Lifts: Bench 225 for 24, 345 for 4
Squat 275 for 20 (I don’t go any heavier due to disc injuries from years past)
Current Protocol: TRT 105mg/week Test C (3 injections @35mg)
I was on TRT a decade ago in my mid 30s (prolactinoma had caused low t levels discovered in my early 30s)…decided to hop off after 18 months. About 18 months AGO, I decided it was time to embrace the TRT path once again (this time, for life).
Oddly enough, even with very low T levels (150-200), I was always able to lift reasonably heavy and put on decent muscle mass (for a natty). I haven’t seen an appreciable difference in my lifts or muscle mass on TRT now, or back then, as compared to being off TRT.
Since I have plenty of Test C at my disposal, I’ve been pondering the possibility of doing my first-ever cycle (350-400mg/week of Test C for 12 weeks). The question that has me going back and forth on the idea is how much I would stand to make in terms of gains (assuming diet is on point). I have been lifting for >30yrs. It’s safe to say that I’ve reached my genetic potential.
Would any gains be marginal, at best? How much of it could I still hold onto after the 12 weeks and returning to TRT levels?
Please do it. And log it on here. I would love to see this.
If you train exclusively with compound movements, eat a fuck ton, and sleep like a newborn, you could easily put on 25-30 pounds in your first cycle, with about half of it keepable on TRT.
That sounds extremely tempting. Extremely. I think I’ll want to procure some ADEX (just in case), though I don’t tend to have E2 problems (generally 30-35 pg/mL while at ~750-850 TT)
I call BS. Big time. Unless OP wants to count water weight.
OP, you’ve got a great physique for any age, but especially for mid-40s. You’ve already got some spinal issues. Unless you’re going to compete at the end of it, what’s the point of a single cycle? At your age and with your long lifting hx, you’re not going to gain 12# of lean mass (in 12 weeks!) running 400 of test C, much less keep it when you go off. At best you’ll be a few pounds heavier–unless you eat a “fuck ton,” in which case you’ll get fat.
You’re in a great position regarding your physique and health. I don’t think it’s worthwhile to risk it.
I’m in the middle (6 weeks) of a 360mg test C only blast and so far I’m underwhelmed. My strength has gone up, but don’t notice any real change in weight beyond the 7 lbs of water I gained (and that goes up and down). My plan was to stay on this for 12 weeks but now I’m going to up my dose to 480mg and go to 20 weeks.
History: TRT 180mg weekly, many cycles before, eating 500 cal above maintenance and working out 5-6 nights a week, version of PPL with high volume.
Your first cycle you may get more out of the lower dose, but you’re already in great shape, so may need a little more to see a big increase. As someone else said, depending on long term goals, one cycle may not be worth it for you. But I think the experience alone could be beneficial
Its impossible to guess how that would work as we know there are people who gain a lot on tiny bit, and people who dont gain shit on a fuckton.
Your genetics are very good, and it seems that you know what you are doing in the gym, so you definetly can and should try.
I believe you have all the prerequisites to have a good cycle and do very well on it.
I would also like for updates and pictures to know how is it going for you.
This was kinda my experience. It did help with being leaner with the same amount of muscle. IMO, you won’t gain a ton on 400 mg/wk for 12 weeks. You are fairly developed, which makes it harder. You also didn’t see much improvement when you multiplied your Testosterone levels by 4X.
You may be like me. The upside is that the gains you make if you are like me don’t fall off when not on the higher levels. I think for me it is a long game. I was expecting a big change when I did my first blast at 325 mg/wk I was let down. Over time though, my physique has changed though (I am on my third blast, with TRT / cruise in between).
Those levels made a world of difference in my energy, libido, hardon quality, mental clarity and motivation…but no meaningful impact on my lifts, musculature or recovery.
I suspect it may be the case that I built up to my genetic potential in my teens and early 20s…when my prolactinoma issues had not yet arisen.
Yeah, I am uncertain. But to illustrate my point, I’ll attach photos from August 2013 , which was ~18-20 months after I had quit TRT after my first foray into the TRT world. My TT levels at that time had dropped down to the 200-300 range.
I am about 8lbs leaner (~179), and the lightning is different, but my lifts were essentially the same. My physique is very similar to today.
I would also ask yourself can your tendons and joints take the sort of beating required to maximize a cycle at this point? 25+ years in the iron game adds up on even the best of us.
I don’t understand this question. If you can train smart and hard and make gains as a natty, you can train smart and hard as an enhanced lifter.
I hear of stories of people experiencing rapid strength gains and getting injured… but this dudes been lifting so long he’s not going to see that outside of running something super serious/harsh. Definitely won’t on a “low” dose test blast.
I’m 29, so I can’t predict where my mindset will be at 40+ after a decade of training, but, I’d blast the hell out of some test and see what happens. He’s already on TRT and obviously knows how to eat/train/recover. This is just icing on the cake.
While I don’t think he will blow up (same as your thinking), it it’s Imo worth the risk for the icing on the cake. If he had good natural test numbers, then I would think differently, but a pretty safe blast on trt, why not.
Whether it’s worth it is an individualstic choice to make
Does op have a wife, kids, family dependent on him? These two variables ought to factor in heavily because it’s very rarely ‘just one blast’.
@Downward_Spiral how much can you deadlift, OHP? How many pull-ups can you do? How far can you run without getting tired?
These questions aren’t quite relevant to the topic at hand, rather I’m curious to know what you are capable of following twenty five years of regimented training.
One cycle, provided you are a healthy adult male without undiagnosed cardiac defects, clotting disorders, familial hypercholesterolemia etc appears to be relatively harmless. Cumulative use catches up to people.
I highly doubt you’re going to take twenty years off your lifespan because you ran a few test cycles in your 30’s/40’s… there is no free lunch as to say, but there is a spectrum of risk. The guy using a bit of primo every now and again provided genetic baseline is equitable isn’t going to incur an amount of damage remotely close to the guy using test, tren, winny, GH, Clen and insulin.
I don’t run much, tbh. For cardio I’ll use my incline treadmill for SS or HIIT. I did a 5k a couple years back and my time was 18-19 minutes, I think. I was always more oriented towards sprinting and pole vault when I was in Track/Field in High School. I also played college football. Definitely a fast twitch guy.
Deadlifts: I was never very good at this lift from a technique standpoint and, in fact, it was how I incurred my disc issues years ago. From what I recall, I’d use similar poundage as my squats (which always felt natural to me…but to this day I still play it safe with how heavy I’ll go with squatting).
Standing OHP - I’ll generally lift in the 185-195lbs x 8-10. Seated DB Militaries I’ll use 90s/100s dumbbells for 6-10.
Pullups - 23-26 unweighted. I’ll generally strap on a weight vest and/or dip belt for these though. Weighted Pullups/Chinups and plate-loaded pulls on this bastard are my main Back exercises (with a very rare attempt at barbell rows):
Again, guys, thanks for the feedback and thoughts. I have about a month or so before I’ll make a go/no-go decision on this. One other thing I am keeping in mind is my prolactin levels (the original reason I hopped on TRT) - Once my T levels creep up much further than they get on my current dosage (I have tried 120 and 140mg/weekly in the past), my PRL levels rise as well, and caber (which I am prescribed)really stops working to bring the levels down in range. I didn’t have this issue back on my original TRT run, but back then I was using Adex (prescribed)…which I no longer use in my protocol.
I’ve read the elevated PRL levels are possibly due to the corresponding rise in E2 levels (that have, themselves, come about from the elevated TT levels).
For 12 weeks, I’d manage, but I’d probably not be having much sex…as erections become a memory once I climb above range with my PRL levels.
