btw
last time I got into a big internet argumentgues with PX, I went out an hit a 600lb deadlift later that evening.
guess what?
I just finished a deadlift workout pretty much tied an all time best rep record with 225kgx11 reps.
I say pretty much because my previous best was done 100% raw, and this time I used a belt and straps.
but what the fuck, that was 20 plus years ago.
got it on video tape too. as soon as I learn how to download vids from my new android phone (previous was blackberry) I will post it.
I have the 600lb pull on vid on my hub, the one I did after my last argument with PX.
lesson?
arguing with PX makes you stronger!
do it as much as possible.
shit, tomorrow is jerks from the rack…
I hope he is on the site so I can pick a fight with him…
[quote]pushharder wrote:
My 405 Z tonight. Working toward a PR.
Need to keep the “big chest”. Not happy with the dipping forward thing.[/quote]
shit, more power to you…
that hurt just watching.
not for me man, but I respect what you are doing.
same for somebody who can do 5 plates each side on the hammer machine, I cant do that either.
[quote]heavythrower wrote:
but I will say this…at best, I was an average strength athlete…and I am half crippled now that I am only in my 40’s
[/quote]
I know what you’re saying, I think I just worded it poorly. What I meant was that if you took a PLer in the 50th percentile of his sport and then took a BBer in the 50th percentile of his sport, the PLer would still have more injuries. I think if you two athletes of equal “advancement” in their respective sports, a strength athlete would have a longer list of injuries than a bodybuilder 95% of the time.
I completely hear you, man - I’m currently taking a break from PLing and doing more BB oriented lifts because I went from 165lbs and squatting ~315 raw to 220 and squatting 705 in gear and my body fucking HATED me for it… and I’m only 23. I knew I had to take a break or else I’d end up in a situation similar to yours. When I do go back to PLing, I’ll be much better at including mobility/prehab work and all that jazz into my training.
[quote]pushharder wrote:
[quote]heavythrower wrote:
[quote]pushharder wrote:
My 405 Z tonight. Working toward a PR.
Need to keep the “big chest”. Not happy with the dipping forward thing.[/quote]
shit, more power to you…
that hurt just watching.
not for me man, but I respect what you are doing.
same for somebody who can do 5 plates each side on the hammer machine, I cant do that either.
[/quote]
Ha! Didn’t hurt a bit. Had my bloat going on as I slammed the simple carbs pre-workout. Carrot cake from Father’s Day, Reese Peanut Butter Cups, sugar and cocoa and BCAAs. Shit I almost puked after one of my working sets. [/quote]
THAT is the video I want to see… Push hitting a 450lb zercher and at the top of the lift spewing!
[quote]rrjc5488 wrote:
[quote]heavythrower wrote:
but I will say this…at best, I was an average strength athlete…and I am half crippled now that I am only in my 40’s
[/quote]
I know what you’re saying, I think I just worded it poorly. What I meant was that if you took a PLer in the 50th percentile of his sport and then took a BBer in the 50th percentile of his sport, the PLer would still have more injuries. I think if you two athletes of equal “advancement” in their respective sports, a strength athlete would have a longer list of injuries than a bodybuilder 95% of the time.
I completely hear you, man - I’m currently taking a break from PLing and doing more BB oriented lifts because I went from 165lbs and squatting ~315 raw to 220 and squatting 705 in gear and my body fucking HATED me for it… and I’m only 23. I knew I had to take a break or else I’d end up in a situation similar to yours. When I do go back to PLing, I’ll be much better at including mobility/prehab work and all that jazz into my training.[/quote]
gear has change the game indeed.
I think it has allowed bigger numbers but boy does it tear the body up.
I think you are going about this much better than I did, and will do well into your “later” years if you keep it up.
[quote]pushharder wrote:
This is not meant to toss gasoline on the fire of this thread but my arms feel fine. I mean absolutely zero discomfort and I last Zercher squatted three weeks ago. I normally Z squat every other week.[/quote]
i have done zerchers before…when I was bat-shit crazy in love with louie simmons and westside barbell(even trained for a few weeks there as a young man as a guest, AND was coached during a squat workout by the man himself!!!)
they hurt like HELL.
you are a tougher man than me…
like I said, much respect, but you can keep the zerchers. God only knows how much MORE fucked up I would be now if I had kept doing them.
Nice job, push!
Although, we’re still waiting on the zercher sex position update, and since you’ve set the bar with video proof…
I think you know what I’m getting at.
But in all seriousness, nice lift! I know it’s easier said than done, especially on a ME lift, but really try to throw your knees out… that right knee came in quite a bit.
to anser SPECIFICALLY the OP’s question"
why do you not see any huge zercher lifts?
answer: because they fucking HURT.
[quote]heavythrower wrote:
[quote]pushharder wrote:
This is not meant to toss gasoline on the fire of this thread but my arms feel fine. I mean absolutely zero discomfort and I last Zercher squatted three weeks ago. I normally Z squat every other week.[/quote]
i have done zerchers before…when I was bat-shit crazy in love with louie simmons and westside barbell(even trained for a few weeks there as a young man as a guest, AND was coached during a squat workout by the man himself!!!)
they hurt like HELL.
you are a tougher man than me…
like I said, much respect, but you can keep the zerchers. God only knows how much MORE fucked up I would be now if I had kept doing them.
[/quote]
So YOU’RE the guy who caused Louie to say it puts pressure on the bicep!
But seriously, I can’t say enough about how much I love that zercher harness. Obviously this takes the upper back training out of it, but it’s kind of like doing shrugs without straps with 315 when you can use 495 with straps.
The harness really allows you to focus on thrusting your hips through as hard as you possibly can.
Obviously, much like the shrug analogy - if you wanna train grip along with your traps, do them without straps, but don’t expect the best results for your traps when you don’t use straps and go heavy.
Including both in training is obviously best to bring up your grip (or your upper back, in zerchers case) while still hitting your traps as hard as possible (or your posterior chain in the zercher case.)
I hope I got that point across, lol.
[quote]Professor X wrote:
Doubtful…but since you seem to have missed the 4 or 5 pages I went into the AMOUNT OF WEIGHT USED…I guess I have to rewrite all of that…again. That was why a specific weight range was given…one where more would be prone to see a tear from the lift itself.
Now, I don’t mean to be sharp or even sarcastic with you…but this has been written so many times in this thread that the only way someone could miss it is if they weren’t listening to any of it to start with.
You see, I train biceps tonight. I use a weight that by itself could cause a tear. That is why someone at that stage has to be careful of their whole routine. Something like doing back the day right before biceps could set you up…when you are curling in excess of 85lbs in one hand.[/quote]
Actually curious here, how does the argument of weight being used hold weight as far as tears? Can’t a mid-level trainee experience a tear with a 65lb db that a higher level trainee might not experience until he uses 85lb dbs? I would think that the increased muscle/tendon strength would offset the higher weight being used (to a point at least)
I.E. I might tear my bicep curling a 65lb db where PX tears his with a 100lb.
I would think that any trainee at any level would avoid training biceps the day after back and vice versa. Same goes for chest and triceps.
If I can curl 65’s and zercher 315, and push can curl 80’s and zercher 455, why is he more likely to tear a bicep?
[quote]Blaze_108 wrote:
If I can curl 65’s and zercher 315, and push can curl 80’s and zercher 455, why is he more likely to tear a bicep?
[/quote]
Because.
[quote]rrjc5488 wrote:
[quote]Blaze_108 wrote:
If I can curl 65’s and zercher 315, and push can curl 80’s and zercher 455, why is he more likely to tear a bicep?
[/quote]
Because.[/quote]
my neck is bigger than his.
[quote]maraudermeat wrote:
at the bottom when i’m using a wide stance and the bar is on my thighs the weight is definitely off my arms but since there’s no box under me it’s a lot like a paused front squat. at that part of the lift i’m removing the stretch reflex from hamstrings. they are in no way like a box squat:) there’s nothing supporting and you still have to stablize everything down there.
[/quote]
lol, I know it’s not like a box squat… I meant that the way a box breaks the stretch reflex in a box squat, you resting the bar on your thighs breaks the stretch reflex in the zercher.
I think we’re on the same page 
When you say you do them with a ‘long’ pause in the bottom to eliminate the stretch reflex, about how long are we talking?
hey push, if you don’t mind, I’d like to give some tips from an Oly perspective.
To me, a zercher is like a front squat. What I mean by that is, sit down, not back. I know a lot of bodybuilders/powerlifters sit back in the back squat, but IMO I think if you are doing a zercher/front squat, you should sit down and let those knees come forward. I think you would also benefit from a slightly narrower stance, as well as putting on some Oly shoes (or shoes w/ a heel lift, or 2x4, whatever).