Every time I read this guys stuff I scratch my head and say huh ? He once claimed to be a psychic channel and that he channelled nature . Well , I must say i find something about his ideas appealing . I don’t like the modern once or twice a week for each body part system . I like the style of Grimek , Pearl , Reeves and gironda . Oh yeah , also that Schwarzenneger guy . I like the monday wednesday and friday style of training the whole body .
Gironda was training like this and winning contests at age 46 . How ? At 30 I couldnt add a pound to my curls or lateral raises . Is the trick to train at a lower intensity that skirts the edges of failure perhaps ? And three meals a day ? Are we over complicating things in the modern age ?
I think so.
i’m gonna say ridiclous genetics along with drug use.
Having trained at Vince’s for a while back in the 80’s, and having seen him not only work out himself but train a bunch of other people in that time, I can safely say that he NEVER would have used drugs. In fact, on more than one occasion he tossed guys out of his gym (not literally) for using steroids or for coming in in a bloated condition caused by misuse of diuretics, etc. Nor were his genetics that great. Basically, Vince just knew more than anyone else about bodybuilding and nutrition. He was a surly old guy when people would argue with him, but I guess decades of having to listen to Weider et al become the mainstream would have that effect on someone who knew better. I made more progress in 6 months at Vince’s Gym than I had in 6 years previously, and that was more or less just by osmosis. (Unfortunately, I didn’t have the money at the time for any of his personal training. To my eternal regret.) The only thing I’ve seen in my 20+ years in this sport to rival Vince’s stuff is right here on this website - and remember that T-Mag is a compliation of a number of experts in different fields. Vince had it all in his head. Another old guy named Nick who used to be a personal trainer at Vince’s said it best one day when talking to a new guy in the gym who was wondering about Vince’s knowledge (Vince was not present for this conversation): “Vince has forgotten more about bodybuilding than anyone else is going to know for a while.”
Chris, sound really great. I’ve heard a lot of great things about him. What was his nutritional rules in terms of getting lean. I know he recommended high fat and I believe lower carbs from vegetables and fruit. I’d love to hear more about the nutritional aspect and what type of results did you see people get from his suggestions.
Chris, it would be cool to hear some more details about how he trained guys.
Well, I’ll be the last to say that I’m an expert on Vince’s training methods and philosophy. But I’ll try. Yes, he did like high-fat/protein dieting (he used to recommend having a dinner of steak or hamburger and leafy greens) with a carb meal every four or five days, but there were a lot of other diets that he used for specific effects. (He specifically said that no one diet was “best” and should be followed forever.) Vince recommended supplementing with loads of different (natural) stuff as well - fish oils being high on the list. As far as workouts go, he often pushed what he called his “honest workout”: 8 sets of 8 reps. Any of this sound familiar? So basically he was about 40-50 years ahead of his time, doing T-mag workouts when the rest of the bodybuilding world was still bloated, ignorant and hadn’t even developed an understanding of the “Weider Principles”! No wonder he was successful, eh?
As far as transformations go, a lot of them were spectacular. Vince’s Gym was near Hollywood, and he used to train a lot of actors (Erik Estrada and Bill Smith being two of the better-known ones). These guys (and women) would come to him needing to get in shape for a role in like, two weeks. And he would mutter about how fat they were and then design some draconian program/diet that they’d have to suffer through until shooting was finished. Of course, these people were all highly motivated, and that can’t be discounted, but still the results were often dramatic.
If anyone wants to learn more about Vince's methods, I suggest you pick up a copy of "Unleashing the Wild Physique". It's out of print, but shouldn't be too hard to find. Also, if there's anyone else on this forum with Vince stories or training tips, put 'em up!
Oh, one other thing: he maintained that “dessicated liver tablets have more going for them than any other supplement.” I know that people around the T-Mag table don’t think they’re that great, and I don’t want to get into an argument with any of those guys. But DL is cheap (10 bucks’ll easily keep you going for a month or so) and easy to find, so if anyone wants to try a little experiment and see for themselves, my advice would be to do so. You might be surprised at the results, especially if for whatever reason you don’t get protein 5-6 times a day. DL is an easy fix.
Chris. I agree ‘Unleashing the Wild Physique’ is excellent and the booklets ‘Why do a champions muscles look different’ and ‘A muscle has four sides’ are also worthwhile seeking out. Vince produced these in 1982 at the time he was training Mohamed Makkawy.
The routine in ‘A muscle has four sides’ consists of one set only of four different exercises each targeting a different aspect of the same body part with no rest between the exercises. (I believe Ian King has been suggesting something similar in a recent t-mag article, but based on three exercises).
Chris, you tell some fascinating stories. Nice to see someone else on here who might be nearly as old as I am! Something else Vince always advocated was to experiment; he never stuck with one type of workout, and came up with differing plans for different people. Remember when he was writing about fasting? Sure, we all figured there couldn’t be any positives to combining fasting and weight training, but Vince found some guys who were willing to be his guinea pigs and try it! Stuff like that always impressed me; he thought outside of the box. I, too, was swallowing 100 dessicated liver tabs each day in the '70s, and can still conjure up that taste just using my imagination. Now that you remind me of 'em, I may buy some next time I see a big jug. Can’t hurt.
On a related note, isn’t it a shame that when Vince’s Gym closed down, nobody bought it? The sign alone would have been a classic collectible; why didn’t someone with bucks, like Joe Weider, snatch it up and set up a museum somewhere dedicated to the beginnings of modern bodybuilding. Vince’s Gym would have been a superb beginning. The same goes for Joe Gold’s original equipment from Gold’s Gym, Santa Monica/Venice. Two or so years ago when I was last in that gym, the old 'Pumping Iron"-era machines were jammed into a corner, none in use other than the upside-down vertical leg press, which I saw actually being used (by a buxom gal in spandex; it was quite a sight…but that’s yet another topic). When the '50s, '60s and '70s era champions of bodybuilding begin to pass away, suddenly people are going to wonder about why we didn’t preserve some of the history. I’m sad that Vince’s Gym and his unique machines and workout materials just ended up in a junk pile somewhere.