But what if that bigger guy has a ton of non-functional muscle all over his body?
There’s no way he could fight then!
(that’s a joke, but seriously some guys have posted that kind of stuff on here seaming like they really weren’t kidding)
[quote]snipeout wrote:
Most people know the Prof and I disagree on alot, on this I have to take his side. There are weight classes for a reason. I am only 190, I am so sick and tired of everyone tihnking because they are some halfassed MMA fighter they can take down people that outweigh them by 100 pounds. I have boxed, wrestled, and studied jujitsu.
Have you ever hit someone roughly 100 pounds heavier than you? It’s quite funny actually, even if you hit them square on the chin they probably aren’t going down. Ever wrestle someone 100 pounds more than you? If they have the smallest amount of balance, they are gona sprawl out and crush you into the ground. Ever try and get in close enough to choke out someone 100 pounds more than you?
Chances are they are a good 6 inches taller than you making it very difficult to get in on them. I am not saying it is impossible to beat someone that much bigger than you, the only reference anyone can give is Gracie. Newsflash, none of you on this site are Royce or Relson or any of the fuckin Gracies for that matter, if you were you would be in pride, k1 or ufc.
Everyone thinks they are invincible, just remember that no matter how bad you are there is a bigger bad ass than you out there.[/quote]
Good post.
If it is okay with you little guys, I think I’ll stay big. Lucky I have my mad nunchucka skilz to protect me.
[quote]firemedichcfr14 wrote:
DPH wrote:
how well do you think Royce Gracie would have faired against Mike Tyson in his prime?
With few or no rules Gracie wins if both are in their prime.
[/quote]
Gracie would get the holy shit kicked out of him by Mike Tyson in his prime.
[quote]firemedichcfr14 wrote:
DPH wrote:
With few or no rules Gracie wins if both are in their prime.
[/quote]
LMFAO! That’s the most retarded statement I’ve ever heard!!!
As good as it’s been for some that BJJ and UFC-style fighting schools have opened up…it’s also lead to some sort of weird mental defect where every 160lb guy takes a few classes and suddenly thinks he is Royce Gracie.
[quote]IL Cazzo wrote:
As good as it’s been for some that BJJ and UFC-style fighting schools have opened up…it’s also lead to some sort of weird mental defect where every 160lb guy takes a few classes and suddenly thinks he is Royce Gracie. [/quote]
Obviously, there are not enough 260lbs guys out there busting heads. I blame Republicans.
[quote]Professor X wrote:
IL Cazzo wrote:
As good as it’s been for some that BJJ and UFC-style fighting schools have opened up…it’s also lead to some sort of weird mental defect where every 160lb guy takes a few classes and suddenly thinks he is Royce Gracie.
Obviously, there are not enough 260lbs guys out there busting heads. I blame Republicans.[/quote]
LOL! Nah lay the blame on foreigners, their the ones that sparked the myth that any 110lb black belt can take any unskilled fighter regardless of size. 
Ok, one thing i’ve noticed here is that everyone seems to talk about fighting in a ring, rules, etc. Now, i don’t care the size of a person, if i came up against a person who was a black belt or a higher dan of krav maga:
I would shit my pants regardless of the fact i weigh 200 or more pounds. I’m clearly not talking about americanized krav maga which is inferior as it is based on getting people to pass belts quickly in order to keep them interested and keep the money rolling in, i’m talking about proper krav maga.
Obvisouly, someone who does put himself through this training isn’t going to be an ectomorph as they will realise that, yeah, size isn’t everything, but being a skinny will not get you anywhere…
[quote]Professor X wrote:
firemedichcfr14 wrote:
Yes, and I wrote, “Fighting skill puts you above average, it doesn’t mean you can kick the ass of people walking around with 50 more pounds of muscle on them.” in my first reply. I could care less if you think this wasn’t “enough” credit to fighting skill. Perhaps you give “too much” credit to fighting skill.[/quote]
Too much credit to fighting skill?
Do you think you could handle someone like BJ Penn? He weighs about 165 pounds you are about 250 pounds. You see what I mean? Don’t even have to go to that level either. Anyone who trains as steady in a good fighting skill, and uses it on a regularly, as you do at lifting would probably defeat someone your size. You don’t have to go to the best in the world to prove that.
If you are going to play tennis it’s important to be fast, have low body fat, good reflexes etc. But the most important ingredient is SKILL
Yes I’m sure that large strong guys well over 200 pounds get picked on all the time.
I don’t consider myself big at 215 right now, but I have never been underestimated by anyone who weighs less than me. Maybe this is something in your own mind.
If they think that, it’s stupid. But I’ve not seen any of that on this site, maybe I missed it. Then again it’s the Internet where the little guy with no skill likes to act tough. Hold on I guess that goes for plenty of people around here of all shapes and sizes.
Your point of view is still crap if you think skill is less important than size when it comes to fighting. All other things being equal the bigger stonger guy wins. But all other things being equal the most skillful guy wins. And I think that skill can also make up for lack of size to a degree. See my BJ Penn Vs Professor X match. And I don’t think the skill disparity has to be that large either for the skillful smaller man to beat the less skilled larger man.
Fighting is far more complex than to make a blanket statement as you did.
No I was right that one post of yours was full of crap. And while you make some good points now and then you are mostly full of crap.
[quote]I also know that the greatest fighter will be the one who combines strength, skill, power and size…not the smaller guy who thinks size is a negative and that his 155lbs is a threat to nearly anyone he runs into.
[/quote]
Glad you changed your tune. It may have taken a few posts but you are now giving skill more credit. That’s a good thing.
[quote]firemedichcfr14 wrote:
Too much credit to fighting skill?
Do you think you could handle someone like BJ Penn? He weighs about 165 pounds you are about 250 pounds. You see what I mean? Don’t even have to go to that level either. Anyone who trains as steady in a good fighting skill, and uses it on a regularly, as you do at lifting would probably defeat someone your size. You don’t have to go to the best in the world to prove that.
If you are going to play tennis it’s important to be fast, have low body fat, good reflexes etc. But the most important ingredient is SKILL
[/quote]
Did you just relate fighting directly with tennis?
It is something seen many times on this site.
So, because you haven’t seen it, it doesn’t exist?
[quote]Your point of view is still crap if you think skill is less important than size when it comes to fighting. All other things being equal the bigger stonger guy wins. But all other things being equal the most skillful guy wins. And I think that skill can also make up for lack of size to a degree. See my BJ Penn Vs Professor X match. And I don’t think the skill disparity has to be that large either for the skillful smaller man to beat the less skilled larger man.
Fighting is far more complex than to make a blanket statement as you did.[/quote]
No one is making blanket statements.
Because your posts are filled with enlightenment?
[quote]Glad you changed your tune. It may have taken a few posts but you are now giving skill more credit. That’s a good thing.
[/quote]
You’ve taken stupid to new levels. Congrats. No one can say you aren’t a pioneer.
I would have SWORN this post started out about some half-assed theory on nutrition.
[quote]Professor X wrote:
If you are going to play tennis it’s important to be fast, have low body fat, good reflexes etc. But the most important ingredient is SKILL
Did you just relate fighting directly with tennis?[/quote]
Did you take an extra dose of stupid pills today Professor X?
My point is that like tennis, swimming, baseball, golf, or just about any sport SKILL is paramount!
If you don’t think so take your huge muscular body out and try to play any of them without SKILL
Now if you have skill and a well muscled body then you have an advantage. But without skill you are shit out of luck.
If being strong was THE ONLY criteria for being a good fighter then MMA guys would be lifting all day long at the EXCLUSION of skill training.
More muscle is always better, but skill is paramount!
Try to remember the basics.
[quote]If they think that, it’s stupid. But I’ve not seen any of that on this site, maybe I missed it. Then again it’s the Internet where the little guy with no skill likes to act tough. Hold on I guess that goes for plenty of people around here of all shapes and sizes.
So, because you haven’t seen it, it doesn’t exist?[/quote]
Why don’t you take a look at my third sentence genius. Wait let me help you, “Then again it’s the Internet where the little guy with no skill likes to act tough.”
[quote]Fighting is far more complex than to make a blanket statement as you did.
No one is making blanket statements.[/quote]
All you did was make blanket statements genius. Which one do you want to try to defend first?
The following blanket statement of yours talks about how big people you saw would “KILL ANYONE” who didn’t have more size and strength than them. That is a blanket statement in case you couldn’t figure it out.
[quote]I hate to inform you of this, but I have seen some big people into street fighting who would literally kill anyone who didn’t have more size and strength than them.
[/quote]
[quote]Fighting skill puts you above average, it doesn’t mean you can kick the ass of people walking around with 50 more pounds of muscle on them.
[/quote]
The above is another blanket statement of yours as it implies that fighting skill is good but it apparently won’t allow you to beat ANYONE who is {b} 50 POUNDS[/b] heavier.
Below is another blanket statement that you made which clearly states that ANYONE who warms up with his max bench can automatically apparently defeat that person easily in a fight.
[quote]No I was right that one post of yours was full of crap. And while you make some good points now and then you are mostly full of crap.
Because your posts are filled with enlightenment?
[/quote]
No, I’m nobody special. But neither are you, but that doesn’t stop you from pretendig to be an expert on everything from foreign relations to fighting and everything in between. And the post in question, you know the one with all the blanket statements was full crap like I said.
Next time think before you post If you find that difficult, don’t post.
firemedichcfr14, you are an idiot. It shows. Have fun following me around the board.
I have an announcement to make…
To all 165lb guys, you are NOT Royce Gracie.
Thank you.
[quote]Professor X wrote:
firemedichcfr14, you are an idiot. It shows. Have fun following me around the board. [/quote]
I am?
But you are the making asinine blanket statements.
Why the hell is everyone talking about fighting, especially on the internet, and especially on a bodybuilding forum thread about mass gaining?
Here’s some proper news - I didn’t have time to finish all my meals last night so I just bought a Kelloggs Nutri-Grain Elevenses bar to bridge a gap. This thing fits in the palm of my hand and yet contains 373kcals! - sweet!
[quote]snipeout wrote:
Have you ever hit someone roughly 100 pounds heavier than you? It’s quite funny actually, even if you hit them square on the chin they probably aren’t going down. Ever wrestle someone 100 pounds more than you? If they have the smallest amount of balance, they are gona sprawl out and crush you into the ground. Ever try and get in close enough to choke out someone 100 pounds more than you?
Chances are they are a good 6 inches taller than you making it very difficult to get in on them. I am not saying it is impossible to beat someone that much bigger than you, the only reference anyone can give is Gracie. Newsflash, none of you on this site are Royce or Relson or any of the fuckin Gracies for that matter, if you were you would be in pride, k1 or ufc.
Everyone thinks they are invincible, just remember that no matter how bad you are there is a bigger bad ass than you out there.[/quote]
OK, let’s address this step by step:
If you hit someone on the chin right, they will go down, and they may take a little nap. The hundred pounds will not matter. Why? Becasue there ain’t no muscle in da head (I love saying it that way)! If you clip the chin the way a pro trains to, you rattle the brain. It’s kind of like having a small concussion, and you win.
If you wrestle or grapple someone who outweighs you by 100 lbs, and that person has a thread of wrestling knowledge, you’ve got your work cut out for you. Now, if the bigger guy is all muscle and he knows his ground work and submissions, you could be in real trouble.
Everyone keeps throwing the Gracie name around, but most people don’t seem to realize that the Gracie family has losses just like the others. And, there is a reason you don’t see the Gracies in the UFC or pride anymore (at least to my knowledge). They’ve made their name, and they don’t want to risk losing it. Why? Because there is money attached to the Gracie name right now, and if they start losing infront of the buying audience, all that money disappears.
[quote]terribleivan wrote:
OK, let’s address this step by step:
If you hit someone on the chin right, they will go down, and they may take a little nap. The hundred pounds will not matter. Why? Becasue there ain’t no muscle in da head (I love saying it that way)! [/quote]
There are several muscles surrounding your skull and mandible.
This thread is definitly nominated for “where is this thread going”…
I thought this was clear- in a ring, on a mat, with rules, size is a decided advantage. Hence, as others have said, we have weight classes. A 142 pound Arturo Gatti is not going to generate as much force in a punch as Tyson- its just not possible. If their mechanics are perfect and they are generating as much force as they can both possibly generate, then Tyson is simply more massive and has the advantage, as his punches have more velocity. Its physics.
In a fight on the street, very little of this applies. Most guys have no idea how to throw a punch, have no idea how to get their bodyweight behind it, and mechanics and technique suck. So most times it comes down to “Who hits harder first”. If you know a little about fighting, then you place some nice punches, and the thing is over. Hence why size doesn’t matter so much in a stand-up fight between two guys.
If the thing goes to the ground…well, smaller guys can’t let it get to the ground, because every extra pound they have on you is felt.
But also, it being a fight between two regular guys, other stuff comes into play, like beer bottles, pool balls, pipes…so its kind of pointless to even ponder it. There’s no telling what happens in a streetfight.
But what if that 130lb guy has a knife?
Who’s gonna win the fight then?
Or if the 275lb guy has a sawed off shotgun. Then who’s goona win?
(I figgured we could use one more subject in this thread)