[quote]Makavali wrote:
[quote]Magicpunch wrote:
If an average joe had to survive against a fully aware, well fed, well riled and well angry bull for 5 minutes in an arena like that, could they do it?
I’m just curious. Not going to get involved in the debate, but I’m just interested in what the capabilities of a bull like that actually are.[/quote]
I’d like to see a bull fighter doing that too.
You realize these creatures are starved and tortured before the show, right?[/quote]
They’re not starved and tortured before the show. I think the bulls might be stressed from the act of running through towns[on slip-proof surfaces so they can’t slip and be hurt], but they’re neither starved nor are they tortured before the fight.
The reputation of the breeder, plaza, and matador depend greatly on the bull. It’d be counterproductive to starve or injure a bull before a fight. Not to say some people in small venues might not attempt to cheat, but cheating is illegal and isn’t encouraged. Not that I’ve ever seen any good sources to show that cheating is rampant in bullfighting in Spain, just articles from the mid 1990s that vaguely mention cheating.
[quote]Eli B wrote:
[quote]Professor X wrote:
[quote]goldengloves wrote:
[quote]Magicpunch wrote:
[quote]PDJD wrote:
[quote]goldengloves wrote:
Animal torture? I don’t see how anyone can claim the bull is tortured during a bullfight, it’s killed. However the horses at one time were tortured and the padding has helped prevent it, I think more sufficient padding should be mandated to protect the horse though.[/quote]
No, they should get ride of the picador entirely, exchange the barbed metal rods (forgot the name, sorry) with suction cups, and make the matador use a sword that telescopes like my kids light saber. Then I’d be all for it.[/quote]
If an average joe had to survive against a fully aware, well fed, well riled and well angry bull for 5 minutes in an arena like that, could they do it?
I’m just curious. Not going to get involved in the debate, but I’m just interested in what the capabilities of a bull like that actually are.[/quote]
Those bulls are bred specifically for fighting and the ones used in the good fights weigh over 1,000 pounds, they’re capable of goring someone with ease.
I think someone could run away from the bull and leap out of the ring, but I doubt someone without any training would survive any passes of the bull. Also, most matadors are born into the profession and have been training their entire life. While most make their job look easy[like any other professional athlete] it’d be almost impossible to mimic their performance.
[quote]PDJD wrote:
[quote]goldengloves wrote:
Animal torture? I don’t see how anyone can claim the bull is tortured during a bullfight, it’s killed. However the horses at one time were tortured and the padding has helped prevent it, I think more sufficient padding should be mandated to protect the horse though.[/quote]
No, they should get ride of the picador entirely, exchange the barbed metal rods (forgot the name, sorry) with suction cups, and make the matador use a sword that telescopes like my kids light saber. Then I’d be all for it.[/quote]
I’d rather see them switch to a bubble sword.
The sticks are called banderillas.
[quote]OctoberGirl wrote:
[quote]goldengloves wrote:
Animal torture? I don’t see how anyone can claim the bull is tortured during a bullfight, it’s killed. However the horses at one time were tortured and the padding has helped prevent it, I think more sufficient padding should be mandated to protect the horse though.[/quote]
sucks to be stupid
[/quote]
To be stupid I’d have to continuously make ignorant assumptions about something.
The bulls aren’t mistreated while living on the ranch, it’s illegal to even try to harm them during the running of the bulls, during a bullfight[that lasts about 20 minutes] the objective is to get the bull ready for the matador without seriously harming it, and an aspect of being a good matador is the ability to kill a bull in one swift motion in a timely fashion. After the bull is killed it’s then butchered, the carcass isn’t left to rot. And if a bull were to be docile and have no intention of fighting then it’ll simply be removed from the ring, it isn’t forced to fight.
Where’s the animal abuse? It’s illegal to abuse the bull, it’s only legal to kill it.
[/quote]
You are bringing logic into this…and they will have none of that.[/quote]
Yeah, whats more I hear the bulls enjoy having spears stuck into their neck muscles.
It isnt like its the BEST way to kill a bull but it may very well be the most entertaining.
Imaginary dialogue:
“Yeah I killed my neighbor but I butchered him afterward. I killed him as fast as was still entertaining for the gathered crowd. We’re cool right?”
Look, its torture. But its medium torture. We do a lot of fucked up shit that isn’t OK. Bullfighting isn’t too high on my outrage list. Plus I eat meat.
Bulls are mammals like us. They have a highly developed central nervous system similar to ours. We can be pretty sure they feel some emotions. We definitely see anger and pain. I don’t know that the same can be said for frogs or…ahem…broccoli.[/quote]
The bulls are stabbed in the back as they’re attacking the horses, they’re stabbed so the bull will keep its head low and make it possible for the matador to kill it. It’s not as if someone decided “I think I’ll get on a horse and lance a bull!”, there’s a purpose for it. The attacking of the horse also shows the strength of the bull.
The flaw in your imaginary dialogue is that your neighbor isn’t regularly killed to be used as food.
I don’t think anyone believes bulls don’t feel pain, however all cattle used for beef will eventually feel pain. And the pain of the bull isn’t what’s enjoyed during a bullfight, it’s the strength of the bull and skill of the matador.
[quote]Makavali wrote:
[quote]goldengloves wrote:
And if a bull were to be docile and have no intention of fighting then it’ll simply be removed from the ring, it isn’t forced to fight.[/quote]
Yeah, stabbing an animal in the neck and shoulder blades, that’ll keep it docile.[/quote]
If the bull is stabbed then it’s because it charged the horse of the picador and has shown to be aggressive, however if a bull in the ring has no will to fight it isn’t forced to fight.
