Fedor destroyed Cro Cop and at the time he was considered one of the best and was the most feared striker in mma. Believe it or not you can win by decision and still win decisevely. Also mma rankings are stupid journalists come up with them there is no real way to say who is truly the best.[/quote]
My point exactly. Except for the Crocop/Fedor fight…it was a close fight but Fedor was dominant every round. I enjoyed watching it. Crocop is a dangerous striker and Fedor’s grappling is outstanding. Proof of that is in his record. Over half of his MMA wins are subs. Not to mention, he’s a 6 time Russian Sambo champ, and a 4 time World Sambo champ.
Your point is what? That an untrained violent criminal who is used to street violence could defeat Fedor in a ring match with gloves and rules?
Do you really need me to answer that?
All I’m saying is, Fedor is not “the baddest man on the planet”. No one is. I said this in another thread, but until there is a multi-promotion, multi-combat sport (boxing, kickboxing, and MMA) tournament, there can be no “baddest man on the planet”. People that label fighters as such are more influenced by marketing, which is good for the sport(s), but come on. Thats a bold claim. Especially for someone ranked lower in mma than A.Silvia, who will lose to Forrest Griffen this weekend (fingers crossed).
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Stupid, A boxer or a kickboxer can enter an MMA event anytime they want. The fact is they would get destroyed in seconds. Anyone with a mediocre ground game would tear them up. In fighting sports, someone from the MMA realm is the badest man on the planet. Outside of sport, it’s probably some marine recon guy or something, Knives, guns, tactics, killing without hesitation. The only reason one dimensional wrestlers have excelled in the sport somewhat in the past is that Wrestling is about controlling the oponnent. Also wrestlers have built up strength over thier careers that any non wrestler is not going to have. So if a fight goes to the ground, which any good wrestler can usually make it go there, the only real danger they face is a submission. Last time I checked kickboxers or boxers don’t train submissions.
If I was 16 and wanted to train MMA I would start off wrestling and submissions for a couple years. These two things will win you more fights than knockouts will any day of the week. You can get decisions for controlling the fight and you can get finishes with submissions or possibly GNP. After that, Start working on your standup. But even then, I would still use it liek GSP does and use it to get takedowns. When you are on your feet, there is always a chance the other guy is going to land a crisp shot on you and catch you on the chin. When you are on the ground, there is very little chance of getting caught with a shot.
And when you got you’re title shot, the winning factor would be the guy who can strike better than you and negate your so-called advantage on the ground with stellar ground skills himself… (read as GSP, Silva even Machida)
P.S.- If you were going to start MMA, I would actually learn a real technical art BEFORE transitioning… that’s what all the greats did.
[quote]B.L.U. Ninja wrote:
Yeap. No question. Plus, Fedor’s a pussy. He’s too scared to go over to the UFC and fight the best fighters in the world.
If he’s really as good as everyone thinks, he should’ve taken Dana White’s offer and manned up to fight Brock Lesnar. Pussy.[/quote]
Man you’re ignorant. He fought the best when he was in Pride. Lesnar has a lot more to prove from beating a washed up Mir, and Old Couture and Heath Herring (which I think is only known for his KO when he got kissed)
I think he didn’t come to UFC (which is my opinion) is not necessarily for the money but because I don’t think he likes the fact UFC uses elbows (his first and only loss was from a cut)
[quote]admbaum wrote:
its easy to call someone a pussy over the net. Fedor is no pussy, neither is Iron Mike, or Lesnar. Fedor isnt in the UFC for 1 simple reason; money. All that love for the sport nonsense goes out the window when you are talking about million dollar contracts. You would do the same if you were in his shoes. Contrary to popular belief, UFC is not the only place for mma fighters.
Fedor has a ton of contracts and the contract offered by Zuffa/UFC isnt a good fit for him and no one can think less of him for it. Hell UFC these days isnt what the Gracie family started it as. Its been raped and commercialized to the Nth degree and its on the verge of becoming a WCW/WWF type enterprise. No one wants to see that happen.
Until there is a undisputed, multi-promotional style event, the pound-for-pound list will never be a good representation of MMA’s elite athletes. Unless you think Miguel Angel Torres can stand and hold his own with Lesnar. [/quote]
Like it or not the UFC is the future of MMA. No other organization will be able to do what they do. MMA needs to be commerciaized to sell the sport and increase the pay of the fighters. Fedor could be in the UFC if he wanted, but his manager and M1 promotions want to co-promote the fights. Also it is well believed that the russian mob has their thumb over fedors future. Just take a look at fedors brother.
Last time I checked kickboxers or boxers don’t train submissions.
V
Hmm…Crocop, a professional kickboxer, has 3 subs on his MMA record.
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He is also a military man and I’m quite sure he had trained submissions and ground game BEFORE he got those submissions.
I’m not saying you can’t transition from kickbocking or boxing to MMA, but if you took a strick boxer like Mayweather, and put him in the octagon, any guy who has ever fought on TV in his weight clas in an MMA event would beat him. Same for kickboxers. They would need to train the other disciplines to be able to hang in the octagon, which is as close to real life all out hand to hand combat as we have and probably ever will have.
And you wonder why some people don’t value your opinion on the matter… Suffice it to say a MMArtist with a background in boxing will strike better than one without. There, I said it.
[quote]Therizza wrote:
And when you got you’re title shot, the winning factor would be the guy who can strike better than you and negate your so-called advantage on the ground with stellar ground skills himself… (read as GSP, Silva even Machida)
P.S.- If you were going to start MMA, I would actually learn a real technical art BEFORE transitioning… that’s what all the greats did.[/quote]
Yea, thats pretty much what I said. I didn’t say some rookie could do 2 years of wrestling and submissions and then go in for a title shot and own the current champ. But they would win most of thier early fights and gain experience and then have the time to start branching out into striking, be it kickboking, or boxing. As well as getting into advances submissions defense.
Look I don’t think you need to get all fancy with your skill sets. Fedor dominates people and most of his submissions are via armbar or rearnaked choke, two of the simplest moves to learn and perfect. Fedor hits and armbar with such speed and hip explosion, it makes it really his most effective weapon. Teach brock an armbar and a rearnaked choke. Thats it, he could have finished heath herring 50 times in thier fight if he knwe how to apply a rearnaked chake. He had his back the whole fight. How about an armbar. His hands are so big and his arms so strong his wrist control is amazing. Armbars are about an explosive hip pop and really strong wrist control.
Anyways, I still hold my position that it is easier to transition to MMA from wrestling than it is from another discipline. It’s rare that a guy like GSP comes and has such good wrestling with no prior experience in it.
Fedor’s extensive background in Sambo is why he dominated people. His body control and transitions are king. It’s not about getting fancy…it’s about being proficient at a discipline and having a solid foundation to work off. Most of the great mma fighters are great because they were proficient at a discipline before getting into MMA. That includes grappler’s AND strikers.
And when you’re already proficient at one thing…you can concentrate more and speed up learning curve in wrestling,subs,etc. Or vice/versa. You can’t be mediocre at everything and win. Perfect example is GSP…his bread and butter was initially his striking(Kyokushin karate)…but he has worked hard at his bread and butter being everything…especially his wrestling.
I keep this in mind for myself a lot. I feel proficient with my stand-up striking that I can eventually just focus and get better at my wrestling,subs,etc. I can still get better here and there in my striking. But my learning curve is at a point that I will not lose much but maybe my timing…and put more priority in my ground/clinch game and get to where I am a well-rounded fighter making transition to MMA.
But also keep in mind that you can be “proficient” on the ground and in stand-up and still be a train wreck in putting them together. Transitions is the key. GSP=superior transitions…Fedor=superior transitions.