New member looking for advice. I’ve been spending a lot of time reading the forum and thought it was time I reached out to ask those with more knowledge and experience about my specific goals / concerns.
I’m about start my first ever cycle. I’m 32, 5’11, in decent shape, 12 stone ish. I trained natty for years and had a good, bulky but ripped physique. Nothing like a pro but very good for a natty amateur. I was often asked what I was taking at the gym but it was purely hard work, good diet.
I’ve dropped training and diet recently so my shape is deteriorating! I’m a hard gainer and usually have to eat A LOT to gain, to the point I seriously struggle, mass shakes do help to fill that gap but it’s hard work to eat enough.
I’m going to be looking at an 8 week cycle of ‘bulk bombs’ (Epistane, Dbol, Anadrol, Winstrol) to gain some (hopefully sustainable and lean mass (although lean is rarely a problem)). I also have some hgh, from my understanding this will have only a small impact muscle wise. I’m using this for the additional age benefits as at 33 I’m starting to notice the decline! Right now I’m planning on doing this one cycle and going back to natty thereafter. Hoping I can keep and maintain a decent amount of the gains with training and a good diet . Wishful thinking maybe?!
What are the forums thoughts on bulk bomb / hgh?
looking at the 8 week cycle to be mindful of orals liver toxicity. Thoughts?
I find the concept of shut down quite daunting! I understand a good pct is essential but what are common sides on your johnson? I mean, I’d love a better physique but not if it means I’m going to be thumbing in a softy for the foreseeable future. I also don’t want to be having to use anything long term to be ‘normal’
any one using hgh that can confirm its effectiveness? (Bloody expensive!)
Are any of the ingredients known to help with appetite? Something I struggle with.
how much of the gains could someone keep if they trained and ate well post cycle / pct? What’s realistic?
I hear people saying they feel unbelievable when on cycle. I assume this can be quite addictive! Do you feel noticeably worse post cycle? If so does it subside? Or is it a case of remembering the few months you looked and felt like god?! I don’t want want a lifelong commitmemt, more of a short term boost to help with my goals. If that’s possible.
I really appreciate any feedback. Good or bad. Current knowledge base is reading on the web and advice from friends. Apologise in advance fir any newbie terminilogy or assumptions!
You are going to get a ton of comments on this. Most of us, me included, believe that no cycle should be done without a foundation of Test. With oral only, you will stop your own natural production and when you stop, you will crash with nothing as a base.
I’ve been on 2 cycles of HGH, currently on the second. I ran 4 iu/day for the first 90 days and then dropped down to 3 iu for the last 90 days. For me, HGH is awesome for fat loss and muscle preservation, not bulking. You will need something else for that.
This depends on the drug. Some do and some make you feel like shit.
If you’re not going to compete and you look good already, I would steer clear of AAS. The shutdown and potential risk of screwing up your endocrine system and being on lifelong TRT is not worth it just to gain a few pounds of muscle.
I’ve read this a lot. Test as a base. Would you recommend simply adding test to this mix? Am I right in thinking it’s essential to inject it? I quizzed a friend on this and he said ‘stick with the bulk bombs’ - maybe not it seems.
I’ve been advised 4iu’s. I went to the needle exchange (UK) and the guy said that 4 was very much at the lower end of the scale and guys picking up needles for hgh were usually looking at 8-10iu’s. I’m hoping for some anti aging and health benefits. When you say muscle preversation - halts muscle loss which naturally occurs with age or helps you keep gains after a cycle?
I hear you. Do you have any experience / opinions on the bulk bomb mix with regards to this??
Most of us recommend Test only as a first cycle. 500mg/week in 2 shots will give tremendos gains and you only have one variable to measure for effectiveness.
I mean that you lose fat and NOT muscle while on this. Go look at my thread about my HGH cut.
Edit: HGH can give you really bad carpal tunnel syndrome
Every time someone posts about doing a first cycle there are 8 replies telling them to do T only.
Is Google correct in stating 12 stone = 168 lbs? At 5’11 even if a hard gainer you can likely just force yourself to eat more (Just like you would have to do on a cycle) and gain a good bit of mass from that alone. Pair that with an ideal gym routine with decent sleep and you could be a lot closer to 200 lbs in less time than you think.
Thanks for the honest reply man! I’ve been toying with this for months if not a year so appreciate the honest approach re: pros/cons.
I’m definitely not looking to compete or get ‘massive’ . Just add some quality muscle that can be maintained some what.
As in the op, shut down is something I find daunting. I was under the impression with a good pct and not being a lunatic with your cycle the risk is minimal although the impact might be felt short term immediately after cycle. Is this not right?
With the test only approach, what’s the main top line benefits of doing it this way? Aside from not filling my body with other substances! Will I get similar results? I guess it can be difficult to track the pros/cons of each substance when doing a pre-mix tablet like bulk bomb.
Really appreciate you taking the time to reply. Thanks
Thanks for the reply! Correct 12 stone = 168. I’m not small but I definitely want to be bigger. I’ve no doubt your advice is sound as I’ve done natty before and was v happy with the results. But man, was it hard and took a long time! I guess in some sense I’m looking to speed up the process of getting there. Completely understand hard work and diet will determine results either way, just hoping for a little help getting there and spped that process up (without too many sides/ potential problems!)
I assuming you think the negatives outway the benefits in this case?
This bulk bomb idea is stupid first of all you have drugs in there that aren’t even “bulk” related. There honestly is so much wrong with you approach that the best advice I can give is just don’t do it. None of it it’s all a bad idea. Plz spend some time researching more and learning to bulk naturally before even considering aas.
One variable to measure. Test is a naturally occurring hormone, as opposed to the orals you are considering. You will get results if you put in the work, no doubt.
Hahaha. As I said thumbing in a softie is definitely a concern and I don’t want my mrs running off with the milkman while I’m at the gym with tiny balls!
Is this just a fact of life for most steroid users? I heard you’re a hero while on cycle, not so much for a month or so after (advised cialis / viagra), then back to normal thereafter. This is a big one for me so any advice / insight is appreciated!
Everybody feels like a hero when they start their cycle until your new muscle gets you laid and you can’t get it up because your E is too high/low or your blood pressure is through the roof.
No one can tell you if you will recover after your PCT, if you do, most likely your testosterone will not be as high as pre-cycle.
If your johnson works when you need it to, you dont want to compete or get massive, please take my advice and never use AAS. They’re just not worth it for cosmetic purposes or for the average gym rat.
With just test alone you’ll be fine I was just joking, I never notice any problems down there or in the bedroom. My libido is elevated while I’m on but doesn’t really go below normal during PCT. And my balls just shrink to around 2/3 of the size but come back after a good PCT so I don’t worry about that - they only get in the way.
Good to hear! So you advise the test only route too? Are problems more likely on the other products such as bulk bombs? Can probably handle 2/3 of the size if it’s short term!
Thanks SB. My cautious side is hearing you for sure! I’ve been convincing myself this can’t be the case as surely all of these guys arent essentially impotent? If that is the consensus I’ll go natty for sure. Any opinion on hgh?
I’m trying to do more research now, completely understand I’m still uneducated. Appreciate your response.
I was under the impression not all of the ingredients were bulk focused but combined they give a good stack for bulking up with lean muscle. Is that not the case? I’m still trying to work out my approach, so any experience or insight would be great.
In terms of bulking up natty, I have for years on and off. I’ve probably been a stone heavier and fairly ripped at my best. Not BB size obviously, but in shape and muscly for your average joe. As I wrote above I’m looking for a little assistance with working out if this is a good route to support my training and goals.
HGH is good if you can afford it. I used it without AAS years ago and did grow off it better than natty.
Not all AAS users are impotent, but the majority have health issues ranging from cardiac to digestion, acne, sexual, fertility to name a few. I would wait until ive had my kids and my natural test is low before I use AAS for cosmetic reasons.
Na that combination or orals you have listed is just reckless. I love mixing orals but dbol, adrol, winstrol, epi is just a pointless stack the only thing your gonna accomplish from this is feeling like dog shit while trashing your liver. But as mentioned earlier orals shouodnt even be apart of the equation right now start with just some testosterone WHEN you do start which I reccomend not be right now.
I think you can find a lot of good info from the training and nutrition part here on t nation. The reason why I suggest learning how to bulk and cut naturally first is you will never be able to hold on to gains from a cycle if you can’t manage to do these 2 things naturally. In order for steroids to be successful long term you really need to understand YOUR body what I takes to grow nutrition and training wise. Once you have this mastered you can dive into aas and really enjoy them. Otherwise your just gonna put some size on while cycling lose it in pct feel like shit and repeat essentially getting nowhere
