Front Squat?

I added front squats to my leg workout today, and I now I have some slight back pain. It isn’t an injury but it is sore. I hold the bar against my shoulders with my arms crossed, and I squat while keeping my back streight and perpendicular to the floor.

I was wondering if I should arch my back even though it makes me feel a little off balance? Oh, I was using pretty light weight (185), but should I go lighter?

Maybe take the weight down a little until you get form down?? you just added them if I read correctly? I just added about three weeks ago and love em…did light weight to get the form down but now the weight is movin! much more comfortable for me as compared to the back squat.

[quote]tykemathis wrote:
I added front squats to my leg workout today, and I now I have some slight back pain. It isn’t an injury but it is sore. I hold the bar against my shoulders with my arms crossed, and I squat while keeping my back streight and perpendicular to the floor.[/quote]

I don’t recommend that position. You’re better off doing it Olympic style or using straps (I believe CT or Poliquin recently showed a picture of someone doing front squats with straps).

Front squats almost require you to stay straight up…if you bend forward, you’ll dump the bar. The weight could have been too much. How many sets and reps did you do? Was it difficult? Do you have good flexibility? Did your heels stay on the ground? Are you sure you used good form?

Maybe your back is sore because you did something wrong or the weight was too heavy. Or maybe it was just a new exercise and it worked your lower back more.

[quote]tykemathis wrote:
I added front squats to my leg workout today, and I now I have some slight back pain. It isn’t an injury but it is sore. I hold the bar against my shoulders with my arms crossed, and I squat while keeping my back streight and perpendicular to the floor.

[/quote]

How did you manage to keep your back perpendicular to the floor? Was it a smith machine squat?

Yes it is in a smith machine but it is a 2 axis version. I did it 12 reps, 2 sets. I still did back squats before I performed the front squats. I am not very flexable but I belive I had good form. I think the best thing to do is lower the weight and see if I can put an arch in my back.

I also never recommend more than 5-6 reps of front squats. Poliquin has stated this a few times as well in his Question of Strength articles. Keep the higher reps for back squats and overhead squats.

And get out of the Smith machine and use free weights!!!

[quote]Nate Dogg wrote:
I also never recommend more than 5-6 reps of front squats. Poliquin has stated this a few times as well in his Question of Strength articles. Keep the higher reps for back squats and overhead squats.

And get out of the Smith machine and use free weights!!![/quote]

Alright, thanks nate for the advice your help will be applied. I will also look for the articals you have mentioned. Thanks everyone

[quote]tykemathis wrote:
Nate Dogg wrote:
I also never recommend more than 5-6 reps of front squats. Poliquin has stated this a few times as well in his Question of Strength articles. Keep the higher reps for back squats and overhead squats.

And get out of the Smith machine and use free weights!!!

Alright, thanks nate for the advice your help will be applied. I will also look for the articals you have mentioned. Thanks everyone[/quote]

Higher reps for overhead squats? Okay. Don’t do that if you care about your shoulders.

I agree with going with the free bar. A bi-planar smith machine isn’t terrible, but there’s no reason to use one when you’re learning with a light weight. If you need to use it so you have hooks to spot yourself later on, then I’d consider it as a last-ditch effort.

-Dan

I would lighten the load massively and do it with a free weight BEFORE any other type of leg movements so there’s no pre-fatigue.

When you are confident that you are going as low as you can safely, then you can start to increase the load.

Technique first, then overload.

[quote]buffalokilla wrote:
tykemathis wrote:
Nate Dogg wrote:
I also never recommend more than 5-6 reps of front squats. Poliquin has stated this a few times as well in his Question of Strength articles. Keep the higher reps for back squats and overhead squats.

And get out of the Smith machine and use free weights!!!

Alright, thanks nate for the advice your help will be applied. I will also look for the articals you have mentioned. Thanks everyone

Higher reps for overhead squats? Okay. Don’t do that if you care about your shoulders.

-Dan
[/quote]

Let me clarify. Higher reps in the overhead squat meaning 8-15 reps. It doesn’t mean you have to put a ton of weight on the bar either, especially if you’re not an Olympic lifter.

Most people struggle with 95-135lbs in the overhead squat. I don’t think you’re going to wreak your shoulders using those types of weights once a week or so for 8-15 reps. More people hav shoulder problems from benching and overuse injuries.

And Olympic lifters do them with a hell of a lot more weight without any increase in shoulder injuries. If anything, it will help strengthen the shoulder capsule.

Your back can also be sore due to the fact the load is now in a different position than what you’re used to. If it’s soreness and not a possible muscle pull/strain, don’t worry about it. Just make sure all of your trunk muscles are tight while performing the lift, and remember to keep your elbows up.

[quote]Nate Dogg wrote:
And get out of the Smith machine and use free weights!!![/quote]

Amen

I’m surprised that you learned a new exercise with 185 and 12 reps.
I would have started with an empty bar and 6 reps. That’s not really an exercise you say? Well, I would have eased them in at cardio day.
Than gradually more reps, add a little weight and so forth.
Being an old fart, I noticed that my body has the nasty habit of reacting to any surprises with a surprisingly nasty little injury that could keep me happy for a couple of months. So I only take babysteps.

Hey, I started doing Front Squats yesterday (02-07-06) as well. I am doing Waterbury’s ABBH as recommended in his book “Muscle Revolution” and the Front Squat is one of the exercises.

I can do heavy Back Squats, but I started the FS with just 135 pounds.
My form needs some refinement, too, so next time I will keep the same weight or maybe even drop a few pounds while I am learning proper technique.

I am suspicious of the Smith Machine. If you dont have a spotter why dont you try doing them in a cage and set the safety bars? Front Squat seems a LOT safer in this regards than the Back Squat.

[quote]Wreckless wrote:
I’m surprised that you learned a new exercise with 185 and 12 reps.
I would have started with an empty bar and 6 reps.
Being an old fart, I noticed that my body has the nasty habit of reacting to any surprises with a surprisingly nasty little injury that could keep me happy for a couple of months. So I only take babysteps.[/quote]

This is a smart way to learn a new technique for anyone. Learn the technique, build a foundation, then start to push your capabilities.

When I started front squatting I figured “well I squat 140kgs so I should be able to front squat 60kgs” and went nowhere. Also felt that soreness in my back the OP describes.

When I pulled it back to the bar I got the technique down. Then I added weight and even though the weight is nothing like my back squat, the technique is good and I’m getting down low with no back discomfort. Lesson learned there.

[quote]Nate Dogg wrote:
I also never recommend more than 5-6 reps of front squats. Poliquin has stated this a few times as well in his Question of Strength articles. Keep the higher reps for back squats and overhead squats.

And get out of the Smith machine and use free weights!!![/quote]

Are you sure? I thought this recommendation was only for olympic lifts. While there is an olympic way of holding the bar, I don’t think the lift itself is an olympic lift. It’s not like you clean and jerk it from the ground every rep, just once at the start of every set.

[quote]Wreckless wrote:
Nate Dogg wrote:
I also never recommend more than 5-6 reps of front squats. Poliquin has stated this a few times as well in his Question of Strength articles. Keep the higher reps for back squats and overhead squats.

And get out of the Smith machine and use free weights!!!

Are you sure? I thought this recommendation was only for olympic lifts. While there is an olympic way of holding the bar, I don’t think the lift itself is an olympic lift. It’s not like you clean and jerk it from the ground every rep, just once at the start of every set.[/quote]

Read the first question and answer about squats in Poliquin’s Question of Strength column.

http://www.T-Nation.com/readTopic.do?id=1401530

Notice what he says toward the end of the question regarding keeping the reps low?

[quote]Wreckless wrote:
Nate Dogg wrote:
I also never recommend more than 5-6 reps of front squats. Poliquin has stated this a few times as well in his Question of Strength articles. Keep the higher reps for back squats and overhead squats.

And get out of the Smith machine and use free weights!!!

Are you sure? I thought this recommendation was only for olympic lifts. While there is an olympic way of holding the bar, I don’t think the lift itself is an olympic lift. It’s not like you clean and jerk it from the ground every rep, just once at the start of every set.[/quote]

Per Poliquin:

One thing to remember when using front squats is to never do more than six reps per set. This is because your rhomboids tire out isometrically before your quads tire concentrically. You don’t want to get to a point where you’re squatting with a kyphotic posture. That’s when accidents happen.

He has stated this several times in past articles and columns.

The lower reps are because you’ll experience rhomboid fatigue before leg fatigue. Once your rhomboids tire your elbows will drop and you’ll have to dump the bar.

Speaking only off the top of my head with no experience and being willing to be corrected by somebody who knows better, I get a bad impression of trying fronts with a smith machines as has been said.

I’m not one who sees the smith as totally useless like some guys do, but picturing this movement in my mind brings up visions of all kinds of potential back tweaking issues.