Fat Loss Stalling

[quote]young n wrote:

[quote]gswork wrote:
more like a DANCE ROUTINE

OP maybe more detail here, injuries being worked around maybe, a sport? Its a bit of a mystery and you probably feel you’re not being helped much, [/quote]

I’ve sucked at dancing my whole life, I’m glad at least someone thinks I have the moves.
Yes I have some injuries that I’m working around, as I’ve grown older I’ve realized there is no point in risking hurting yourself just to pull off the floor for example (I know I pulled off the floor a few months back) and that is why I don’t flat bench even with DBs, only floor presses for me, I barely if ever do any barbell work, it’s just DBs and KBs for now with an occasional barbell movement.
Right now I’m recovering from a “promixal adductor tendinosis or inferior rectus abdominus protective tension” as my coach put it. To bad I don’t have a good manual therapist who understands what that is per say.[/quote]

Please do not bring up age. I’m older than you, as are many others participating in this thread. I pull off the floor for 30+ reps every week, not including heavy RDL’s, and base my entire program around heavy barbell and dumbbell work. I have for years. I turn 30 this year, and I’ve never felt better.

Ok…without clear goals, no one can help.

The “I don’t lift for size but am trying to maintain weight for sports” thing is played out unless you really belong to a sports team. Judging your developmet, it does not look like you spend much time playing sports…but I could be wrong.

Without some more size on you, skinny fat will be some of the best you can do without really dropping weight quite a bit.

[quote]flipcollar wrote:
Why are you being so vague? What sport? What exactly did you tell your coach you want to accomplish? And what does ‘make weight per se’ (not per say) mean? Is it a sport with weight classes? If so, that was relevant on page 1 when you said you wanted to cut, and that aesthetics AREN’T top priority. And what do you mean by ‘it fits in with your line of work’?
Are you a trainer?

Beyond this, if you trust your trainer and are not looking for advice, then why are you posting here asking for advice? It seems like you’re working towards potentially conflicting goals, and on top of that you’re not conveying a whole lot of information about yourself. Makes it hard for anyone to give reasonable advice.[/quote]

Okay it fits into my line of work because I work security, so take downs and a lot of dirty work is involved at times, beyond that I can not go into work related detail, apologizes if I sound like a douche.
I recently got back into grappling and want to compete in it for fun, in the 66 kg division.
I told my coach about my line of work, and told him that there was grappling involved.
My apologizes if I’m being vague or not as informative.
Please ask and I will post.
Basically work is my first priority, then after that is competing in a fixed organization.
But work involves training with is grappling and other sorts of “material.” Do you see how competing is very similar with my work?

I hope I had sense.

Thank you though

Grappling?

Is a sport?

Damn.

[quote]Professor X wrote:
Ok…without clear goals, no one can help.

The “I don’t lift for size but am trying to maintain weight for sports” thing is played out unless you really belong to a sports team. Judging your developmet, it does not look like you spend much time playing sports…but I could be wrong.

Without some more size on you, skinny fat will be some of the best you can do without really dropping weight quite a bit.[/quote]

I would have thought he might be a swimmer - that workout looks like the kind of garbage I’ve seen a lot of swimming coaches hand out - but whatever his athletic potential, he’s not really tall enough to be a professional swimmer.

[quote]KingKai25 wrote:

[quote]Professor X wrote:
Ok…without clear goals, no one can help.

The “I don’t lift for size but am trying to maintain weight for sports” thing is played out unless you really belong to a sports team. Judging your developmet, it does not look like you spend much time playing sports…but I could be wrong.

Without some more size on you, skinny fat will be some of the best you can do without really dropping weight quite a bit.[/quote]

I would have thought he might be a swimmer - that workout looks like the kind of garbage I’ve seen a lot of swimming coaches hand out - but whatever his athletic potential, he’s not really tall enough to be a professional swimmer.[/quote]

I would expect a workout like that for actors on Glee.

No offense, OP.

[quote]young n wrote:

[quote]flipcollar wrote:
Why are you being so vague? What sport? What exactly did you tell your coach you want to accomplish? And what does ‘make weight per se’ (not per say) mean? Is it a sport with weight classes? If so, that was relevant on page 1 when you said you wanted to cut, and that aesthetics AREN’T top priority. And what do you mean by ‘it fits in with your line of work’?
Are you a trainer?

Beyond this, if you trust your trainer and are not looking for advice, then why are you posting here asking for advice? It seems like you’re working towards potentially conflicting goals, and on top of that you’re not conveying a whole lot of information about yourself. Makes it hard for anyone to give reasonable advice.[/quote]

Okay it fits into my line of work because I work security, so take downs and a lot of dirty work is involved at times, beyond that I can not go into work related detail, apologizes if I sound like a douche.
I recently got back into grappling and want to compete in it for fun, in the 66 kg division.
I told my coach about my line of work, and told him that there was grappling involved.
My apologizes if I’m being vague or not as informative.
Please ask and I will post.
Basically work is my first priority, then after that is competing in a fixed organization.
But work involves training with is grappling and other sorts of “material.” Do you see how competing is very similar with my work?

I hope I had sense.

Thank you though[/quote]

That actually does help a lot. Thank you. That being said, this is NOT at all a good workout for “grappling,” and certainly not for security work (unless you don’t have to take down anyone larger than yourself).

As an example - grappling, like most sports/ activities, requires strength through a full range of motion. Training the floor press to develop pressing strength is inherently flawed because training a muscle group (in this case, the chest and triceps) through a truncated range of motion limits the amount of force you can produce when the muscle is stretched past the point at which you usually work it. And no, push-ups with your 150 pound frame are not a substitute for full range of motion bench/ DB presses.

[quote]KingKai25 wrote:

[quote]young n wrote:

[quote]flipcollar wrote:
Why are you being so vague? What sport? What exactly did you tell your coach you want to accomplish? And what does ‘make weight per se’ (not per say) mean? Is it a sport with weight classes? If so, that was relevant on page 1 when you said you wanted to cut, and that aesthetics AREN’T top priority. And what do you mean by ‘it fits in with your line of work’?
Are you a trainer?

Beyond this, if you trust your trainer and are not looking for advice, then why are you posting here asking for advice? It seems like you’re working towards potentially conflicting goals, and on top of that you’re not conveying a whole lot of information about yourself. Makes it hard for anyone to give reasonable advice.[/quote]

Okay it fits into my line of work because I work security, so take downs and a lot of dirty work is involved at times, beyond that I can not go into work related detail, apologizes if I sound like a douche.
I recently got back into grappling and want to compete in it for fun, in the 66 kg division.
I told my coach about my line of work, and told him that there was grappling involved.
My apologizes if I’m being vague or not as informative.
Please ask and I will post.
Basically work is my first priority, then after that is competing in a fixed organization.
But work involves training with is grappling and other sorts of “material.” Do you see how competing is very similar with my work?

I hope I had sense.

Thank you though[/quote]

That actually does help a lot. Thank you. That being said, this is NOT at all a good workout for “grappling,” and certainly not for security work (unless you don’t have to take down anyone larger than yourself).

As an example - grappling, like most sports/ activities, requires strength through a full range of motion. Training the floor press to develop pressing strength is inherently flawed because training a muscle group (in this case, the chest and triceps) through a truncated range of motion limits the amount of force you can produce when the muscle is stretched past the point at which you usually work it. And no, push-ups with your 150 pound frame are not a substitute for full range of motion bench/ DB presses.
[/quote]

I like you.

Dang, with all the glute ham raises and hip thrusts I was thinking black ops undercover dance agent!

So its wrestling-ish? maybe the combat forum has something, or a wrestling coach or maybe I’m way off. In any case best of luck and i’m sure you got some moves really
It looks like kingkai has you covered, read him well

[quote]KingKai25 wrote:

In fairness, OP, I know you’re just asking for help, but this is a very strange workout, which raises some really significant questions for everyone. If you want help, people need to know where you are coming from and what your goals are. So…

  1. How do you define “strong?” You’re doing a LOT of stability and bodyweight exercises, few of which will build muscle and even fewer of which will make you “strong” in any sense.

  2. In keeping with the first question, who designed this workout for you? It’s a hodgepodge of different exercises without many unifying factors. If you want to get “strong” in terms of skill at bodyweight exercises, why are you spending time on things like “1 arm lat pulldowns,” “triceps press downs,” “curls,” etc.? If, on the other hand, you are trying to develop the ability to generate high amounts of force (strength), why are you avoiding literally every worthwhile barbell lift? Floor press is an assistance exercise; why aren’t you benching? Why no dips? Why no overhead press? Why no real squatting, or even leg pressing? I’m a big fan of pull-ups for muscle growth, but you’re only doing them once per training cycle, and you are extremely weak at them (I’m 6’5", weigh 298 lb., and can still do 12 strict pull-ups (palms facing away from me)), most likely because you’re wasting time with multiple rowing variations.

  3. Are you injuries still bothering you? If so, I can understand your reticence to put a heavy barbell on your back or perform full range of motion bench presses. But otherwise, with all the prehab stuff you’ve been doing, you are more than ready to handle some actual weight.
    [/quote]

To answer 2.
My strength training is in conjunction to my other physical activities. My training program isn’t the be all end.

Q.'“strong” in terms of skill at bodyweight exercises"
A.I’m not trying to become gymnast nor plan on being.

Q.“ability to generate high amounts of force (strength), why are you avoiding literally every worthwhile barbell lift”
A.There are other ways of becoming fast or generating force other than with just barbells .

Q.“Floor press is an assistance exercise; why aren’t you benching? Why no dips? Why no overhead press?”
A.I have beat up shoulders, my coach doesn’t want me do those exercises, or at least not yet.

Q. Why no real squatting, or even leg pressing?
A. I don’t have access to a cambered bar or a spider bar, my cranky shoulders don’t like the hand positioning on regular back squats, front squats screw with my left AC joint, I have done goblet hold front squats with a DB with a band. As for leg presses, I have done before, maybe they in coming up in the next program.

Q.and you are extremely weak at them (I’m 6’5", weigh 298 lb., and can still do 12 strict pull-ups (palms facing away from me))
A. Thanks, I’m weak

Q. most likely because you’re wasting time with multiple rowing variations.
A. Rowing variations seem to help, and I would think especially for a grappler. And rows hit the external rotators whereas vertiacl pulling + pushing and horizontal pushing hit the internal rotators, but please don’t quote me on that. But to each there own.
If you feel your strong and well off that my hats to you, but I posted here for diet help not a critique of my routine.

But thank you for your help.

[quote]flipcollar wrote:

[quote]young n wrote:

[quote]gswork wrote:
more like a DANCE ROUTINE

OP maybe more detail here, injuries being worked around maybe, a sport? Its a bit of a mystery and you probably feel you’re not being helped much, [/quote]

I’ve sucked at dancing my whole life, I’m glad at least someone thinks I have the moves.
Yes I have some injuries that I’m working around, as I’ve grown older I’ve realized there is no point in risking hurting yourself just to pull off the floor for example (I know I pulled off the floor a few months back) and that is why I don’t flat bench even with DBs, only floor presses for me, I barely if ever do any barbell work, it’s just DBs and KBs for now with an occasional barbell movement.
Right now I’m recovering from a “promixal adductor tendinosis or inferior rectus abdominus protective tension” as my coach put it. To bad I don’t have a good manual therapist who understands what that is per say.[/quote]

Please do not bring up age. I’m older than you, as are many others participating in this thread. I pull off the floor for 30+ reps every week, not including heavy RDL’s, and base my entire program around heavy barbell and dumbbell work. I have for years. I turn 30 this year, and I’ve never felt better.

[/quote]

My apologizes for the age thing, but if you feel wonderful pulling from the floor then hats off to you. I’m quite happy with my routine, please if you could point me in the right direction with my diet.

Thank you

[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]anonym wrote:

[quote]young n wrote:
As far as my “cut” I guess you can say its for aesthetics, sure why not any other reason next to that will look stupid really.
I know I might have come off as having a distorted image of myself but yes I AM skinny fat.[/quote]

Who gives a shit if you “don’t have enough muscle to bother cutting”, really. If you aren’t comfortable with popping your shirt off now, you might as well get that part outta the way early so that the subsequent muscle building process will be psychologically more tolerable.[/quote]

Wait…so you think he will be happy popping his shirt off if he loses another 20lbs?[/quote]

Bingo. I don’t understand why you get so much crap for making this kind of point, X. I lifted for years as part of my training for swimming (from the age of 10 on). I starved myself down to the 180s from 220 in my first year of college, losing both some body fat but mostly a significant amount of muscle in the process, and initially I was stoked, as I was the leanest I had ever been. I went home for Christmas and an ex-girlfriend said to me, “you look tiny. What happened to you? Did you stop lifting?” Two other high school friends said exactly the same thing. For years, I thought people saw me as fat in high school; now I realized that, though I was around 14-15% body fat in high school, people thought of me as relatively imposing. Totally changed my perspective.

And for the record, while I recognize the MASSIVE amount of discipline it takes to stick to a diet, it sometimes seems like people use dieting as their excuse for a lack of improvement in muscle size - “oh well, it’s okay that my total size hasn’t increased in two years. After all, it’s hard to grow a lot while keeping myself at sub-9% body fat.”

You may not be stage-ready-lean right now, X, but NO ONE would think you don’t lift

[quote]Waittz wrote:

[quote]young n wrote:

[quote]Waittz wrote:

[quote]young n wrote:

[quote]BlueCollarTr8n wrote:
Make that three…
What is your current strength level…
Squat?
Press?
Pull?
Row?
O.H. Press?[/quote]

How do I define strength?
I do not squat, have not in a long time
Floor press 185x6
Chin up 3RM body weight plus 50 lbs, seated cable row 120lbsx3x10 with a 2 second hold,
a few months ago I pulled a 445 conventional DL twice with 10 seconds between the 2 pulls
Haven’t done any overhead pressing since . . . back in the day[/quote]

You did not pull 445…

Or better put if you can pull that looking like you do, you are not eating the macros you say you are. Something isnt right. [/quote]

I’m sorry I’m unbelievable, I usually save that for the girls.
I mean I could go on and on with how I have very short legs (in my opinion) compared to my torso and arms and this and that but I really don’t want to turn this into a numbers thread.
Again I have no reason to lie, I am merely asking for help with my fat loss.

On the other the hand I could just squat 95lbx5x10 and my legs grow very quickly.
I only base that off of filling out my pants to the point where they look skin tight, I have never measured them so I know that statement of mine is very objective. . . or is it subjective?

Thanks for your concern or disbelief though. [/quote]

I am pretty confident that your legs look just as bad as your top does and your pants looking skin tight have more to do with you buying skinny jeans than it does with your 95 lb squats.

You do not pull 445 at 160 looking that like, sorry but it is bullshit. And your legs dont grow very quickly, or you wouldnt be 160 lbs without any visable muscle. So you can continue to talk about how good you are with the ladies and how tight your pants are because your massive thighs grow so quickly or shut up, and accept the criticism and advice from the members here who you asked for help because you are not happy with your progress.

[/quote]

I apologize for whatever it is that seemed to tick you off, if you don’t believe me then by all accounts please don’t. I’m not here to boast about my pull or anything for that matter of fact, just thought it was something extra that I might throw out there. But damn you got me I only pull with a 25 on each side.

Hope you have a wonderful day though.

[quote]Waittz wrote:

[quote]young n wrote:

[quote]usmccds423 wrote:

Yup, could of believed the other lifts, but that 445 is a bit shall we say unbelievable. I’ve been wrong before though. [/quote]

It could be that I played competitive sports for a long time at a high level.
Would you believe the fact that I could get rim (not dunk) at 5’3" before I even started high school.[/quote]

No. [/quote]

Got me again.

[quote]young n wrote:

[quote]Waittz wrote:

[quote]young n wrote:

[quote]Waittz wrote:

[quote]young n wrote:

[quote]BlueCollarTr8n wrote:
Make that three…
What is your current strength level…
Squat?
Press?
Pull?
Row?
O.H. Press?[/quote]

How do I define strength?
I do not squat, have not in a long time
Floor press 185x6
Chin up 3RM body weight plus 50 lbs, seated cable row 120lbsx3x10 with a 2 second hold,
a few months ago I pulled a 445 conventional DL twice with 10 seconds between the 2 pulls
Haven’t done any overhead pressing since . . . back in the day[/quote]

You did not pull 445…

Or better put if you can pull that looking like you do, you are not eating the macros you say you are. Something isnt right. [/quote]

I’m sorry I’m unbelievable, I usually save that for the girls.
I mean I could go on and on with how I have very short legs (in my opinion) compared to my torso and arms and this and that but I really don’t want to turn this into a numbers thread.
Again I have no reason to lie, I am merely asking for help with my fat loss.

On the other the hand I could just squat 95lbx5x10 and my legs grow very quickly.
I only base that off of filling out my pants to the point where they look skin tight, I have never measured them so I know that statement of mine is very objective. . . or is it subjective?

Thanks for your concern or disbelief though. [/quote]

I am pretty confident that your legs look just as bad as your top does and your pants looking skin tight have more to do with you buying skinny jeans than it does with your 95 lb squats.

You do not pull 445 at 160 looking that like, sorry but it is bullshit. And your legs dont grow very quickly, or you wouldnt be 160 lbs without any visable muscle. So you can continue to talk about how good you are with the ladies and how tight your pants are because your massive thighs grow so quickly or shut up, and accept the criticism and advice from the members here who you asked for help because you are not happy with your progress.

[/quote]

I apologize for whatever it is that seemed to tick you off, if you don’t believe me then by all accounts please don’t. I’m not here to boast about my pull or anything for that matter of fact, just thought it was something extra that I might throw out there. But damn you got me I only pull with a 25 on each side.

Hope you have a wonderful day though.
[/quote]

And they say Waittz’s heart grew five sizes that day…

Look man I’m not buying your foo foo bless the world attitude or that at 5’6 160 your profession is security where you regularly need to tackle people.

Nice try though

[quote]KingKai25 wrote:
That actually does help a lot. Thank you. That being said, this is NOT at all a good workout for “grappling,” and certainly not for security work (unless you don’t have to take down anyone larger than yourself).

As an example - grappling, like most sports/ activities, requires strength through a full range of motion. Training the floor press to develop pressing strength is inherently flawed because training a muscle group (in this case, the chest and triceps) through a truncated range of motion limits the amount of force you can produce when the muscle is stretched past the point at which you usually work it. And no, push-ups with your 150 pound frame are not a substitute for full range of motion bench/ DB presses.
[/quote]

Full range of motion works for you, then I’m so full of haterade, I wish I could quarter squat 5 plates that would make my day. But suffice to say I feel that my push ups keep my shoulders healthy. I can understand the benefits of a closed chain movement and a open chain movement.

I really appreciate your input.

[quote]Waittz wrote:

And they say Waittz’s heart grew five sizes that day…

Look man I’m not buying your foo foo bless the world attitude or that at 5’6 160 your profession is security where you regularly need to tackle people.

Nice try though [/quote]

I’m glad I could make your day.

[quote]young n wrote:

[quote]KingKai25 wrote:

In fairness, OP, I know you’re just asking for help, but this is a very strange workout, which raises some really significant questions for everyone. If you want help, people need to know where you are coming from and what your goals are. So…

  1. How do you define “strong?” You’re doing a LOT of stability and bodyweight exercises, few of which will build muscle and even fewer of which will make you “strong” in any sense.

  2. In keeping with the first question, who designed this workout for you? It’s a hodgepodge of different exercises without many unifying factors. If you want to get “strong” in terms of skill at bodyweight exercises, why are you spending time on things like “1 arm lat pulldowns,” “triceps press downs,” “curls,” etc.? If, on the other hand, you are trying to develop the ability to generate high amounts of force (strength), why are you avoiding literally every worthwhile barbell lift? Floor press is an assistance exercise; why aren’t you benching? Why no dips? Why no overhead press? Why no real squatting, or even leg pressing? I’m a big fan of pull-ups for muscle growth, but you’re only doing them once per training cycle, and you are extremely weak at them (I’m 6’5", weigh 298 lb., and can still do 12 strict pull-ups (palms facing away from me)), most likely because you’re wasting time with multiple rowing variations.

  3. Are you injuries still bothering you? If so, I can understand your reticence to put a heavy barbell on your back or perform full range of motion bench presses. But otherwise, with all the prehab stuff you’ve been doing, you are more than ready to handle some actual weight.
    [/quote]

To answer 2.
My strength training is in conjunction to my other physical activities. My training program isn’t the be all end.

Q.'“strong” in terms of skill at bodyweight exercises"
A.I’m not trying to become gymnast nor plan on being.

Q.“ability to generate high amounts of force (strength), why are you avoiding literally every worthwhile barbell lift”
A.There are other ways of becoming fast or generating force other than with just barbells .

Q.“Floor press is an assistance exercise; why aren’t you benching? Why no dips? Why no overhead press?”
A.I have beat up shoulders, my coach doesn’t want me do those exercises, or at least not yet.

Q. Why no real squatting, or even leg pressing?
A. I don’t have access to a cambered bar or a spider bar, my cranky shoulders don’t like the hand positioning on regular back squats, front squats screw with my left AC joint, I have done goblet hold front squats with a DB with a band. As for leg presses, I have done before, maybe they in coming up in the next program.

Q.and you are extremely weak at them (I’m 6’5", weigh 298 lb., and can still do 12 strict pull-ups (palms facing away from me))
A. Thanks, I’m weak

Q. most likely because you’re wasting time with multiple rowing variations.
A. Rowing variations seem to help, and I would think especially for a grappler. And rows hit the external rotators whereas vertiacl pulling + pushing and horizontal pushing hit the internal rotators, but please don’t quote me on that. But to each there own.
If you feel your strong and well off that my hats to you, but I posted here for diet help not a critique of my routine.

But thank you for your help.[/quote]

I’m not attacking you, OP. I’m sorry if it came off like that. Diet isn’t everything, however - you’re already limiting yourself (based on your previously stated macros) to less than 1500 calories per day! You can’t really lower calories a whole lot more, man, at least not without failing to get in everything you need. When fat loss stalls in terms of your diet, sometimes you have to change up your activities (alter your training strategy, include more cardio, etc.). Fact - a set of 6 back squats with 225 is a LOT harder and generates WAY more EPOC than a set of 20 goblet squats with a 50 lb. dumbbell.

And I’m a big fan of rows, but it looks like you’re doing everything with cables only, and that seriously limits the amount of weight you’re able to use, which in turn limits the amount of strength you’re able to build. It’s really that simple.

As for pressing, floor presses still don’t make sense for the reason I gave before - if you work a muscle exclusively through a limited range of motion, you predispose yourself to further injuries. And I don’t really understand why you can do incline db presses if you can’t overhead press OR press on the horizontal plane.

Finally, “there are ways of becoming fast or generating force other than just barbells” - true and false. Plyometrics sure can increase your vertical jump, but olympic lifters generally have exceptional jumping capabilities derived just from constant work on the squat. More importantly, however, as I stated before, certain exercises simply don’t allow for significant loading (like triceps kickbacks, for example), which seriously limits one’s ability to develop strength by doing them.

Anyway, the point is that if you want to burn more body fat, you really need to look into other ways of expending calories. You’re already at a relatively low number of calories.

also, you could go full ketogenic diet. Get rid of most of your carbs and keep your fats and proteins high. That might spark some more fat loss, but you’ll feel terrible for at least a week and your strength will probably go down a bit.

if the guy wants to cut, let him cut. Don’t really see why there’s responses in this thread saying he shouldn’t. His goals are is own.

OP - I really don’t like the look of your diet at all. Pulsing that amount of protein is just weird.

Get some lean meat and green stuff in you instead. It’ll be healthier and I’ll bet good money it’ll be more effective.

Consider carb cycling or carb backloading.