I like turtles.
[quote]BlackLabel wrote:
What’s the point of using gear? [/quote]
How long is a piece of string?
[quote]Stronghold wrote:
No, my ego is fine, but you don’t know what you’re talking about.
[/quote]
Your response to my post sounded as if you were hurt. That somehow, I implied your own personal squat #'s came easy since you use gear, and therefor you don’t work hard. I just want to say I did not mention one word about you or anyone else on this forum. I was talking about me.
I would hit 500 easily, compared to how easily I could without gear. I’d expect that to take me ~7 months raw. If I could get 50 lbs out of gear, that’d cut that down the timeframe drastically.
[quote]Stronghold wrote:
No one “throws on” a pair of 2 ply briefs without any experience in them and suddenly gets a ton of carryover.
My first time in briefs, I couldn’t get to parallel…not because they were too strong, but because I didn’t know how to squat in them.[/quote]
I can’t prove what I saw, so I’ll just say you’re right. 
This is all besides my point anyway: that I personally find the higher poundages that gear allows to be lifted to be appealing.
[quote]heavythrower wrote:
it doesnt matter.
see, even if you HAVE competed, with AND without gear, like i have, nobody cares, the rule is still: “shut the fuck up about it and quit whining about gear you little bitch”
lol
people comparing equipment used in other sports, well, i dare say that in most sports the equipment does not result into 20% increases in performances. dont use the bike racing and golf analogies, thats FAIL, the “equipment” is an ingrained part of those sports, that is like comparing a high jumpers nubers with a pole vaulters.
i learned my lesson a few years ago, i used to get into gear debates quite a bit on diff forums, my only interest was just to voice my opinon on the matter, but i found many people take it VERY VERY personally. i had people who i thought were friends of mine pretty much “divorse” me and launch what i thought were pretty inappropriate personal attacks because of my opinion on the multiply feds.
times change, and it really is not worth getting upset about it(on both ends), sort of like the fact that i do not and never smoked weed, and think most (not all) people who do are dirty, smelly soft-headed losers, but i have to face the fact that most every body in the community i live smokes weed pretty regularly. i work in the ed and do tox screens on tons of people everyday, and pretty much EVERYBODY is positive for canabis, and no, i am NOT exagerating, lol. [/quote]
Heavy, I really think you’re being a little too sensitive about this. I’m not saying that some geared lifted havent taken it too personally, they have. But I remember you all the way back from Rugged, and yeah, I value your opinion a lot more than someone who’s never competed - we just happen to disagree. Heck, even if those bashing gear had LIFTED in gear, even if not in a meet, it would be a lot more palatable. But to have someone who’s never put on gear, and very well may have no idea about lifting in general, look at a press with a shirt and think “oh, it’s more weight, it must be easier” … it’s a little like someone assuming that a 3 bd press must be “easier” than a 2 because theres more weight on it.
You dont think that becuase you’ve had gear on and I believe that once when I posted that my 1RM in gear is harder than my 1RM unequipped, you posted sharing your own similar experiences. I dont compete in gear, but I think I’m a little more accepting of it than you ar - Im not disgusted by it. We just disagree, that’s a lot easier than someone with no experience talking about hwo it should be
I have lifted and competed single ply, multi ply, and raw. Gear is a lot harder to master than you would think. You don’t just throw it on and get hundreds of pounds out of it. The more plies the harder. After 5 years in multi ply gear I switched to raw and enjoy it more. Lift the way you want to and don’t worry about everyone else. Life is too short to worry about what everyone else thinks.
[quote]Hanley wrote:
TYPE2B wrote:
Me, personally, I wouldn’t be impressed if a 700 pound geared deadlifter can only deadlift 200 pounds without it, but I am impressed of the fact that he managed to create an innovation.
I’m not sure whether you intended it to be or not, but comments like that are quite insulting.
The implication was that anyone (even weak ass bitches) can put on gear and be strong. It just doesn’t work like that unfortunately.
[/quote]
I am extremely sorry if it offended some people.
I wasn’t trying to insult people, sorry if it sounded that way.
[quote]Masonator wrote:
Hanley, I don’t think there was ever a “purest” form. In Kaz’s day, they used tennis balls and 20ft wraps, as mentioned before. It’s human nature to try to get an advantage over one’s opponent. In my opinion, geared feds are more “pure” than the old days because everyone is at least on the same level of equipment.[/quote]
That’s my exact point. People try to talk about equipment as if it’s a slap in the face of the sports founding fathers. Of course the keyboard warriors don’t realise, PL’s always been a geared sport in some form or another!!
[quote]KBCThird wrote:
“It has often been heard said that the supportive gear was one reason given that our sport has not been “fully” accepted by the IOC, but ex-president Norbert Wallauch after conferring with the IOC confirmed that this was not so.” IPF Chair John Stephenson[/quote]
Good post!!
I’m pretty sure it’s the drug stigma that was the main problem.
Use gear. Don’t use gear. Whatever
The more interesting question is how much carryover is too much?
i lift raw but last night realized that they are completely different lifts as i defended ryans bench being just as impressive as scott mendalsons, they use different techniques and muscles and just to handle the weight alot of pros handle is incredible . i have not touched gear or worn it but from reading and watching the execution is so much different. so stop bitching u raw btiches and lift in a differnet fed if thy must.
[quote]KBCThird wrote:
heavythrower wrote:
it doesnt matter.
see, even if you HAVE competed, with AND without gear, like i have, nobody cares, the rule is still: “shut the fuck up about it and quit whining about gear you little bitch”
lol
people comparing equipment used in other sports, well, i dare say that in most sports the equipment does not result into 20% increases in performances. dont use the bike racing and golf analogies, thats FAIL, the “equipment” is an ingrained part of those sports, that is like comparing a high jumpers nubers with a pole vaulters.
i learned my lesson a few years ago, i used to get into gear debates quite a bit on diff forums, my only interest was just to voice my opinon on the matter, but i found many people take it VERY VERY personally. i had people who i thought were friends of mine pretty much “divorse” me and launch what i thought were pretty inappropriate personal attacks because of my opinion on the multiply feds.
times change, and it really is not worth getting upset about it(on both ends), sort of like the fact that i do not and never smoked weed, and think most (not all) people who do are dirty, smelly soft-headed losers, but i have to face the fact that most every body in the community i live smokes weed pretty regularly. i work in the ed and do tox screens on tons of people everyday, and pretty much EVERYBODY is positive for canabis, and no, i am NOT exagerating, lol.
Heavy, I really think you’re being a little too sensitive about this. I’m not saying that some geared lifted havent taken it too personally, they have. But I remember you all the way back from Rugged, and yeah, I value your opinion a lot more than someone who’s never competed - we just happen to disagree. Heck, even if those bashing gear had LIFTED in gear, even if not in a meet, it would be a lot more palatable. But to have someone who’s never put on gear, and very well may have no idea about lifting in general, look at a press with a shirt and think “oh, it’s more weight, it must be easier” … it’s a little like someone assuming that a 3 bd press must be “easier” than a 2 because theres more weight on it.
You dont think that becuase you’ve had gear on and I believe that once when I posted that my 1RM in gear is harder than my 1RM unequipped, you posted sharing your own similar experiences. I dont compete in gear, but I think I’m a little more accepting of it than you ar - Im not disgusted by it. We just disagree, that’s a lot easier than someone with no experience talking about hwo it should be[/quote]
pint well taken, like i said, i am over it…btw, what was your callname over at rugged?
[quote]Hanley wrote:
Masonator wrote:
Hanley, I don’t think there was ever a “purest” form. In Kaz’s day, they used tennis balls and 20ft wraps, as mentioned before. It’s human nature to try to get an advantage over one’s opponent. In my opinion, geared feds are more “pure” than the old days because everyone is at least on the same level of equipment.
That’s my exact point. People try to talk about equipment as if it’s a slap in the face of the sports founding fathers. Of course the keyboard warriors don’t realise, PL’s always been a geared sport in some form or another!!
KBCThird wrote:
“It has often been heard said that the supportive gear was one reason given that our sport has not been “fully” accepted by the IOC, but ex-president Norbert Wallauch after conferring with the IOC confirmed that this was not so.” IPF Chair John Stephenson
Good post!!
I’m pretty sure it’s the drug stigma that was the main problem.
[/quote]
ya, like other olympic sports have NO drug problem.
[quote]heavythrower wrote:
Hanley wrote:
Masonator wrote:
Hanley, I don’t think there was ever a “purest” form. In Kaz’s day, they used tennis balls and 20ft wraps, as mentioned before. It’s human nature to try to get an advantage over one’s opponent. In my opinion, geared feds are more “pure” than the old days because everyone is at least on the same level of equipment.
That’s my exact point. People try to talk about equipment as if it’s a slap in the face of the sports founding fathers. Of course the keyboard warriors don’t realise, PL’s always been a geared sport in some form or another!!
KBCThird wrote:
“It has often been heard said that the supportive gear was one reason given that our sport has not been “fully” accepted by the IOC, but ex-president Norbert Wallauch after conferring with the IOC confirmed that this was not so.” IPF Chair John Stephenson
Good post!!
I’m pretty sure it’s the drug stigma that was the main problem.
ya, like other olympic sports have NO drug problem. [/quote]
Oh I know!!
But adding one with a serious drug problem’s probably a step too far!
I am almost certain that the main reason that they don’t want to put in powerlifting is because they already have the oly lifting. They don’t want to have to of the same sport. Yes I know they aren’t the same but you get what I mean.
The gear has been at the beganing of powerlifting and will always be aprt of the sport. The beauty of it though is that their is a fed for however you want to lift. So pick the one you like and lift there because the hard work and dedication that it takes to lift big numbers is the same in every fed. Each is different for the different people.
I would like to see something like the NERB again but not just raw do like three meets where the best will come together and lift in one raw, one single, one multi I think that would be cool. Put up some big cash prize for the overall winner and the winner from each. I bet you that the top five will be the same for all three.
[quote]ouroboro_s wrote:
Wilba wrote:
ouroboro_s wrote:
Wilba wrote:
I think a better thread title would have been, “Do we need seperate forums for PL and the pursuit of strength?”
I train the 3 lifts as my primary exercises because I like what they do to my body. I have even thought of doing a meet one day to record my numbers somewhere other than my journal but I would never use gear because I think it’s silly. And your high squat is not a squat. Deal with it.
and your lifts don’t count until the numbers are published after a meet. They are just gym lifts. Until you have three judges telling you they count, they don’t. You can be one of those warriors who tells the young boys one day about how you ‘thought’ about doing a meet.
Deal with it 
See how we can all find something to look down our noses at?
I guess you missed my point about the difference between strength and PL.
It’s fine if you don’t think my lifts count, I don’t care. I don’t need a third party to tell me if my lift was legit. There’s the bar, there’s me and nothing else. It either goes up or doesn’t. I don’t need a judge and a diaper to make it count.
I wasn’t putting anyone down, just contributing my opinion to the debate.
You didn’t make your point very well. I guess you missed mine. I don’t actually believe that gym lifts don’t count. I drew a parallel in your arbitrarily deciding what is a squat and what isn’t and my saying your lifts don’t count and aren’t real until they are judge real. They both sound equally foolish.
You don’t need a third party to tell you what a squat is and most people here don’t need your say so on whether their lifts are real or not.
You say you’re not putting anyone down but by calling something silly that’s exactly what you’ve just said. The way in which you’ve expressed yourself makes me believe you don’t have the depth of experience to look anything but foolish when you post your comments on the issue. However, this is a public forum so, by all means, carry on.
You can look down your e-nose at the high squatters and I can look down mine at someone who will likely never have the nuts to get on a platform regardless of how they bum and blow about it.[/quote]
Saying that a 1\2 squat is bs is not “arbitrarily deciding”. A half squat is and always will be bs and you know it. Why does that upset you so much? Must have been the silly comment. You failed to notice that I didn’t say it IS silly, I said “I” think it’s silly. Not for me. I guess I was also saying 1\2 squats are silly too. So what?
I like the name calling and the ridiculous attempt at sounding intelligent. Well done.
[quote]Synthetickiller wrote:
Wilba wrote:
Never said I was but a squat is a squat and if you do something else (less than full ROM, assitance gear, etc.) it’s now something else and not a squat. Perhaps PL squat would be a better term? When I say squat and you say it we both mean very different things so there should be different terms to describe what we are talking about.
Ignorant.
And I bet you never use a belt, right?
This kinda of mind set is why there’s no consensus in powerlifting to for a unified federation for raw, single and unlimited ply divisions under one roof.
[/quote]
Actually I don’t except to hang weight for chins/dips. I use chalk.
[quote]ouroboro_s wrote:
Synthetickiller wrote:
Wilba wrote:
Never said I was but a squat is a squat and if you do something else (less than full ROM, assitance gear, etc.) it’s now something else and not a squat. Perhaps PL squat would be a better term? When I say squat and you say it we both mean very different things so there should be different terms to describe what we are talking about.
Ignorant.
And I bet you never use a belt, right?
This kinda of mind set is why there’s no consensus in powerlifting to for a unified federation for raw, single and unlimited ply divisions under one roof.
Well belts make you weak. I’m pretty sure they also make you gay so watch out.
I’m not sure why, with all the trash talk, this particular guys posts got on my wick like they did.
Perhaps it’s the high-handed talk about what he would do if he were to compete. Don’t tell people about what you would do, hypothetically, in any situation. Tell us what you actually did do. Until you do it, it’s bullshit. That doesn’t just apply to lifting and competition but every aspect of life. Until you’ve lived it, you don’t know shit about what you’d do, just what you think you’d like to do.[/quote]
I never said anything about what I would do in a competition. I said I have thought of doing a meet one day to record my numbers somewhere other than my journal, how exactly is that high handed talk about what I would do? It isn’t. You are a little, angry man and your lifts suck.
[quote]Wilba wrote:
You are a little, angry man and your lifts suck.[/quote]
LOL!! Is that right?
I love how we’re basically arguing over the best way to have fun.
It’s a sport. It’s fun. No one is fucking powerlifting for the money, so why the hell do so many people wanna make such a goddamn big deal about this?
Have fun the way you want to have fun, and don’t piss all over other people that want to have fun in a different way. I swear, this is as bad as kids arguing over Playstation vs. Xbox.
[quote]T3hPwnisher wrote:
I love how we’re basically arguing over the best way to have fun.
It’s a sport. It’s fun. No one is fucking powerlifting for the money, so why the hell do so many people wanna make such a goddamn big deal about this?
Have fun the way you want to have fun, and don’t piss all over other people that want to have fun in a different way. I swear, this is as bad as kids arguing over Playstation vs. Xbox.[/quote]
XBOX!!!