Well I am still working with the Doc. She is open to input (thank you all on here for the advise). We have moved me to 250mg test-c per week, and I just got the labs back
Total test = 639 (up from 194)
Free test = 16.3( up from something like 6)
and
E2 = 36
We are trying to get up to the high end of normal, but it seems like it is taking alot of test to get there for some reason. She has put me on Novladex at 10mg per day to get the estradiol down into the low 20s, even though she said 36 is well in the normal range. She is happy to bump up the test in the future if the numbers dont move up to the top of the range. So we’re going to stay on this plan for a couple of months and recheck the labs.
Does this sound reasonable? Any issues I should consider?
I think a bunch of you guys complaining about this doc are just complaining. It reads like she is doing the best for her patient based on his concerns and blood work.
Probably a bunch of jealous whiners. This guy has hit the mother lode…leave him alone. In fact, just reading about this doc’s Rx gives me wood.
A T-man would throw her on the exam table after the injection and fuck her hard. You are a lucky man!!!
Seriously your Dr is dumb as a rock. Nolvadex is a SERM not an AI. It will not lower your E2 at all it will just block estrogen at the receptors, raise your SHBG, lower your free T, give you a mild case of brain fog, and send your libido to zero.
You need Arimidex or another AI if you choose, not Nolvadex. Unless you’re growing bitch tits there is no need for a SERM in TRT.
No joke this Dr is clueless and you should seriously take a look at what she’s doing. The best way to go about this is educate yourself. Research these drugs and understand how they work.
Thanks. Did some research and found parts of the answer that seem to indicate that an AI is the way to go. Can you point me to an article or post that articulates when each is to be used so I can continue my education process with my Doc.
Honestly I know from experience with 2 years of TRT and my own research. I’m really trying to help you. If you are properly dosing T and keeping E2 inline with Arimidex you will never need Nolvadex. You would only need a SERM like Nolvadex if you were to develop some gyno issues with high E2. Even then it would only be for a short time until you got E2 under control with an aromatase inhibitor (Arimidex). Bottom line is if your Dr knew what she was doing there would never be a need for Nolvadex. It’s a horrible drug to be on for any length of time.
Another concern is the amount of T you are running. There is no way on 250mg a week your T is still mid range. Are you sure your Dr is dosing properly? That should be 1.25ml injection. Most guys are at the high end of range on 100mg a week keeping in mind, because of the compounding half lives, you have to wait 5-6 weeks to run the first set of labs.
If your E2 is currently 36 that’s not to bad. You can probably get away with .25mg of Adex every other day. Be sure to check E2 a couple of times afterwards so you don’t run it into the ground.
I don’t remember, are you using HCG? If not you need it. 250IU every three days is a good place to start. I prefer a little more than that but TRT in its entirety needs to be tweaked per individual. Plan on it taking several months to get dialed in.
Your Dr is a big concern. You’re being used as a lab rat and she’s trying to reinvent the wheel. TRT is a fairly easy process if it’s properly understood. Also you do not want to have your T over range for any long lengths of time. You will run into health issues like RBC. Others here already have. The goal is youthful levels not running gear.
Well I went to her today for my now weekly T-shot. I asked her why she prescribed Novladex and why she chose as SERM rather than and AI. She was really clueless and said something to the effect that the Novladex was weaker. She clearly did not know the difference between the two. She went on to say that most of her “guys” didnt need an anti-estrogen.
She also kept saying something to the effect that she goes by how her guys “feel”. I either need to find a new Doc I suppose (without getting cut off my T in the process) or continue to educate her. I might take one last shot and show here some of the protocols that are on the web. We’ll see
Holy F*n crap! Step away from the quack! She has NO FREAKING IDEA what she is doing!
Seriously, there are alot of halfway decent endocrinologists/urologists/anti aging docs that would have put you on TRT due to your low #'s of both total and free T.
Is she also monitoring your cholesterol and PSA? Just the fact that she didn’t run an E2 on you is highly…well just fucking stupid.
Also, if you are not currently doing hCG chances are your nuts have fallen fast asleep. Listen to these guys, they know their shit.
So what do you recommend for someone w/this kind of issue as far as T therapy? The low SHBG is what I am reffering to.
[quote]Wise Guy wrote:
That is way to much test.
Your body will react by dropping SHBG, which is a defense mechanism that the body uses to dump extra testosterone, to keep from poisoning itself.
Side effects from low SHBG will be what I like to call a hyperexcreter.
You will use up what T is being slowly released from the ester quickly. Expect evening drowsiness and fatigue to kick in around 60 days on this protocol.
Low SHBG also leads to psychological issues, such as depression and lethargy.
Also, expect estradiol to rise significantly. This can lead to prostate swelling, gyno, water retention, and basically a whole host of problems. [/quote]
Your body will react by dropping SHBG, which is a defense mechanism that the body uses to dump extra testosterone, to keep from poisoning itself.
Side effects from low SHBG will be what I like to call a hyperexcreter.
You will use up what T is being slowly released from the ester quickly. Expect evening drowsiness and fatigue to kick in around 60 days on this protocol.
Low SHBG also leads to psychological issues, such as depression and lethargy.
Also, expect estradiol to rise significantly. This can lead to prostate swelling, gyno, water retention, and basically a whole host of problems.
[/quote]
Where do you get this info? If E goes up SHBG will typically increase in response. Low SHBG can be the result of various medical problems that also may involve depression and lethargy. Implying that lower SHGB levels are the cause of depression and lethargy is probably unsupportable.
“You will use up what T is being slowly released from the ester quickly. Expect evening drowsiness and fatigue to kick in around 60 days on this protocol.” What does that mean and what does binding most of that to SHBG have to do with anything. SHBG bound T is not in the game. How can a slow release ester have an end of day depletion pattern?
[quote]Tenp250 wrote:
Well I am still working with the Doc. She is open to input (thank you all on here for the advise). We have moved me to 250mg test-c per week, and I just got the labs back
Total test = 639 (up from 194)
Free test = 16.3( up from something like 6)
and
E2 = 36
We are trying to get up to the high end of normal, but it seems like it is taking alot of test to get there for some reason. She has put me on Novladex at 10mg per day to get the estradiol down into the low 20s, even though she said 36 is well in the normal range. She is happy to bump up the test in the future if the numbers dont move up to the top of the range. So we’re going to stay on this plan for a couple of months and recheck the labs.
Does this sound reasonable? Any issues I should consider? [/quote]
So this is where you are with 200mg x wk? Then she raised it to 250 and is going to try to get him to tt 1000. Man I’d stick with her and either get her some info on adex or acquire it yourself. I’m really jealous. Took me a year, 1 year of seeing Dr.s within my health plan and fighting with urologist and endocrinologist all of who insisted of taking me off of something each time and crashing my test. so they could retest it. Last 6 months I’ve started and restarted 3 or 4 separate times, really I think he’s pretty lucky. I’d educate myself and just work with her.