Thing is, the main reason I think steroids would be beneficial to me and my training is for the recovery and motivation aspect as well as the putting on muscle aspect. It would also motivate me to train more as I took Ostarine once and when i was on that I would train 3x a day some times. And I know Ostarine has nothing on the sauce lol.
I’ve also had friends take test cycles with no research or even a PCT and they kept quite a bit of size and are still athletic.
Also I’ve heard most of the UFC are/used to take steroids such as TRT to enhance performance, which made me wonder if I could also do the same. I’m not trying to go pro or anything, just want to be bigger and look good while also doing something I love (martial arts).
I think I may hold off on the cycle like some of you suggested and try upping the calories and see where I get to. Possibly then start cycle in 6 months if I’m not happy where I’m at idk. I’d also be 25 by then so would please all the reddit nerds at R/steroids lol.
How much have you trained within the realm of combat sports
We aren’t talking about street fighting, we are talking about combat SPORTS.
I’ve seen muscular dudes waltz into bjj flaring lats and all only to get embarrassingly choked out by someone literally half their size in like twenty seconds
Ditto for Muay Thai and boxing. Contrary to popular belief, weightlifting in the style of bodybuilding has fuck all carry over to striking and grappling if you don’t know how to strike or grapple.
Now if we are talking about a heavier guy who actually has an athletic background (say a rugby player or something)… the athlete has a shot
But nah… a 200lb+ muscular dude steps onto a BJJ mat vs a 140lb blue belt (BJJ), the blue belt submits or chokes out the 200lb guy 9.9 times out of 10.
Even muay Thai… hard sparring where you can’t wrestle (clinch/throws are allowed). Provided the guy doesn’t know how to strike and has no sparring experience chances are
A: he will gas out within one minute
B: a few low kicks and a few body rips and it’s over. Getting hit is draining and low kicks hurt.
It’s not hard to defend against a TOTALLY untrained individual, even bigger guys.
Street fighting is a different story. As most fights don’t last very long… I’d still put my money on the smaller guy, but the bigger guy might win because almost anyone can win in a fight where there are no rules.
As I’ve said, I saw a 140 lb pro wrestler (freestyle) submit a 225lb+ male with ease.
I started at 18, but i dont think that age is what matters, but your experience. I started 147lbs @ 6’2… and bulked natty for 3 years up to 200lbs. I was 91-92kgs before i started taking drugs, but ALSO… i had the mindset which you do not have :
well, i took em because bodybuilding was my main interest.
now my main interest is powerlifting, so i take steroids so i can build A LOT more muscle than i can naturally because i want to be able to lift more than i could naturally.
As far as taking steroids ONLY for fighting - i dont see the point. I have had my ass kicked by guys 20-40kgs lighter. If steroids were the key, powerlifters and strongmen would rule the world of MMA.
Sure, yes - i am also a fan of Overeem, but Overeem would be very big natty also. He has those half-black genetics and he is a freak of nature. Most guys who compete in amateur bodybuilding dont look like Overeem in his prime. Its genetics, not steroids.
Pro MMA guys take steroids, yes. Why?
Its called a shotgun principle. They will do EVERYTHING that COULD help. They also do lots of stupid moronic shit like - jumping rope, use those stupid masks that dont let you breathe, and do tons of junk training. Lots of them either dont spar enough or do it too much and too hard. They do that ice bath shit, and put that thing on their backs that leaves those blue marks(im not native english speaker, i dont know what thats called).
90% of stuff pro athletes do, is proven not to work, but they will do it because its their job and an idea that they MIGHT get 1% advantage is super important when you are pro.
I have never felt ANYTHING out of steroids, that i could say helps me if fighting. If anything, you get pumped much sooner, shit starts to burn, and you gas out.
Also you say you will take steroids for recovery but then train 3x a day. Therefore you delete the potential recovery, lol.
Same with me - i dont get any recovery, because i fcking powerlift and then i spar, and then i teach classes and then i do grappling, and i am always sore and fucked up. Steroids are no magic - they give you +10% of what you have. If you are not gaining weight now, and you cant recover now, steroids wont make a night and day difference.
If anything, when training more and being on steroids, you will notice that 1 hour less sleep, or not enough food a lot more than you would natty.
You will push yourself harder and dig that hole deeper and deeper and thats when you will injure yourself in some sparring.
i ment to say that there are lots of dogmatic shit in fighter training that has been proven useless but still is used because its somewhat of a tradition…
idk how its in modern world, but in my country they also rate school work in a 10 rating and they do this with drawings and essays where it is known that its impossible to draw the line of 6 or 7, yet they do it because it has always been like that.
There are lots of “oldschool” fight stuff thats a complete crap, but it just has been like that always so its just done the same way.
Just today i had a discussion with my sparing partner about combos longer than 2 punches. Sure, padwork, blah blah. But in reality, you rarely see anything more than 2 punches, so we kind of wondered why do we all always trained 3-5 punch combos, slips and dodges between them, when in reality you either throw 1 shot, or defend 1 shot. 2 at the most.
I have an answer for that why its ok for a beginner. But why people who already can punch do that - i have no idea. I also do it but i just dont really know why i do it anymore.
I’ll give you this if you omit striking but that’s it. I grew up in Iowa and wrestled as well as did Tae Kwan Do in my youth (yes I know not a real combat focused art). As an adult I did MMA but preferred focusing on BJJ aspect. Point being I’ve dabbled in a bit and my little brother practiced Muay Thai for few years.
Fights can end quickly even amongst two qualified fighters with on lucky punch. Somebody literally 50% heavier is going to have an extreme advantage dispite the lighter opponents skill. That’s why they have weight classes.
I can tell you at 200lbs and with novice skills I wouldn’t put money on myself against an in shape 300lb guy with no fighting background.
My buddy is like this. Sadly it isn’t the norm. He never ran a PCT, never got much smaller alter a cycle, but he’s had the same basic build since he was 14 (wide and stocky). Never tracked his calories. I had to really work for it even on 500mg test weekly while lifting and boxing. Punches got stronger as I lifted heavier (squats and deadlifts), but cardio suffered some. This was before I started paying attention to BP and lipids tho.
Anyway, just got your friends had one experience doesn’t mean you will. I think your cycle is overkill for MT but decent for building muscle, assuming you eat and lift and recover correctly
Honestly i want to do it so fast because i feel behind physically compared to some of the guys at my gym (mma). I think it would be a good way for me to catch up, even though I’m pretty sure some of them juice anyway.
My goal weight is around 85kg.
I currently am eating around 1.8k calories as I’m trying to loose some unwanted belly fat, then I want to bulk up until around April/May and then cut for summer.
Why would the side effects differ for young underweight guys who can reach their goal without steroids compared to people who have done them for years? Is there something I’m missing?
Ok i get your point regarding Overeem but take a look at Francis Ngannou at ages 24-27
He only started MMA at 26-27! And look at him now he’s a absolute unit.
Now I’m not saying he has bad genetics but he definitely is on the sauce. Why wouldn’t he just train natty and eat right like you say? He was less experienced than I am when he started juicing!
I’ve trained consistently for around 2 years and think i could be more effective at a higher weight class as the higher the weight, normally the less technical.
The higher divisions are easier to compete for people with less experience than people who have trained since they were like 6.
Maybe it’s just a fantasy of mine but from what I’ve read and people I know hardly anyone regrets doing a cycle, only if they get the bad side effects which is why I’m posting here in the first place. Pro athletes/amateur athletes and even just regular people take them and see good results even if they don’t do their research/get diet in check. I am really interested to see what the results would be for me after a cycle, physically and mentally.
Can you explain how my mindset is different to yours? Also just want to clarify I’m not being hostile lol if it comes across that way
Bro, what? 10-12 pounds? 6 weeks with the right plan and some serious focus.
I asked what exactly you ate, like “For breakfast I had this, lunch was this and this”, etc. But anyhow, if you’re eating “around 1800 calories” and doing 8 workouts a week and you’re your height/weight with belly fat, you have a very, very long way to go about learning training and nutrition. How about hitting 3,000 calories seven days in a row to begin with.
Risk:reward. Also the fact that using anabolics with a poor training and diet plan when there are tons of natural gains left is throwing a match into a bucket of milk. Using anabolics when you’ve build a solid base and know how to eat and train intensely is throwing a match into a bucket of gasoline. (loosely paraphrased from @throwawayfitness)
I went from 67kg to 91kg totally natty in my late teens, man. Its kind of pathetic to use steroids to reach a “goal” that is not a goal. My GF is 180cm tall and i believe that she was on a bulk around 80+ kgs…
Your goal is doable in a few months of knowing how to train and eat.
So you are wasting time burning off fat now, to gain it back later. This doesnt make any sense.
Because thats medicine for you. Some people get gyno, some dont at all. Some people need AI on 250mgs of test and some dont on 500. Some peoples balls shrink, some - dont. Some people get acne like a mofo, some dont. Same with hairloss. Same with libido.
One can do a cycle and have 0 sides while other dude might drop dead from that cycle.
Honestly, i dont see why would you think he definetly uses steroids. There is NOTHING on him. There are a few GOOD pictures of him, but we all can make a few good ones. All he has is a bit more pecs, which are 100% genetics. And again, im sorry if i sound racist but - he is black. Black people are better with this.
This is Ronnie Coleman, as a kid, natural. There are black guys like this. Even some whites look good :
Jay Cutler at the age of 18… even if he has done some drugs by now, he hasnt got too much time on them. I am on steroids for 10+ years and i am nowhere near his size at this picture.
I am willing to bet Ngannou is natty. He doesnt have shit. His pecs are a bit bigger due to genetics. I dont see anything else that would imply he is on drugs. He is just black and black is better(i am not black, lol).
Ok, first of all - cycling is moronic.
It works only if you are under trained. Then you take steroids, gain what you could have gained naturally and you stay there. No gains can be maintained after a cycle, if they are over your natural limit. If your friends maintained any size after a cycle, that means they were stupid fucks who didnt know how to train and eat, cuz all they got with steroids was what everyone else can get natural… with a risk of becoming an impotent. Look up how many threads we have of people complaining about ruined sex life, or ruined hormones cuz they did a cycle 2 years ago.
This is gold.
p.s - i have nothing against you doing steroids… in fact, i believe we all should do all we can to be better… what i am against is you taking drugs to get a bit of gains like 2 months faster than you naturally would have, and risking it, because as i understand you want to do a “cycle” which is the worst way to take steroids…
At the very worst case, i could maybe get behind your idea if you are willing to go on permanent cruise dose forever. Wihout all that on and off shit…
p.p.s - you can also just look into MK677… no side effects, some water retention(will look bulkier), recovery, sleep, some people report apetite.
You will boost your natural growth hormone and IGF… If there was such a thing when i started, i would have taken this before i started hormones.
If that is too “pussy” for your - do 2ius of real growth a day… all the benefits you wanted for recovery will be there, again - mostly risk free.
You should also go and do bloodwork and see your test, growth and IGF… You should get used to bloodwork as you will be doing that once a month if you play with drugs. Maybe your hormones are pretty good, and doing low dose test would only shut down that and replace it with the same amount of test, lol. With no bloodwork you cant even tell if you would gain anything from this.
I think I have ok upper body muscle for Muay Thai which is why I wana cut and get my abs showing. Then I want to bulk up my legs (which are skinny af)and a bit more of upper body, idk though tell me what you think
can’t tell if that’s sarcasm or not