Fighting Basics

Training
101

[quote]Kardash wrote:
Mwah… read my original post. He should pick up boxing or MT first, get a good striking base both passively (taking a hit) and actively. After that: add what you want. But imo your base should be striking if you want to prepare for a streetfight. Grappling and RMAs( as someone called them) are just the cherry on the pie.

It doesn’t say a lot, I know, but I have never seen a brawl in which I saw a grappler or wrestler win from a hip-swinging chin-on-chest striker. It’s crucial, and should be practised more often than the other techniques.

But I’m just a biased cunt.[/quote]

knocking someone out with the right cross to the jaw or taking someone into the blood choke and choking him out is same fucking thing to me.It gets the job done.

You may prefer striking,but dont get caught into discussion which tool is the best-axe or sledge hammer…pick the best tool for the job at hand.

102

[quote]Kardash wrote:
Mwah… read my original post. He should pick up boxing or MT first, get a good striking base both passively (taking a hit) and actively. After that: add what you want. But imo your base should be striking if you want to prepare for a streetfight. Grappling and RMAs( as someone called them) are just the cherry on the pie.

It doesn’t say a lot, I know, but I have never seen a brawl in which I saw a grappler or wrestler win from a hip-swinging chin-on-chest striker. It’s crucial, and should be practised more often than the other techniques.

But I’m just a biased cunt.[/quote]

When you suddenly start to fight,you should pick the tactics according to your expertise and your estimation of the expertise of your enemy.
If youre fighting stocky 250 lb. bullneck guy,stay awy from clinching & work the distance.
If your enemy is 6 ft 3,lean,long limbed 180 lb. striker,go for a clinch & take down and pound him into pool of blood or smash him skull into the floor.

103

[quote]SKELAC wrote:

[quote]Kardash wrote:
Mwah… read my original post. He should pick up boxing or MT first, get a good striking base both passively (taking a hit) and actively. After that: add what you want. But imo your base should be striking if you want to prepare for a streetfight. Grappling and RMAs( as someone called them) are just the cherry on the pie.

It doesn’t say a lot, I know, but I have never seen a brawl in which I saw a grappler or wrestler win from a hip-swinging chin-on-chest striker. It’s crucial, and should be practised more often than the other techniques.

But I’m just a biased cunt.[/quote]

knocking someone out with the right cross to the jaw or taking someone into the blood choke and choking him out is same fucking thing to me.It gets the job done.

You may prefer striking,but dont get caught into discussion which tool is the best-axe or sledge hammer…pick the best tool for the job at hand.[/quote]

Right. A straight right is a great tool, but it’s pretty useless if someone sneaks up behind you and grabs you in a bear hug, or if you find yourself on your back with someone on top of you trying to pound your head in.

And, even a combination like boxing and takedown defense would seem to be enough (if the opponent can’t take you down and you can outstrike him/her you’d think it would be smooth sailing), but it’s not. You have to remember that Murphy’s law is always in effect, and you may wind up on the ground (or even start there) by accident. After all, when was the last time you trained boxing in a ring where there were empty beer bottles on the ground, or curbs, chairs, ice, electrical cords, or any number of other objects or obstacles that might cause you to trip or slip and wind up on the ground? Most boxing rings I’ve ever been in are one clear sheet of canvas flooring surrounded by raised ropes. Most wrestling mats I’ve been on are also free of foreign objects or obstacles.

That doesn’t mean that I disagree with training boxing and takedown defense though, just if you are really serious about self defense, you’ve got to do at least some ground fighting training as well.

104

Move. Aim. Don’t have any mercy.
Sound easy? Its not, it requires practice. Find a boxing or mma gym that trains actual fighters and has sparring.

105

Just to be clear - I was purely talking about the fighting basics. Of course stuff like grappling has it’s place. However, I personally believe the very difficult psyche of being able and willing to stand face to face with somebody and starting trading punches - is mostly gained by sparring at the boxing or MT gym.

Besides, in most streetfights people start throwing haymakers - you should be able to properly block/counter those.

Again now; these (the ability to stand face-to-face and trade punches; the ability counter punches) are the pure basics in my opinion. It’s the fundament of the fighting-house. The next step would be to fortify your house with grappling (BJJ’ish) and/or tactical-self-defence stuff like Krav Maga.

106

[quote]Kardash wrote:
Just to be clear - I was purely talking about the fighting basics. Of course stuff like grappling has it’s place. However, I personally believe the very difficult psyche of being able and willing to stand face to face with somebody and starting trading punches - is mostly gained by sparring at the boxing or MT gym.

Besides, in most streetfights people start throwing haymakers - you should be able to properly block/counter those.

Again now; these (the ability to stand face-to-face and trade punches; the ability counter punches) are the pure basics in my opinion. It’s the fundament of the fighting-house. The next step would be to fortify your house with grappling (BJJ’ish) and/or tactical-self-defence stuff like Krav Maga.[/quote]

you shouldnt block haymakers,if its isnt the only option.

107

I bet you are going to say to slip the punch and counter. It works great for wide looping punches

108

yea im confused just started up boxing and kickboxing but how would you counter haymakers/big loopy shots that someone at a bar would throw at you?

109

[quote]yoitspmart wrote:
yea im confused just started up boxing and kickboxing but how would you counter haymakers/big loopy shots that someone at a bar would throw at you?[/quote]

Well, there are different schools of thought on this.

Where I train (RMA) our “go to” response to the big loopy punch is basically to step quickly inside the arc of the shot while simultaneously raising your hands, tucking your chin and launching a short, straight counter to the head/neck (stiff jab, elbow, brachial stun etc.). You then follow up up immediately with a relentless compound attack until a.) the guy drops, or b.) it makes sense to disengage.

IMO footwork/counter striking is far superior to blocking per se for most applications. Have a friend throw a haymaker at you at at 1/2-3/4 speed. With your hands hanging limp at your sides just take one step forward from “conversational” range to “bad breath” range. You will likely find that the inside crook of your friend’s elbow wraps relatively harmlessly around your head/neck. This is just an experiment, not a legitimate defence.

Action is faster than reaction but straight lines are faster than circles. If you see the shot starting early enough and move off the line, a straight response closest weapon to closest target will generally arrive before a big circular attack. This is where boxing tends to shine.

110

[quote]yoitspmart wrote:
yea im confused just started up boxing and kickboxing but how would you counter haymakers/big loopy shots that someone at a bar would throw at you?[/quote]

Short, snappy and straight punches. Like you are being trained to do. While keeping your chin low, the haymakers should simply bounce of your shoulders if you’re doing it right. From your jaw, straight to his chin. If you react time is decent, your hands will be on his face before his haymakers even reached yours.

111

Lets keep it simple…;)))

112

[quote]yoitspmart wrote:
yea im confused just started up boxing and kickboxing but how would you counter haymakers/big loopy shots that someone at a bar would throw at you?[/quote]

Behold, the miracle of punching straight against dipshits who don’t know what they’re doing.

Stick and move son.

Once you understand range and angles - and if you keep boxing, you will - those haymakers are gonna seem so slow, so telegraphed, and so ridiculous that you’ll eat’em up.

113

[quote]Ghost16 wrote:
Thanks for all the replies guys. I know you’re telling me not to go to bars but I like my social life. I’m not gunna sit at home while all my friends go out without me lol. I’m 22 years old and single I like to get drunk on the weekends.

The last time I almost got in a fight was when the ex boyfriend of a girl I was hanging out with showed up. That’s not exactly something I was planning on lol and I don’t feel like I should have to leave when I’m having a good time just because of this asshole.
[/quote]
Man not trying to step on anybodys toes in here but you can try to stay out of all the bars, and dodge confrontation and some asshole is still gonna try you one day. It might be at the store, post office, walmart…who knows. The only way to learn to fight is to fight! Bottom line, dont start shit, dont bully people, but dont take any of it either. Im not gonna go into what you should do in a fight cause EVERY situation is diffrent and if you key on one thing to do for every fight it probably wont work but once. It would be good to sign up at any fighting type school, no matter what the style but dont go in there to learn how to fight. Go in there for the knowledge and conditioning that it will take to win. Everybody has their own idea of what the most effective style is, but you do whats fun to you and enjoy what you do, dont turn down any chance to train in another style, learn anything thats offered to you no matter how much experience that person has thats trying to share with you. Train hard and you will have fun and your confidence level will grow, not in a cocky way but in the fact that if something happens you will be fine. When confronted dont tell this guy u train this or you know this or blah blah blah, let him figure it out when its too late. Hope this helps

114

[quote]FightinIrish26 wrote:

[quote]yoitspmart wrote:
yea im confused just started up boxing and kickboxing but how would you counter haymakers/big loopy shots that someone at a bar would throw at you?[/quote]

Behold, the miracle of punching straight against dipshits who don’t know what they’re doing.

Stick and move son.

Once you understand range and angles - and if you keep boxing, you will - those haymakers are gonna seem so slow, so telegraphed, and so ridiculous that you’ll eat’em up. [/quote]
Thanks man yea iv been doing the heavy bag alot and i need to work on geting my range down for jabs and crosses because idont always have that great of power on them but hooks and body shots are definitely good

115

[quote]yoitspmart wrote:

[quote]FightinIrish26 wrote:

[quote]yoitspmart wrote:
yea im confused just started up boxing and kickboxing but how would you counter haymakers/big loopy shots that someone at a bar would throw at you?[/quote]

Behold, the miracle of punching straight against dipshits who don’t know what they’re doing.

Stick and move son.

Once you understand range and angles - and if you keep boxing, you will - those haymakers are gonna seem so slow, so telegraphed, and so ridiculous that you’ll eat’em up. [/quote]
Thanks man yea iv been doing the heavy bag alot and i need to work on geting my range down for jabs and crosses because idont always have that great of power on them but hooks and body shots are definitely good[/quote]

1.you will forever have great difference in impact power in jabs compared to crosses or upper cuts.its just leverage.

2.on the street,fight is so complex,that to prepare for that,you dont need to split your training to jab practice and other stuff.
Best thing is get a pad man moving resembling the attacking & retreating and practice pad work in the real dynamic situation.It sounds simple,but very few people do that.When they do,they soon find that their overreliance on one-dimensional heavy bag work is inadequate.What I saw across gyms I trained is that 90 % of people doing sloppy power work on the bag and other 9% drilling the combinations and punches.Only very few did any meaningful tactical work on a heavy bag.

This is what you need to do if you want to be effective on the street.

116

[quote]yoitspmart wrote:

Thanks man yea iv been doing the heavy bag alot and i need to work on geting my range down for jabs and crosses because idont always have that great of power on them but hooks and body shots are definitely good[/quote]

No doubt brother. It’s taken me a long, long time to be consistent with my range down. One thing I’v found really helps is doing rounds on the heavy bag just shooting jabs over and over, singles and doubles and triples, and focusing on finding range and maintaining it once I have it.

I got into the bad habit of always stepping forward when I jab. Keep your knees bent and DON’T DO THIS.

117

[quote]FightinIrish26 wrote:

[quote]yoitspmart wrote:

Thanks man yea iv been doing the heavy bag alot and i need to work on geting my range down for jabs and crosses because idont always have that great of power on them but hooks and body shots are definitely good[/quote]

No doubt brother. It’s taken me a long, long time to be consistent with my range down. One thing I’v found really helps is doing rounds on the heavy bag just shooting jabs over and over, singles and doubles and triples, and focusing on finding range and maintaining it once I have it.

I got into the bad habit of always stepping forward when I jab. Keep your knees bent and DON’T DO THIS.[/quote]

Interesting that you feel this way buddy. Do you mean noone should every do this, or just particular typs of fighters? Just want to clarify before I get over-excited disagreeing with you. If it is hijacking, I can start a new thread.

118

[quote]FightinIrish26 wrote:

[quote]yoitspmart wrote:

Thanks man yea iv been doing the heavy bag alot and i need to work on geting my range down for jabs and crosses because idont always have that great of power on them but hooks and body shots are definitely good[/quote]

No doubt brother. It’s taken me a long, long time to be consistent with my range down. One thing I’v found really helps is doing rounds on the heavy bag just shooting jabs over and over, singles and doubles and triples, and focusing on finding range and maintaining it once I have it.

I got into the bad habit of always stepping forward when I jab. Keep your knees bent and DON’T DO THIS.[/quote]

Just curious why you think that stepping forward when you jab is a bad thing? Are you referring to moving both feet, or just the front foot?

119

[quote]Sentoguy wrote:

[quote]FightinIrish26 wrote:

[quote]yoitspmart wrote:

Thanks man yea iv been doing the heavy bag alot and i need to work on geting my range down for jabs and crosses because idont always have that great of power on them but hooks and body shots are definitely good[/quote]

No doubt brother. It’s taken me a long, long time to be consistent with my range down. One thing I’v found really helps is doing rounds on the heavy bag just shooting jabs over and over, singles and doubles and triples, and focusing on finding range and maintaining it once I have it.

I got into the bad habit of always stepping forward when I jab. Keep your knees bent and DON’T DO THIS.[/quote]

Just curious why you think that stepping forward when you jab is a bad thing? Are you referring to moving both feet, or just the front foot?
[/quote]

Snap, mofo. I beat you by seconds.

120

To answer both of you - it’s not that nobody should do this. If you’re a swarmer or more of an inside fighter, you’re going to have to work your way in.

But I am taught to BOX. My coach was from the Angelo Dundee camp and that’s the way that I’ve been taught: much more Muhammad Ali or Sugar Ray Leonard style.

Alot of the power and snap found in straight punches comes from having the correct range. The closer in I move to the target, the more I’m muffling the power of my straight left, and it’s been a fight for me to correct that.

The difference in punching power is huge when I’m not coming forward.