I’m new here, and feel totally overwhelmed with all the information out there. I’ve been voraciously reading through topics on these forums, but still feel like I have no idea where to start. Here’s a little background on what I’m trying to accomplish:
I’m currently 34 years old, and 6 ft, 195 lbs. I lift usually 5 days/week. In the last 14 months since I seriously started lifting again, I’ve put on about 20 lbs, mostly muscle. However, my weight seems to have plateaued about 4 or 5 months ago, and I’m struggling to gain any more size.
If I wanted to add, say, 15-20 lbs of muscle, how much testosterone would I realistically need to take? Apoligies if this is a stupid question…as I said, I’m still trying to take all this info in. Thanks in advance!
What are your Macros and caloric intake? What is your estimated TDEE? Seems like a simple fix to add more calories. Do you have a firm nutrition plan?
This is too broad of a question. Also, you’ve been working out barely over a year. Thats a drop of water in a bucket. Do you really want to turn to steroids already or at all? What is your baseline TT/FT level? Increasing your T levels will add ‘some’ weight but in my experience is highly dependent on your genetics. The amount of weight you add is also going to be higher if you start out underweight. At 6’ tall, if youre athletic amount of BF, you are not very underweight. Meaning to add 15-20lbs (not all muscle, thats borderline impossible) you would adding a lot of unwanted weight too. The slower you add the weight, the more able you are to maintain a positive BF/lean gain ratio.
I should have given a little more background: I’ve worked out since I was in high school, but it’s been on and off in terms of how consistent I’ve been over the years. When I get into lifting, it’s all or nothing - no in between. I’m ADHD and tend to get hyperfocused on it. In other words, I am no stranger to the gym, haha. I am already the strongest and biggest I’ve ever been currently, but I very much want to push myself to the next level.
Admittedly, I don’t track my caloric intake religiously, but it’s something I’m certainly willing to start doing. Here’s a couple pics of my current build, if it helps:
You have a great starting physique for a cut IMO versus another bulk. Honestly you look like you would weigh more than 195lbs to me at 6’. Size appears good, I would focus more on leaning down another 2-3% to get some more definition and show the outline of those abs. Just me. If you do want to bulk more you would absolutely need to track your calories and Macros (daily). Thats what has helped me the most when setting and making weight/physique goals.
If bulking with Test is truly what you want to do, most people run 500mg of long ester Test C/E for their first go about. You WILL NOT gain 15-20lbs of muscle although you ‘may’ gain 15+ lbs of BW. Heres the bad news… when you stop you will lose a good portion of your new tissue as your hormones revert back to baseline.
15-20 lbs of actual muscle on somebody who already clearly trains is a tall order.
15-20 lbs of actual muscle would be somewhere around a 25-35 lbs increase realistically in actual bodyweight.
Are you natural currently?
For reference, I started out at your height and 240 lbs before touching any drugs. I would say my genetics are on the high side for gaining muscle and even enhanced with many more compounds than just test - 15-20 lbs is a pipedream with just normal levels of test unless you are talking years down the road with a lot of work and diet.
We don’t all have the same goals, and that is fine. I think examining goals is important here. What do you want the 215-220 lbs to look like? Where you are now for body fat is about the maximum that I’d want at the end of a cycle / blast in which I was bulking. If you gain 20 lbs on a test cycle, you will almost for sure look worse to almost everyone than you do now. Maybe you don’t care and just want to be big and strong? I ask, because we aren’t all the same. If you did a cut and got pretty lean, then did a cycle to up to 200 lbs, but were 3-4% less on body fat, that would look really good to most people, and that is more in line with what I’d do.
That’s a good question; I guess similar body fat % (maybe slightly less), but more muscle/bigger all around, especially in my legs? I don’t necessarily feel the need to be super toned.
Something to keep in mind is that “maybe slightly less” usually has a look attached to it in the mind. The amount of weight needed to be lost for that look is usually more than people expect. I’ve been there. Thinking my abs would really be popping if I lost 10 lbs. Then I lose 10 lbs and basically just look flat and worse. The look I had in my mind required about double the weight loss that I was expecting.
Another thing to keep in mind is that during a cycle in which you want to add muscle, you need to be eating to reap the benefits of the gear. You want to gain weight. Even with gear, it won’t be all muscle (unless you are an underweight teen on Tren, which you are not). I’ve heard several of my gym buddies say they think they’ve lost fat and gained muscle with a basic Test cycle. They didn’t. They weren’t in great condition to start off with, which makes evaluating BF% tough to do. I think their chest, shoulders and back got a bit bigger and so did their waist. The growth of the yolk area made them perceive their waist as smaller I think is what happened.
So if you want to be a bit leaner than you are now, you need to be even leaner than that at the beginning of the cycle to end the cycle where you want, since you will put a bit of fat on during the cycle.
I really appreciate the thorough response - it all makes a lot of sense.
If I was to do a cycle, what do you think would be a reasonable amount for my first time? I’ve been reading that 500mg/week is a pretty standard amount? At the same time, though, part of me might be more comfortable starting low just to see how my body reacts to it in terms of side affects and all. Any advice?
Now I could be way off base, but from a visual perspective I see only four goals that are reasonable:
Look huge
Look better in clothes
Look better naked
Competitive bodybuilding
You have achieved looking better in clothes by a good ways. If it were me “looking huge” is not more important than looking good naked.
IMO, get a leaner look before focusing on adding more muscle, but if done patiently, you should be able to add some muscle while loosing some fat. I say that because it looks like you have the genetics to be capable of doing that. Some people don’t have a chance in the world of gaining muscle and loosing fat at the same time (providing that they have been training the last 12 months.) Your delts “speak” very good genetics (providing they are not AAS stimulated.)
Lean up at least to the point where your abs start obviously showing, and your front double biceps shows separation between your biceps and triceps. Please forgive me, but your front double biceps looks terrible.
Well, when you eat in a surplus while taking gear, the percent of muscle you gain is related to the dose. You can gain 20 lbs on 250 mg/wk Test or 2500 mg/wk Test, but the the portion of the 20 lbs that is muscle will be significantly better with the latter. However, you will be more likely to experience negative side effects (both cosmetic and long term health) with the latter.
I believe around 500 mg/wk is kinda the sweet spot for a first cycle. It has a good balance of muscle gains with a fairly low chance of significant negatives. Also remember while doing a cycle you will go off after and recover with a PCT. Most lose some gains during that period. The shutdown from 250 mg/wk and 500 mg/wk will be roughly the same. The recovery period will be roughly the same too. I’d want to make sure the gains were worth it considering I’ll have roughly the same experience recovering from both doses, and I want to walk away with more gains. So, I’d go 400-500 mg/wk. Just my opinion, and my take on the risk / reward analysis one should do when considering a cycle
I see what you mean from the picture I posted. I think it was partially the lighting, though. Here’s a picture I just took that shows some separation (at least on the right side where the light isn’t fully hitting it, haha). I also have very long arms relative to my height, and have never had really big bicep peaks - I don’t know if that makes a difference in achieving the separation you mentioned.
Makes sense. I think just to be on the safer side, I would start with 400mg. I need to do some more research and get my bloodwork done first, though, before I start anything. And figure out how/where to get it in the first place, lol.
IMO, and it is only mine, but I could not stand carrying the extra fat, partly because didn’t have to.
Please note that very few people that I have seen approach improvement the method I used. Once I got a little muscle I was competing about three times a year, so I never carried more fat than about eight weeks out from a contest.
The first three are my goals… although, as I continue to progress, I might not be opposed to trying competitive bodybuilding. I’ve never really though about it, to be honest.
I’ve also never actually tried cutting. I used to be very defined when I was younger (mid-20s) simply due to having an insanely high metabolism paired with a lot of lifting. Below are some pics from what I consider the best shape I’ve been in overall. I was 25 in those pictures, I believe. I’d certainly love to have that definition again, but at the same time, I don’t want to lose a lot of size. I want to say I was around 175 lbs there.
