to the gym 4 days a week and that making it any more than that would have to wait until summer.
Someone like that is NOT very serious about this. College majors don’t have shit to do with it when I did the same thing and still made it.[/quote]
Why are you making excuses about being in the military? You should have found a way. Bring food in your pockets. You’re clearly not intense enough it’s OK for you not to eat while in the military but I’d literally have to drop classes to workout more days per week right now and that means I’m not intense apparently.
And now you’re bringing up non-lifting factors? I’ve eaten 6 meals per day EVERY DAY for the last 4-5 years. I had major surgery and wasn’t supposed to lift for a month and only take in liquids. I blended my fuckin food and chugged it down as a shake, 6x/day, nearly puking because of the bodily stress from the surgery, so don’t tell me I’m not dedicated.
That might sound like a dick response but seriously, I’m sure you know how annoying it is when people take away from your hard work. Right away what comes to mind as my best trait is my determination. I seriously have NEVER met in person someone even close to as dedicated to I am, especially when it comes to lifting and getting my meals in. Same could probably be said for school. How annoyed would you be if someone said you only got into xyz school because you were born with a great IQ or because you’re black? I’ve had people say I’m naturally really smart and that’s why I get straight A’s (even though I got B’s and C’s in middle school…), it’s definitely not the hours and hours of studying I do every day while they’re getting ridiculously drunk…
[quote]Professor X wrote:
[quote]DJS wrote:
This thread is a train wreck. Feel kinda bad. pumped has been around for a while. Always respectful, always trying to learn, and never giving out advice he isn’t qualified to give just so he can post. So I think his treatment has been a bit harsh. Not really from prof x for example but from the hoards of other people that jump in to join the mob… Assuming his lifts are legit and I assume they are I bet he is in better shape than some of those who attack him.
Pumped post some pics so at least maybe you can learn something from this thread and get it on track. I don’t know how this thread turned into a tryout for T-cell alpha or a place to brag about how intense you are. Everyone is intense on the internet.[/quote]
On some level I agree…but Pump upped the anti himself when he tried to act like I was asking for pics but hadn’t produced any myself until recently.[/quote]
From what I’ve read you only posted them recently. Maybe that was only publicly. Seriously, don’t take it so seriously. You’re the one calling me out, I’m just responding.
Oh also to Fatty and Its just me: I don’t take any stimulants
[quote]LankyMofo wrote:
At one point in this thread pumped was 6’3" and an avid AAS user and still couldn’t push past 170 pounds. [/quote]
All I see is some guy trying to rationalize is lack of progress and try to get ‘‘the veterans’’ to give him a pat on the back.
‘‘I have been lifting for 5 years, I do everything correctly, I am a PRE-MED student,not anybody, I am really dedicated,blablabla but I am still skinny fat!!! What do I do!!’’
I get this vibe that you are an huge underhanded manipulator/politician in real life. No one fucking care about your case and your ego. I’ll tell you what you want to hear: It’s not your fault, you have my acknowledgement, you are still ‘‘a real one’’
[quote]countingbeans wrote:
I still don’t understand how anyone would gain fat pulling a sled 3x a week and lifting at least 3 times the other days.
The math just isn’t working in my head. Were you eating icecream & milkyways for lunch?[/quote]
No, all “clean” foods. [/quote]
That is crazy man.
I was thinking about getting a sled, and hooking mah dog up to it between my runs and see if he likes to pull shit.
What kind of weights were you pulling, and what was the progression like? I mean, what can I expect?[/quote]
Well as far as cardio goes, I liked it. Especially as intervals. You can’t read a book or watch TV like some might do during steady state cardio but if you’ve got an ipod it’s good. Nothing magical about it though
it’s OK for you not to eat while in the military but I’d literally have to drop classes to workout more days per week right now and that means I’m not intense apparently.