Hey guys, new to the forums and looking for a bit of advice.
I’ve been lifting for about 4 years and have always had trouble bringing up my squat numbers. I’ve tried various types of progression over the years and have found no fix.
My current t.m. for the four lifts are
Press 180
Deadlift 375
Bench 270
Squat 290
What happens typically is that when my 1 rep max approaches 320 it stalls and even regresses.
I’ve tried identifying specific weak points but the reality is, I just suck at squatting.
I’m currently in my 6th cycle of 531 bbb, and already reset all my training maxes back 2 cycles. All my other lifts are progressing, but as always my squat stalled and regressed.
If you want to be better at handling heavier weights, spend more time with heavier weights. 6 cycles of BBB is a long time with light weights. Go do First Set Last or Second Set Last.
I may be committing a heretical sin here. But I added 20KGs to my squat in 4 weeks doing Thibs “Hepburn Layering for Strength and Size” from his Thibarmy blog. Just sayin
How long have you been squatting consistently? You said you have been lifting for 4 years but I wondering if you have been squatting for that long, and how frequently. It appears your pressing numbers are much proportionally higher than lower body lifts. Did you just put more time into them initially, or are you just a naturally strong presser?
How long have you been running 5/3/1 total? And has it been mainly BBB? I echo T3hPwnisher, you probably need to switch up your supplemental plan. You have been using a hypertrophy focused template for quite a while. Perhaps its time to bump up the weights accumulate some volume at a higher intensity. Teach that newly built muscle how to contract with more force.
The stronger you get the more often you have to do this. Might as well get used to this now. Can you squat your Training Max for 3-5 solid reps? Perhaps even if your resetting it, your not reducing it enough. Though it may seems like a setback, a big decrease can allow you do focus on refining your technique while not having to fight the weights.
Also if you squat TM is too high BBB would probably do more harm than good. How difficult are the 5x10 sets?
How much are you eating? is your recovery in check? Perhaps you aren’t progressing because you aren’t gaining muscle or recovering hard enough (eating enough).
Go check out Jim’s blog post on Building the Monolith. Scroll down to the eating section - now go eat like that. I guarantee that if you continue to do BBB in the squat and eat like a champ, your numbers will explode.
How much do you weigh? 290 pounds is not a lot for a guy like me (40 years old, 220 pounds). But if you’re a 150 pounds soaking wet you’re very close to a 2X body weight squat - not too shabby.
Lastly, don’t get caught up in the numbers. Just keep pushing away and make sure you’re eating enough. Stick with the same TM for 3-4 cycles, do not increase it. Work on speed, do not grind reps and recover hard. No one cares how deep you squat unless you’re competing. A video wont help here - just get close to parallel and make sure your stance is wide enough that your thighs aren’t touching your chest in the hole. If you want to bring up your squat, doing boring but big isn’t necessarily going to get your 1RM higher. If you want to increase your 1RM, do the original 5/3/1 with an 85-90% TM. Go for PR sets each week in the squat and eat like a champ. We only lift 4-6 hours a week, but we eat 2-3 hours a day - make sure you’re eating enough during those times.
I started training about 4 years ago doing the big three 3 times weekly, and even then my bench was roughly equal to my squat, so I was just naturally a stronger presser. For my first year of training my squat barely progressed.
I’ve been running 531 for 8 months, BBB the entire time. After I finish this cycle I think I’m going to move over to FSL and switch to the 6 week cycle since I’ve been following the 4 week for quite a while.
This Friday I’m testing my t.m. and see how many reps I can get. I do know that I need to set my max back a few cycles, perhaps working with a higher percentage with the 5x5 I can push through this wall.
I’m eating a lot with plenty of protein, and I’m still gaining weight. When I started 531
I weighed in at 205 and now I’m up to 211.
Body fat hasn’t changed much.
It probably couldn’t hurt to up the calories again though.
What kind of speed should I be aiming for?
I’ve always put a lot focus on the eccentric (about 3 seconds)and not letting the weight force me into the hole, and then explode out of it as fast as I can.
Thanks man, I’m going to give that a shot. I think I’ve milked BBB for what its worth, for now.
I’m not familiar with second set last, is it the same as FSL with same number of sets and reps?
I only own the first book but its becoming apparent I should by Beyond or Forever.
just focus on lifting the explosively, it doesn’t matter how long you take to go down to the hole unless you’re body building.
I would stick with the same TM for a few cycles or even dial it back. You should be able to do your 95% set on 5/3/1 week for 5 strong reps, hell I can do mine for 10+. So if you’re using a TM that’s too high it might be stalling your progress.
Others have chimed in on options for changing from BBB, like to 5x5 First Set Last, or 5x5 Second Set Last, Boring But Strong (10 sets of 5), or whatever, and that seems like the exact right strategy. I would just note that if you are making progress on the other lifts, you might want to stay the course with them. You can, for instance, do FSL for squat, but keep BBB for the pressing movements. Wendler has written in a number of places that it will often make sense to mix and match when you find that the lifts respond well to different plans.
BBB has never really helped move my squat strength up dramatically. If I want to raise my squat, I’ll set my TM at a weight with which I could do 5-6 strong, fast reps and do 5s pro with SSL. And then for the anchor hit a or set, possibly a joker set 1-2 of the weeks with 3-5 FSL.
Many good suggestions here. Changing the supplemental work, sticking to the same TM for multiple cycles and so on.
About this:
This might (or not) be relevant.
It’s ok to mind the tempo on down sets at lower %s, but I think that doing the strength work while paying attention to the tempo could hold you back a bit eventually. At least, I know I wouldn’t be able to focus properly on the lift being done if I was focused on doing an n-seconds descent at every rep.
Juggernaut covers this part in one of their squat pillars videos, the one about the descent. What you want to achieve is a speed descent that is as fast as possible while allowing you to stay tight through the whole movement and make good use of the stretch reflex. How fast you actually descend is highly individual.
This means that a 3 seconds descent might be just right, or too fast or even too slow for you if you picked “3 seconds” as an arbitrary tempo.
If you haven’t, you might want to play around a bit finding your optimal descent speed and stick at least for the main work, you can keep the slow negatives and paused reps for the backoff sets eventually.
Also, I started squatting very recently since I’ve always done front squats before and I think that back squatting has much more variability involved. There wasn’t much choice with the rack position and grip width in front squats, so it mostly came down to stance width and feet orientation and that’s it.
For squats, there’s more room to play around and see (with some trial and error) what works best for you.
Tweaking technique might help you find your best leverages, that is, moving your stance wider or closer, putting the bar higher or lower on your back, your grip wider or narrower, see if you’re stronger by breaking at the hips first during the movement or breaking at the hips and knees at the same time.
Unless you’re training to compete (in a specific sport or in a weightlifting sport), it doesn’t really matter how you squat as long as you do it safely and progress, it will make you stronger.
In the big picture it doesn’t really matter much if you squat powerlifting style with a wide stance and sitting back just to parallel or if you squat olympic style with your torso vertical and your ass an inch above the floor.
Another thing I’ve read recently (on StrongerByScience, in their article about why most people can deadlift more than they squat) is that a lot of people naturally brace much better in the deadlift position than in the squat position. Paid attention to it in my last few sessions and holy shit, noticed it’s true.
While it’s true that I’m built MUCH better to pull than to squat, I noticed that bracing (air into the back and all that) comes naturally when I set up for the deadlift vs when I set up for the squat, even if I try to be as careful as possible to brace during the squat. This might be worth looking into, since the ability to brace and stay tight is primary when it comes to progress in moving weights.