ME ME ME ME ME ME ME ME ME
[quote]asusvenus wrote:
[quote]wramsey wrote:
[quote]asusvenus wrote:
The amount of self entitlement in this thread is off the charts…
[/quote]
What about the gym owner? He thinks he’s entitled to $10 for one day at what is usually a shitty gym.
Btw, study some history. Empires weren’t built by a swell moralfag fellow coming upon new land and saying to the previous owner, “Good day, sir! May I vastly overpay for this territory?” No, they just fucking took it by force. You know, like what the Europeans did to Native Americans in North America. Something to think about…[/quote]
He IS entitled to whatever he wants to charge for it. He is NOT forcing you to go train at his gym. You have a choice to rip him off or not, he however, has no means to stop you. He could lower the price, but heck, you’d probably still go for a free ride anyways. I know I would.
Oh by the way, I don’t think I’m a moralfag, I’d just prefer if you said “fuck it, I don’t feel like paying for a a training session, I’m just gonna steal instead, and so fucking what” - Don’t go off blaming it on the owner.
[/quote]
Read the thread before you post. All your points have been covered. That IS exactly what I say. I also pirate movies and music and software. Who wants to cry about that, too? And I’m not blaming anything on the owner, simply saying think about it, he’s more entitled than anyone in this thread.
Entitlement usually means someone thinks they are owed something when they aren’t. I don’t think I’m owed a free workout, I think I can just fucking take a free workout. And I can and do.
As far as who is to blame, if it’s anyone I think it’s the resolutioners crowd who have zero discipline and would only pay the gym a few weeks per year unless they were forced in to signing a year contract. But I actually see it as them subsidizing the gym since they pay for a year and don’t even lift that much. Paying for a service they don’t use, which means everyone else has to pay less. Works out well when you frequent the same gym and have a membership that you actually use.
[quote]wramsey wrote:
[quote]asusvenus wrote:
The amount of self entitlement in this thread is off the charts…
[/quote]
What about the gym owner? He thinks he’s entitled to $10 for one day at what is usually a shitty gym.
Btw, study some history. Empires weren’t built by a swell moralfag fellow coming upon new land and saying to the previous owner, “Good day, sir! May I vastly overpay for this territory?” No, they just fucking took it by force. You know, like what the Europeans did to Native Americans in North America. Something to think about…[/quote]
Misdirection post is misdirecting.
It doesn’t matter how you attempt to justify your decision to hop the barrier, nor does it matter how trivial you think the action is…it is wrong and immoral
Here’s an idea. Have you ever just walked in, asked to speak to the manager, told them the situation, and asked if you could work out for free or at a discount?
I’ve worked out at three gyms away from home, two times for free, once for 50%.
If they wont do it, go somewhere else.
[quote]benos4752 wrote:
Here’s an idea. Have you ever just walked in, asked to speak to the manager, told them the situation, and asked if you could work out for free or at a discount?
I’ve worked out at three gyms away from home, two times for free, once for 50%.
If they wont do it, go somewhere else.[/quote]
I mentioned that earlier. I guess that’s not as cool as sticking it to The Man and walking in like you own the place.
[quote]wramsey wrote:
[quote]asusvenus wrote:
[quote]wramsey wrote:
[quote]asusvenus wrote:
The amount of self entitlement in this thread is off the charts…
[/quote]
What about the gym owner? He thinks he’s entitled to $10 for one day at what is usually a shitty gym.
Btw, study some history. Empires weren’t built by a swell moralfag fellow coming upon new land and saying to the previous owner, “Good day, sir! May I vastly overpay for this territory?” No, they just fucking took it by force. You know, like what the Europeans did to Native Americans in North America. Something to think about…[/quote]
He IS entitled to whatever he wants to charge for it. He is NOT forcing you to go train at his gym. You have a choice to rip him off or not, he however, has no means to stop you. He could lower the price, but heck, you’d probably still go for a free ride anyways. I know I would.
Oh by the way, I don’t think I’m a moralfag, I’d just prefer if you said “fuck it, I don’t feel like paying for a a training session, I’m just gonna steal instead, and so fucking what” - Don’t go off blaming it on the owner.
[/quote]
Read the thread before you post. All your points have been covered. That IS exactly what I say. I also pirate movies and music and software. Who wants to cry about that, too? And I’m not blaming anything on the owner, simply saying think about it, he’s more entitled than anyone in this thread.
Entitlement usually means someone thinks they are owed something when they aren’t. I don’t think I’m owed a free workout, I think I can just fucking take a free workout. And I can and do.
As far as who is to blame, if it’s anyone I think it’s the resolutioners crowd who have zero discipline and would only pay the gym a few weeks per year unless they were forced in to signing a year contract. But I actually see it as them subsidizing the gym since they pay for a year and don’t even lift that much. Paying for a service they don’t use, which means everyone else has to pay less. Works out well when you frequent the same gym and have a membership that you actually use.
[/quote]
You’re right, I didn’t read the whole thread, I merely pointed that out.(My first point), my 2nd post is just me putting my meaning out, since you did reply to me.
"Entitlement usually means someone thinks they are owed something when they aren’t. I don’t think I’m owed a free workout, I think I can just fucking take a free workout. And I can and do. "
this is exactly what entitlement is. For some reason you think you are entitled to a free workout.
[quote]benos4752 wrote:
[quote]wramsey wrote:
Wow, it’s not hard to understand. You can be on T NATION and not buy any supplements. But don’t go around saying others are stealing when they do the same thing at a gym that you do on T NATION. The hypocrisy is the problem.[/quote]
The difference is that T NATION has decided to give those articles away for free, along with forum memberships. This isn’t the gyms MO though. They make their money by people coming in and paying to use the facility and equipment. So, yes, that is stealing. Until T NATION decides you have to buy ex-amount of Biotest product a month to be on the forums or read the articles, comparing the two is comparing apples and oranges.
[quote]wramsey wrote:
I wasn’t even comparing my gym to a commercial one as far as rules go. Just saying I had in fact run a gym since someone suggested I do that and see how I like the freeloaders. All the “freeloaders” weren’t a problem since they didn’t cost me anything. In fact, they made the place better, just as I do when I train at commercial gyms, whether I paid or not.[/quote]
So, in your mind, having equipment in your backyard and choosing to allow friends and families use it is the same as trying to run a business where you have to pay rent or lease, maintenance, payroll, insurance, etc on a monthly basis? And still trying to make an income for yourself?
[quote]wramsey wrote:
Btw, study some history. Empires weren’t built by a swell moralfag fellow coming upon new land and saying to the previous owner, “Good day, sir! May I vastly overpay for this territory?” No, they just fucking took it by force. You know, like what the Europeans did to Native Americans in North America. Something to think about…[/quote]
So, what? You’re waging a war of conquest against gyms across America? Is that what you’re trying to say?
You’re definitely a piece of work.[/quote]
How do you think T NATION makes money? By selling products, and THAT allows them to provide all the free content, forums, etc. They are providing it because they expect a return on their investment. Anyone who takes this value and doesn’t buy any supplements is stealing just the same as someone who works out at a gym for free. As others have said, sometimes you can get a free day trial at gyms, but again this is because they are hoping you will sign up for a year membership. When you don’t sign up it’s the same damn thing as not buying supplements here.
Call it stealing in both cases or just stfu. It doesn’t matter that T NATION gives you permission to access all their content for free. That’s even more reason to support them. They aren’t running a charity and someone who doesn’t buy many supplements yet reads the information and posts on the forum for years is MORE of a thief than someone who uses a gym for free for a day.
As far as my gym, I said I WASN’T trying to compare them. Someone else did.
And man, you have no idea how to extract the point from someone’s statement. My point about things being taken is that that’s how the world works, both on the large scale of continents or the small scale of a day of training at the gym. And that these abstract notions of “morality” are really just masturbation as the real world operates by a different set of rules ie might makes right.
[quote]ReignIB wrote:
"Entitlement usually means someone thinks they are owed something when they aren’t. I don’t think I’m owed a free workout, I think I can just fucking take a free workout. And I can and do. "
this is exactly what entitlement is. For some reason you think you are entitled to a free workout. [/quote]
I think I can work out for free. I do not think I am entitled to work out for free, in the sense that the gym OWES it to me. Like I don’t go up and demand to speak to the manager, and say they have to give me a free workout because of XYZ reason.
You don’t understand the word entitlement. It’s more than just thinking you can have something, it’s thinking that you should have it and that you deserve it as well.
[quote]benos4752 wrote:
Here’s an idea. Have you ever just walked in, asked to speak to the manager, told them the situation, and asked if you could work out for free or at a discount?
I’ve worked out at three gyms away from home, two times for free, once for 50%.
If they wont do it, go somewhere else.[/quote]
Read the thread. Yes, I have. It’s a waste of time.
[quote]wramsey wrote:
[quote]ReignIB wrote:
"Entitlement usually means someone thinks they are owed something when they aren’t. I don’t think I’m owed a free workout, I think I can just fucking take a free workout. And I can and do. "
this is exactly what entitlement is. For some reason you think you are entitled to a free workout. [/quote]
I think I can work out for free. I do not think I am entitled to work out for free, in the sense that the gym OWES it to me. Like I don’t go up and demand to speak to the manager, and say they have to give me a free workout because of XYZ reason.
You don’t understand the word entitlement. It’s more than just thinking you can have something, it’s thinking that you should have it and that you deserve it as well. [/quote]
k, so “you think you can work out for free” but you don’t think “you should be able to work out for free” or “you deserve to workout for free” ?
interesting. so what makes you “think” you can work out for free then?
[quote]soccerplayer wrote:
It doesn’t matter how you attempt to justify your decision to hop the barrier, nor does it matter how trivial you think the action is…it is wrong and immoral
[/quote]
Get some reading comprehension. I’m basically saying I don’t care that it’s “wrong and immoral”, not trying to justify it otherwise or trivializing it like it’s a small wrong so it’s ok.
[quote]ReignIB wrote:
[quote]wramsey wrote:
[quote]ReignIB wrote:
"Entitlement usually means someone thinks they are owed something when they aren’t. I don’t think I’m owed a free workout, I think I can just fucking take a free workout. And I can and do. "
this is exactly what entitlement is. For some reason you think you are entitled to a free workout. [/quote]
I think I can work out for free. I do not think I am entitled to work out for free, in the sense that the gym OWES it to me. Like I don’t go up and demand to speak to the manager, and say they have to give me a free workout because of XYZ reason.
You don’t understand the word entitlement. It’s more than just thinking you can have something, it’s thinking that you should have it and that you deserve it as well. [/quote]
k, so “you think you can work out for free” but you don’t think “you should be able to work out for free” or “you deserve to workout for free” ?
interesting. so what makes you “think” you can work out for free then?
[/quote]
Because I DO work out for free every fucking time I walk right by the front desk. I’m doing it because I don’t want to pay a bullshit price, not because I feel like a free workout is owed to me for being a special snowflake, or whatever.
[quote]wramsey wrote:
[quote]benos4752 wrote:
[quote]wramsey wrote:
Wow, it’s not hard to understand. You can be on T NATION and not buy any supplements. But don’t go around saying others are stealing when they do the same thing at a gym that you do on T NATION. The hypocrisy is the problem.[/quote]
The difference is that T NATION has decided to give those articles away for free, along with forum memberships. This isn’t the gyms MO though. They make their money by people coming in and paying to use the facility and equipment. So, yes, that is stealing. Until T NATION decides you have to buy ex-amount of Biotest product a month to be on the forums or read the articles, comparing the two is comparing apples and oranges.
[quote]wramsey wrote:
I wasn’t even comparing my gym to a commercial one as far as rules go. Just saying I had in fact run a gym since someone suggested I do that and see how I like the freeloaders. All the “freeloaders” weren’t a problem since they didn’t cost me anything. In fact, they made the place better, just as I do when I train at commercial gyms, whether I paid or not.[/quote]
So, in your mind, having equipment in your backyard and choosing to allow friends and families use it is the same as trying to run a business where you have to pay rent or lease, maintenance, payroll, insurance, etc on a monthly basis? And still trying to make an income for yourself?
[quote]wramsey wrote:
Btw, study some history. Empires weren’t built by a swell moralfag fellow coming upon new land and saying to the previous owner, “Good day, sir! May I vastly overpay for this territory?” No, they just fucking took it by force. You know, like what the Europeans did to Native Americans in North America. Something to think about…[/quote]
So, what? You’re waging a war of conquest against gyms across America? Is that what you’re trying to say?
You’re definitely a piece of work.[/quote]
How do you think T NATION makes money? By selling products, and THAT allows them to provide all the free content, forums, etc. They are providing it because they expect a return on their investment. Anyone who takes this value and doesn’t buy any supplements is stealing just the same as someone who works out at a gym for free. As others have said, sometimes you can get a free day trial at gyms, but again this is because they are hoping you will sign up for a year membership. When you don’t sign up it’s the same damn thing as not buying supplements here.
Call it stealing in both cases or just stfu. It doesn’t matter that T NATION gives you permission to access all their content for free. That’s even more reason to support them. They aren’t running a charity and someone who doesn’t buy many supplements yet reads the information and posts on the forum for years is MORE of a thief than someone who uses a gym for free for a day.
As far as my gym, I said I WASN’T trying to compare them. Someone else did.
And man, you have no idea how to extract the point from someone’s statement. My point about things being taken is that that’s how the world works, both on the large scale of continents or the small scale of a day of training at the gym. And that these abstract notions of “morality” are really just masturbation as the real world operates by a different set of rules ie might makes right.
[/quote]
I understand how T-Nation makes money. What I said is they CHOOSE to provide free information. Of course they want you to buy their products, but they don’t require payment. There in lies the difference. T-Nation is choosing to give this info, the gym isn’t choosing to let you work out for free OR pay, they have a rule, pay to use the facility, a rule that your self-entitled ass is choosing to break.
Reading a freely provided article is not stealing. Stealing would be me taking articles from a site you have to pay to read and putting it online for people to download. Ask any lawyer, I promise you, they will tell you that reading an article provided online for free by the choice of the company is not stealing. However, walking into a gym and ignoring the fact that you have to pay to workout there is.
But you did compare your gym. You said, quote, ‘I wasn’t even comparing my gym to a commercial one as far as rules go. Just saying I had in fact run a gym since someone suggested I do that and see how I like the freeloaders’ So yes, you weren’t comparing rules, but you said that you ran a gym. No, you had some gym equipment that you let your friends use for free, those are not the same things. But, you claim to have ran a gym, so apparently you think they are.
How did I not extract the point from your statement? ‘things being taken is that that’s how the world works, both on the large scale of continents or the small scale of a day of training at the gym’ to me, it looks like you feel those are two equal things.
Grow up man.
I just walk in and if they say anything to me I say “Not now chief, I’m in the f**king zone!”
[quote]wramsey wrote:
[quote]ReignIB wrote:
[quote]wramsey wrote:
[quote]ReignIB wrote:
"Entitlement usually means someone thinks they are owed something when they aren’t. I don’t think I’m owed a free workout, I think I can just fucking take a free workout. And I can and do. "
this is exactly what entitlement is. For some reason you think you are entitled to a free workout. [/quote]
I think I can work out for free. I do not think I am entitled to work out for free, in the sense that the gym OWES it to me. Like I don’t go up and demand to speak to the manager, and say they have to give me a free workout because of XYZ reason.
You don’t understand the word entitlement. It’s more than just thinking you can have something, it’s thinking that you should have it and that you deserve it as well. [/quote]
k, so “you think you can work out for free” but you don’t think “you should be able to work out for free” or “you deserve to workout for free” ?
interesting. so what makes you “think” you can work out for free then?
[/quote]
Because I DO work out for free every fucking time I walk right by the front desk. I’m doing it because I don’t want to pay a bullshit price, not because I feel like a free workout is owed to me for being a special snowflake, or whatever. [/quote]
I’m not asking whether you can physically pull it off and not get kicked out.
I’m trying to figure out what is your reasoning for believing you are entitled to a free workout. So far the only reason you came up with is “bullshit price”.
Is that all?
[quote]benos4752 wrote:
[quote]wramsey wrote:
[quote]benos4752 wrote:
[quote]wramsey wrote:
Wow, it’s not hard to understand. You can be on T NATION and not buy any supplements. But don’t go around saying others are stealing when they do the same thing at a gym that you do on T NATION. The hypocrisy is the problem.[/quote]
The difference is that T NATION has decided to give those articles away for free, along with forum memberships. This isn’t the gyms MO though. They make their money by people coming in and paying to use the facility and equipment. So, yes, that is stealing. Until T NATION decides you have to buy ex-amount of Biotest product a month to be on the forums or read the articles, comparing the two is comparing apples and oranges.
[quote]wramsey wrote:
I wasn’t even comparing my gym to a commercial one as far as rules go. Just saying I had in fact run a gym since someone suggested I do that and see how I like the freeloaders. All the “freeloaders” weren’t a problem since they didn’t cost me anything. In fact, they made the place better, just as I do when I train at commercial gyms, whether I paid or not.[/quote]
So, in your mind, having equipment in your backyard and choosing to allow friends and families use it is the same as trying to run a business where you have to pay rent or lease, maintenance, payroll, insurance, etc on a monthly basis? And still trying to make an income for yourself?
[quote]wramsey wrote:
Btw, study some history. Empires weren’t built by a swell moralfag fellow coming upon new land and saying to the previous owner, “Good day, sir! May I vastly overpay for this territory?” No, they just fucking took it by force. You know, like what the Europeans did to Native Americans in North America. Something to think about…[/quote]
So, what? You’re waging a war of conquest against gyms across America? Is that what you’re trying to say?
You’re definitely a piece of work.[/quote]
How do you think T NATION makes money? By selling products, and THAT allows them to provide all the free content, forums, etc. They are providing it because they expect a return on their investment. Anyone who takes this value and doesn’t buy any supplements is stealing just the same as someone who works out at a gym for free. As others have said, sometimes you can get a free day trial at gyms, but again this is because they are hoping you will sign up for a year membership. When you don’t sign up it’s the same damn thing as not buying supplements here.
Call it stealing in both cases or just stfu. It doesn’t matter that T NATION gives you permission to access all their content for free. That’s even more reason to support them. They aren’t running a charity and someone who doesn’t buy many supplements yet reads the information and posts on the forum for years is MORE of a thief than someone who uses a gym for free for a day.
As far as my gym, I said I WASN’T trying to compare them. Someone else did.
And man, you have no idea how to extract the point from someone’s statement. My point about things being taken is that that’s how the world works, both on the large scale of continents or the small scale of a day of training at the gym. And that these abstract notions of “morality” are really just masturbation as the real world operates by a different set of rules ie might makes right.
[/quote]
I understand how T-Nation makes money. What I said is they CHOOSE to provide free information. Of course they want you to buy their products, but they don’t require payment. There in lies the difference. T-Nation is choosing to give this info, the gym isn’t choosing to let you work out for free OR pay, they have a rule, pay to use the facility, a rule that your self-entitled ass is choosing to break.
Reading a freely provided article is not stealing. Stealing would be me taking articles from a site you have to pay to read and putting it online for people to download. Ask any lawyer, I promise you, they will tell you that reading an article provided online for free by the choice of the company is not stealing. However, walking into a gym and ignoring the fact that you have to pay to workout there is.
But you did compare your gym. You said, quote, ‘I wasn’t even comparing my gym to a commercial one as far as rules go. Just saying I had in fact run a gym since someone suggested I do that and see how I like the freeloaders’ So yes, you weren’t comparing rules, but you said that you ran a gym. No, you had some gym equipment that you let your friends use for free, those are not the same things. But, you claim to have ran a gym, so apparently you think they are.
How did I not extract the point from your statement? ‘things being taken is that that’s how the world works, both on the large scale of continents or the small scale of a day of training at the gym’ to me, it looks like you feel those are two equal things.
Grow up man.[/quote]
Not sure if troll. I’ll play along though. Obviously I don’t give a fuck if reading shit for free without buying supplements is technically stealing or not. I don’t think it is, strictly speaking. The point is that it’s more of a douchebag thing to do than work out at a gym for free for a day rather than pay a ridiculous fee. Both are douchebaggy but don’t try to act like one is perfectly fine and the other isn’t simply because Biotest is cool enough to make the information and forum free. You’re taking value and not providing any in return, period.
Go read the original post where I talk about running a gym. The guy said to start my own gym and see how I like the freeloaders like myself. I said I actually know what it’s like and I didn’t mind it at all. Just as most gyms don’t give a fuck that I work out for free, since I don’t cost them anything and would simply not lift before I paid $10.
And equal things? lol they are both examples of might making right, very different examples and no way equal. That’s the point of giving more than one example, it adds to the general point in a different way.
Your “grow up man” ending proves the point made earlier, that people just want to feel superior. You’re real mature, bro. Maybe one day I can aspire to your heights.
[quote]Jokerz wrote:
I just walk in and if they say anything to me I say “Not now chief, I’m in the f**king zone!”[/quote]
haha I should have added that to the list:
- Make sure you have a new haircut
[quote]ReignIB wrote:
[quote]wramsey wrote:
[quote]ReignIB wrote:
[quote]wramsey wrote:
[quote]ReignIB wrote:
"Entitlement usually means someone thinks they are owed something when they aren’t. I don’t think I’m owed a free workout, I think I can just fucking take a free workout. And I can and do. "
this is exactly what entitlement is. For some reason you think you are entitled to a free workout. [/quote]
I think I can work out for free. I do not think I am entitled to work out for free, in the sense that the gym OWES it to me. Like I don’t go up and demand to speak to the manager, and say they have to give me a free workout because of XYZ reason.
You don’t understand the word entitlement. It’s more than just thinking you can have something, it’s thinking that you should have it and that you deserve it as well. [/quote]
k, so “you think you can work out for free” but you don’t think “you should be able to work out for free” or “you deserve to workout for free” ?
interesting. so what makes you “think” you can work out for free then?
[/quote]
Because I DO work out for free every fucking time I walk right by the front desk. I’m doing it because I don’t want to pay a bullshit price, not because I feel like a free workout is owed to me for being a special snowflake, or whatever. [/quote]
I’m not asking whether you can physically pull it off and not get kicked out.
I’m trying to figure out what is your reasoning for believing you are entitled to a free workout. So far the only reason you came up with is “bullshit price”.
Is that all?
[/quote]
You’re pretty dense. I don’t believe I’m entitled. I do it simply because I can get away with it. I need no other reason or justification. The only “reason” is not to spend $10.
It’s a bullshit price, that’s for sure. But that’s not why I do it. I do it because I can.