I was wondering what the best ways were to simply put on some size / definition for biceps and calves. I feel I need to bring these up.
Background:
I follow a sheiko routine, which basically lets me lift for no less than 2.5 hours 3 times a week. I do not really have extra time during the workout to add these in, but can do these as a small workout once or twice a week.
Anyone care to comment?
For calves it ranges. I’m not sure there is a best way. I do both low and high rep work. Some guys don’t even work theirs. The extra body weight they carry around is enough to make them grow. Donkey calf raises are my favs.
For biceps, any type of curls with in a 6 to 12 rep range should work. Lately in an effort to get my arms bigger, I’ve been experimenting with 20’s.
I don’ tknow sheiko? but you can’t do calf raises between sets of benches? or curls between sets of squats?
Does sheiko already have supersets?
Ok, sorry, I didn’t clarify.
I’m a powerlifter, I follow the sheiko routine which is as follows:
Day 1:
Heavy squats: work up to 80% of max 5x3 (5 sets of 3)
CG Bench: work up to 80% of max 5x3
Leg work: leg extentions, plate slides (for hamstrings)
Day 2:
Heavy DL or GMs
Rows: work in the 15 - 25 rep range
Speed deads or zercher squats
Day 3:
Heavy Bench: Work up to 80% of 1rm 3x5
Squat: some sort of squat movement, oly squats, bands or chains, box squats
DB press: work up to heavy weight x5
These workouts take 2.5 hours to complete and i am totally burnt out by the end of them. Everything is a focus on power and conditioning (for powerlifting) with no focus on any hypertrophy.
Say for a 30 minute or less workout, whats a good set of exercises (say 2 per part, 2 for calves, 2 for biceps) that I can do w/ a curl bar, straight bar, DBs etc. I have no machines. Just free weights.
Airtruth, there’s no super sets in powerlifting training. I can’t do any sets between bench or squat b/c i’d never finish the routine.
One thing that has really helped my biceps increase in both strength and size is to get on a bicep curl machine after doing your normal curl bar routine. Set it heavy, almost more than you can raise, have your workout buddy raise the bar for you with your hands on it and slowly lower the bar counting to 4, do this till your arms crap out and then you will feel the burn. Do this for a month and you will see what I am talking about.
wait so your power lifter with no focus on hypertrophy
…yet you want hypertrophy for biceps
Really want do you WANT, do you actually compete power lifting? What do you want more to be strong and not care about how big you are. Or be big and moderately strong?
If you want hypertrophy just be easier to do bodybuilding routine, but if you care more about power lifting their is no need then for bit of hypertrophy.
Anyways most power lifters have bigger calves then bodybuilders from heavy squatting, yet some people just have really bad calves genetics and they just never really look good.
Also heavy pull ups-I believe power lifters do this- should bring up biceps also pretty ok.
[quote]Synthetickiller wrote:
Ok, sorry, I didn’t clarify.
I’m a powerlifter, I follow the sheiko routine which is as follows:
Day 1:
Heavy squats: work up to 80% of max 5x3 (5 sets of 3)
CG Bench: work up to 80% of max 5x3
Leg work: leg extentions, plate slides (for hamstrings)
Day 2:
Heavy DL or GMs
Rows: work in the 15 - 25 rep range
Speed deads or zercher squats
Day 3:
Heavy Bench: Work up to 80% of 1rm 3x5
Squat: some sort of squat movement, oly squats, bands or chains, box squats
DB press: work up to heavy weight x5
These workouts take 2.5 hours to complete and i am totally burnt out by the end of them. Everything is a focus on power and conditioning (for powerlifting) with no focus on any hypertrophy.
Say for a 30 minute or less workout, whats a good set of exercises (say 2 per part, 2 for calves, 2 for biceps) that I can do w/ a curl bar, straight bar, DBs etc. I have no machines. Just free weights.
Airtruth, there’s no super sets in powerlifting training. I can’t do any sets between bench or squat b/c i’d never finish the routine. [/quote]
Unless your maxing every week to know what weight you should use for your 80% 5x3 sets your routine dosent make much sense to me… Maybe 80%x5x3 adding 10lbs every workout and takeing off 1 set and then starting over at 80% but adding 15lbs every workout and so on.
Anyway I just had to get that out of the way. Im prety obsesive compulsive when it comes to training programs.
Pick 2 excercises per body part to 5-12 reps and 3-6 sets a piece and add weight as often as posible.
Ok… where to begin.
I feel I need the bicep work so I don’t create an imbalance in arm strength to keep from injuring myself in the deadlift.
The calf work is just something I want to work on. I’m not a huge guy (about 185 or so), so not being massive doesn’t really put stress on my calves enough to build them up.
I’ve never had heavy squatting (80% or more) ever have an affect on my calf strength. I guess if you walk the weight out for half a mile, but I only take 2 or 3 steps to set up.
My 80 is basically just a 5 kg increase per cycle, like you said. Thats kind of the idea w/ sheiko. You don’t have to max every cycle to predict your 80%. You can kind of get a feel for what sort of jump you can make for your worksets. I don’t really know why Sheiko is being discussed in terms of analysing my problem. Its not related since i want to work biceps / calves on a different day.
I’ll just try to follow some sort of routine that maybe is weight x12x3 or x4 for each exercise and I’ll just get a feel for it.
Thanks for the general outline.
Is it not possible to do short sets of calf work in between Sets of Rows and DB Presses? Also what about sets of curls between warm-up sets for your Bench?
These types of programs fry your cns, which is what you want, but leave no room for added work, If you feel up to it, a short arm/calf workout on an off day probably wouldn’t hurt. But man I have tried that while doing Russian power & was FRIED! hard shit. Decide what you want.
Your problem is easily corrected my friend.
On Fridays as addition to your accessory moves perform 2 sets of 21’s for a curl movement either barbell or dumbell both at the same time.
For calves do 1 exercise and make it a goal of hitting 100 total reps. You can use whatever weight you feel but there must be 2 requirements: a. the first set’s weight must be high enough for you to rep 25. The last set can’t be less than 2 reps.
Rotate 3 exercises both for the bicep and calves. This will give you 3 rotations every 3 week cycle.
This should be enough volume to add mass but not so much that it takes from your main goal.
I’m sorry but man if your doing sheiko & being honest, there’s no way you’d have enough left in the tank for 21’s & 100 calf raises on bench day. Not trying to bum anyone out, just saying. . . .
Synthetic
for biceps:
Won’t you try the 1 day arm cure every 2 weeks, or one of CT’s Bicep workouts. They both look under 30 minutes for just biceps. You don’t need to do them as frequent since you should be getting a little stimulation from the rows to keep whatever gains you got from the day.
Calves are harder. I don’t know how heavy you are but they need to be hit more then once a week to grow. If you go all out on one day you would have to really hit them so hard that you would be too sore for your squat and deadlift days. But um. 4 sets of standing single leg calf raises on a platform(the stretch is important). plus 4 sets of seated, then 3 standing will work. or alternatively you can go outside spend your 30 minutes with a weighted vest on, sprint outside, then finish up walking on the top of your toes until it burns then switching and walking on your heels.
But to be honest I think it’s best to find a way to squeeze it in your routine every other day or at least more frequently then once a week. I’m sure somewhere there is one person who can manage not to be too bummed out to do it, why can’t it be you?
hmmm, my main concern is, why does 3 exercises take you 2 and a half hours? I dont intend to analyze your program and its effectivness. But if your talking about adding in extra work and not being able to because of the length and intensity of the sessions, i simply have to question why 3 exercises takes you 2 hours and 30 minutes? that is what 50 minutes per exercise? perhaps the layout with numbers or something would help me better understand…
in any even if you still CANNOT add anything to these days i believe the advice 5-12 reps for 3-6 sets of 1-2 exercises posted above is the most solid recomendation. Ive always had great development when working biceps with multiple sets(5-6) of 3-4 reps for 1 exercise. For calves ive only seen them respond to volume. and i mean rediculous volume, so i really dont know how to give advice on them in the context of your training program
Airtruth,
You make a good point. Doing this work on another day that I don’t lift would allow me to recover everything else otherwise. Say calf work the day after a heavy squat / deadlift day would work perfectly. I could work biceps in at least twice a week.
Curodd, I’ll give you an example of my first day of sheiko for my next routine starting on Tuesday…
Squat:
20x10 (44 lbs)
75x5 (165 lbs)
115x5 (253 lbs)
140x4x2 (308 lbs)
160x3x2 (352 lbs) add squat briefs
185x3x5 (407 lbs) add belt & wraps
The warm up through 160 kilos takes about 25 minutes. If this is rushed, I’ll get crushed on the heavy sets. The sets of 185 kg require about 3 or 4 minutes of rest, so it always comes out to be 25 minutes or so.
My current squat max is 474 lbs (actually tested) @ 185 although I think Its closer to 484. My point is, work sets w/ almost 410 while only squatting 475 is taxing on the CNS wit this sort of volume.
I usually take a 5 or 10 minute break before moving on.
CG Bench:
20x20 (44 lbs)
45x10 (99 lbs)
70x5 (156 lbs)
85x4 (187 lbs)
100x3x2 (220 lbs)
112.5x3x5 (248 lbs)
This also takes decent rest periods as the heavy sets are taxing (around 80% of projected max).
Leg work:
Leg extensions: 90x10, 135x10, 180x10
Leg curls w/ plate: plate x 10x3 (not sure weight of plate yet)
At this point, I’m ready to just pass out and take a nap. The worksets are so taxing due to how close they are to a max that the body cannot recover like body builing workouts where the work sets are not as heavy (percentage wise). As well, I’m training for a 1RM. Different goal.
If you would like to hear it from the horse’s mouth, go over to purepowerlifting.com and listen to the Wade Hooper interviews. He throughly discusses Sheiko, its application, and specifically states how long the routine takes. Wade Hooper has won IPF Worlds for the past 10 years as a 165er, squatting in ithe high 700s, benching in the low to mid 500s and deadlifting in the high 500s or low to mid 600s and getting close to totaling 2000 lbs.