2 POUNDS AND ALREADY TWEAKING. Dre, down to 168 but still having a similar shape to Chris Benoit, executes his “reality check” on timbo (4 belly to back suplexes in a row) and then asks Nate to get the tables. I really want to reinforce what you already know 1. You need to bulk until your frame is full or every second person comments on your size 2. You can eat and bulk with conviction because cutting will be a breeze for you. Dont second guess your self esse - have you already forgotten JMB’s words. As for me not being 200, Ive been measured around 5’9 - 5’10 with ok but not wonderful posture and I look bulky even today (nate - dont diet is so darn easy and effective - RIP fat fast). While nobody in gyms in my area deadlifts I’ve been doing 220-240 x 10 for 4 sets and 130x10 powercleans for about 8 months (never really added weight after that) and have rhomboids and traps like green louie. Plus Im doing 10 x standing military press with the big wheels and Im obviously wide in a business shirt. Im reasonably balanced but I simply gotta reassess my program here - If I get back to 180 but with 5% and good proportions Ill beplenty large for my size. I hate to say it cause Ive always given equal priority but a beach muscle prioritisation may be in order. BTW I turned 30 last year and, if you havent noticed, am on the other side of the planet 
. My strange quote about owing it to shorter guys was a tongue in cheek eminem stan rip off but I swear if I had your height Id be following W Hoppers “enormouse eating”. Anyway, Im pretty critical about programs but I think yours looks great and I like the balance. Given that the volume is good, I would not go to absolute failure on every set and would use forced reps/drops on the last set only for no more than a month. But when you do them go hard, eat really well, and make them count. Two things to keep in mind (1) with that frequency Id say a Massive Eating type diet would result in up to 75% of gains being muscle (2) creatine = more reps at same weight = more effective workouts and gains for me and I see it fixing up the main shotcoming of substituting creatine with beef. Nate, Im thrilled to hear you are so focused on increasing the weights rapidly - its pretty obvious youve always had the smarts and now have the will to get it done but you gotta keep posting for inspiration not long ago. I was 5x5 90 on curl and 200 on bench recently -I wish we had a get big post where we give stats, post size or 1-2 lifting goals and post progress to use for motivation. Whopper man, I totally relate to the fight skills motivation (I get similar from some of TC’s writings I think that it might be up there with self discipline and drill sargeant as T man traits) and love the way you keep it so real while having a family cause its common for tmen to lose their focus when they “settle down” and shortchange themselve in terms of physical and mental development which isnt exactly a plus for them or family. Im not going to think about it from now but my real goal now is to have the balance you have there. I like the undertaker references - are you anywhere near that over the top rope type height and if so, how do we get you into the WWF and how can I become your manager ;). Mike and Hoser, I also like hearing what other Tmens goals are and how they are going about it so fill us in.
All this talk is getting me more and more jacked to go get huge. The past two months or so I dieted myself down to a four pack. Not great, but good enough for me. I’m not big enough to worry about getting ripped just yet. I’m 5’8" at 162 lbs right now. I’m beginning massive eating at about 2200 cals. Yeah, that’s low, but I can’t go from 2000 to 4000 right away, right? I should be packing the grub within a month or so. My plan for training was to start Ian King’s Bring the Pain once my cals were up, along with a similar upper body program, but now seeing how everyone else trains, I’m thinking I should just stick with the basics until I add more size. I really like the 5x5 method so I think I’ll give that a go. I wanted to know what you guys think is the limit for amount of sets in a workout, not including abs. I was thinking about 15 but for some phases you could go up to 20. What limits do you guys place on your workouts as far as the number of sets is concerned? Thanks for the input guys.
Dre bro…I appreciate the kind words, and I do “keep it real” primarily due to the T-vixen…She LOVES muscles, and has the hormonal drive of most 17 year old men…so I don’t only do it for myself, I do it because she rewards me (very very well) Your right most men get slouchy once they get hitched…for us tho…gotta be honest…we are both vain as hell (Nothing wrong with it…lol) and both work very hard to keep in great shape. She is the first to notice any size gains on me, and is always the first with a harsh criticism, either about the physique or my technique in the ring when fighting. It is one of the things I love about her so much (besides the hormones) is the downright cold hearted honesty, because when the complements come…I know how sincere they are. When she says your the best looking thing on this beach…I know it isn’t bullshit smoke being blown up my ass…it is truth, and it makes it that much sweeter…lol. As far as the height, I am 6’5" so not quite undertakers height, but as I posted, got his build… As I posted elsewhere, I was geneticly gifted with good legs, great calves and a great ass (according to the ladies) but a scrawny ribcage and spindly arms (12.25 inches I think when I started…at 6’5"…lol…can you say flagpole?) Honestly when I started, I looked like someone put some skinny guys torso on a decently built dudes hips and legs. The chest and back have filled out great, but I struggle constantly with the guns (which sucks cause it is the vixens favorite bodypart…at least of the ones you can show in public,…lol!) To be honest, I have considered doing a cycle this winter (grammabol) and trying to get to 275 or so, then consider finding out how to get into the WWF. At 31 it aint likely…but you never know…lol) But then again, I don’t want the vixen around "The Rock, and I don’t need to be around Lita, or there could be a divorce!! LOL)
Peace Bro!
Hoser…welcome aboard…now before I tear into you…I need some answers. It is now SUMMER…do you really want to bulk NOW? Cause if your heart isnt in it…then it aint gonna work, and I will have another Timbo on my hands…and I would just stop posting for a while out of frustration…lol! If you have just dieted down, I suggest you just kinda maintain for the summer…keeping it good for the beach, and join the Whopper in October with the “Lose your abs, but gain a lot of size” workout program…it is very complex, filled with the latest scientific info, you need about $1000 worth of supps, you change your routine every other day, and do lots of flyes, tricep kickbacks, leg extentions, and broomstick twists. Actually it is very simple, it is called BASIC LIFTS and EAT EVERYTHING!!! I know it is a 40 year old program, but for some damn reason…it works…go figure!!
Hoser, sounds like you have a good physical and mental basis to get bigger there - I couldnt agree more with the “4 pack is fine until Im happy with size thing”. Same goes for a increasing cals over week or so instead of suddenly. I usually go for 10-12 for upper body with extra sets for legs and abs on days I work them. But how about a bit of progression/adaptation in your program - a few weeks of hit with 3-4 exercise/bodypart if you are resting or doing high volume to ease in to balls to wall stuff and for recovery/adaptation gains, switch to 5x5 with 2 exercises/bodypart until strength increases, maybe a week of 6-1 for extra strength and check 1rms, then either 3 sets of 3-4 exercises 8-12 reps or GVT for maximal hypertrophy using increased strength, then ease up and check fat if you ate properly, then change up again. Think horses for courses - lower reps for strength, 8-12 for size if you are under 2 years training (ian king has the guidelines in a recent heavy metal). After eating, Nates obsessively increasing weights is a sure sign of imminent growth (Im not sure why but Im conviced Nate is working so hard he’s scaring others in the gym). Keep us posted - all this bulking talk is getting me psyched for GVT starting next tues :).
Man, I was just reading this post because I was bored, and I wanted to see what Berardi said. Nate Dogg and Timbo, I don’t know you guys, and I don’t want to rub you the wrong way or make enemies. My gosh, it took me a long time to get to where I am, and I’m not pretending that I’m a monster, but I’ve read a lot of your post, and you all sound like you know your stuff, but I thought you guys were much bigger. Maybe you shouldn’t put so much money into supplements and put a little more into your grocery bill.
whopper, thanks a bunch for pulling out the welcome carpet, it’s much appreciated. I know it kind of sucks to have to bulk in the summer, but I want to pack some size bad. I’m still in school, (I’m 23) and find it hard to keep my diet and sleeping paterns tweaked for optimal size gains during the school year. Besides, I’m not afraid to add a bit of fat and by the sounds of the massive eating plan I won’t add all that much of it. This summer is optimal growth time for me as I am working a desk job and have lots of time for getting everything good to go. I rarely go to the beach anyways, or anywhere where my shirt comes off for that matter. I gotta bulk, it’s in my mind and soul right now.
Hey Timbo these guys sure give you a hell of a time don’t they?? I’ve just been browsing through past threads and this is at least the 3rd time the topic of your unwillingness to put on weight has come up. I’ve read some of your posts in which you say the weights you lift now are nothing compared to those you used to lift. So I assume at one time you dieted down to your current levels of 6% b.f.?? Or are you just naturally that lean?? If you really dieted hard and long to get down to that level then I can understand your apprehension about putting on weight…once you work really hard to get those abs it’s really hard letting them go.
! Way too coincidental me picking up on the WWF and too cool (no pun intended) of you to mention it. Im not in the US and have trouble getting WWF and UFC but Im a huge fan. Ill keep an eye out and are 100% behind you on doing what it takes. And I promise not to go on about this but generally what style fighting are you doing and what styles have you trained (grappling)? The mic skills could be honed acting style … trying out a subtle personna for size and pop in the ring might be interesting. Plus the springboard from competition of Angle, Shamrock and Abbot cant be ignored. I think the usual start is indy wrestling etc but where theres a will theres a way. You have probably heard about WWF “Tough Enough” to get into wrestling. I cant work out the email thing you guys mentioned but Im on to this for kicks. I may be too small to be much use in the ring, but Im a 30yo dedicated, motivated and very savy tman trapped in a corporate/commercial lawyers job and I sure as hell can relate to Ed Norton in fight club. PS Net access is always a problem for me for the next two days.
Hey Whopper
To answer a question you asked a while back…massive eating is probably pretty good for most people to gain size. Some however have screaming metabolisms and may need more cals (if you can believe it). Lets face it though. When you are young, you can get away with eating everything in sight and then some and grow with minimal fat gain (a few %). But why get in the habit. When you get older you cant eat like this so basically why not learn what works for you when you’re young. Remember, most people just dont eat enough. By eating everyting in sight, you got enough. If people do massive eating right, then they will be getting enough cals but will feel better and gain less fat. For a good picture of how to design a massive eating plan, check out tomorrows update.
I’ve been lurking on this forum for I don’t even remember how long and you guys have been a great inspiration to me. I so identify myself with our man timbo (SB) here. I used to be a fat kid and now at 23 I’m 6’3" and 170lbs I just can’t shake the feeling that I’ll get fat again when I start gaining weight. I have all the motivation in the world when I start trying to gain weight but it always around 180 I start feeling really fat and start a mad diet. I’ve been doing this for like two years now and I know I ain’t getting anywhere with this so at least by reading the stuff here I know there are others like me. Whopper, you’re really the man, your ‘no bull, just do it’ attitude has really inspired me. I’ve saved your comments and whenever I start feeling ‘fat’ I’ll just read those a few times and I’ll know that this time I can do it. THANK YOU MAN!
Jesus, This post should be called the Timbo support group. Damn I have never seen more t-men kiss another mans ass with such vigor. Timbo, if you do not get it at this point more words will not help. This whole post boils down to mental masterbation if you do not act on this. Good luck man.
Hoser, to answer your question, I do about 15-20 sets per workout. Since I am doing the 5x5 method (it will change to the 6x4 method in the near future), I do between 3-4 exercises per workout. Time is my only limiting factor. If I’m in the gym for more than an hour, then I know I’ve been working too long. Those are the days where I do three main exercises for 15 total work sets. This excludes ALL ab work, warm up sets and 20 minutes of cardio after my workout. I only train Mon, Wed, Fri and this is perfect for my recovery levels. Tues and Thurs are active days with mountain biking, stadiums, etc. Weekends I play.
Dre, I’ve noticed people watching me as I’ve been working out lately. They see me doing heavy deadlifts w/o shoes, benches with great form, deep squats w/o shoes, dips and chins with extra weight and heavy overhead presses. My weights are moderately heavy at this point (still recovering from loss of strength from past injuries). But since I’m adding 5-10lbs each week, I’m gaining strength quickly and getting closer and closer to my all-time bests.
AndyWayne, I never said I was big. In fact, many people have seen me or read my stats. I have never tried to mislead anyone into thinking I'm big. As for my supplement bill vs. groceries, most of my supplements have nutritional value (Grow, Surge). I only bought the T2 and a bottle of MD6 to help me stay lean as I gain. And three bottles of T2 will last me an entire year with the way it's supposed to be used. And my grocery bill is already quite high, as I have been eating Massively ever since the Orlando seminar in February.
I think many of you think I’m going to be a huge mass of muscle. First of all, I’m only 5’4" with an ectomorphic frame. I would never expect to be more than 160lbs at my height unless I wanted to be a big fat ass. Also, I’m not training as a bodybuilder. Yes, I want to add muscle. But my main goal is functional strength. That is why I’m training with heavier weights, lower reps and more sets. Yes, I will get bigger as a result of this training because it will cause hypertrophy of the type IIb fibers (fast twitch). And with an increase in strength, typically comes an increase in size. Not all of us are into bodybuilding or have desires to be like most bodybuilders. After years of trying different things, I have finally figured out what works best for me. And it’s as simple as hard work on very basic exercises using heavier weights and moderate-to-low reps. 
John, I appreciate the reply. I do see your point about training yourself to eat right…it was a bit of a transition for me at about age 25 when suddenly just bulk eating started filling out my fat cells (as I stated got to 17% to 20% bodyfat, so what your saying makes great sense, I guess I remember when I was young, I didn’t have the meal dicipline massive eating requires…all the planning…I used to just see something…and if it wasnt moving…eat it…lol. Now, I am older, 31 and have that dicipline, and can plan out meals a week at a time (been doing the 7 pounds of chilli long before you posted it…lol, just once in a while it happens to fall on a couple of hotdogs, and well, a mans gotta do what a mans gotta do…can’t waste that healthy chilli!! LOL! The nicest thing I have noticed is (and what these guys don’t realize) is the bigger you get, actually the more you can slip, because the muscle burns quite a few calories…for me just sodium is a concern…I can bloat like a mofo…lol, but if I slip, and wolf two Arbys Big Montanna Roast beefs with Mozzerella sticks and a coke slurpee…it doesnt kill me…lol! The rest of you guys who have posted recently, I am very flattered that this string has inspired you, and I wish you all great success in building some size…just don’t get caught up in all the little details. If you have all read this string…then you know, it isn’t rocket science…there are quite a few things you can do to “fine tune” as you go on, but until you get a good foundation going…just eat massivly, and lift simply…nothing fancy to it at all boys…good luck, and I am always willing to give ya a good solid kick in the ass if ya need one…so is Dre and Nate!!
timbo, ive been traveling the last few weeks so i havent been on the forum much. just finished reading all the posts on this thread and wanted to second what whopper, dre and nate had to say. you either have to take their advice and do it or find a new hobby 'cause you are wasting your life for nothing. it would be like you saying you are obsessed with becoming the next michael jordan but dont practice more than once a week and spend the rest of your time asking for and giving advice about basketball on the internet. to be obsessed with getting huge and at that same time not having the guts to actually do it seems to be quite a problem. i hope you can work it out some how. btw i started training at 145 and got up to 215. that was when i was as obsessed as you seem to be. now i dont let eating and training control my life as much anymore, i actually go out and drink and party and play sports, and dont ruin my night and everyone of my friends nights if i dont eat every two hours. i have found a happy medium where i can actually have a life and still “bodybuild.” i wil probably never be 215 again but i will probably never be below 180 either. currently i’m 195 but with the spring here i have been out hooping quite a bit and will start partying and drinking even harder with the concert season approaching so i know that will quickly become 190 or even 185. but i can now except that, whereas a few years ago i would never have allowed that. my point is we all have our mental hang ups about looking a certain way otherwise we wouldnt be on this forum. i got over my obsession with being huge and lean and forgoing every other aspect of life. dont get me wrong i still deal with it and always get a little upset around this time of year when i start running around and losing a little size, but i accept it. i still have to eat as frequently as possible or i get annoyed but not to the point i was at a few years ago. theres a t shirt that they sell in bodybuilding mags that says “life’s too short to be small.” well for me, with my genetics lifes too short to be huge. bottom line is you have an obsession with being lean which is holding you back from getting huge. i had an obsession with being huge which held me back from truly enjoying life, i got over it and so can you i hope. you know how you have to eat and train the rest is up to you. i just hate to see you wasting all your time and getting nowhere. good luck my brother.
Nate Dogg, your recent theme seems to be heavy weights and low reps. This is something you arrived at after years of experimenting. This seems to correlate with what Ian King says about training age, that the longer you train, the better you respond to lower reps. I hope that he puts out an upper body program with the same customization parameters as Bring the Pain program. I’m actually planning to do just that with the Get Buffed program while adjusting some of the rep ranges patterned after Bring the Pain variables. I’ll let you guys know how it goes.
The Game brings up a good point that all of us (especially Timbo) need to remember. That we are doing this as a healthy endeavor. And it is not your entire life. I keep telling Timbo that. I have done very well balancing work (full-time), working out, friends, family, my personal time and social time. And I think that everyone should do the same. No ONE thing should rule your life. Yes, I think about my workouts often, and I think about getting outside and playing. But some of those things involve other people and events. And it doesn’t rule me or my life. And like The Game said, don’t let your meal timing ruin your social life. I eat when I’m hungry, I eat when I have a chance, but I’m not anal about it. I still eat at LEAST four meals a day and usually 5-7 is more typical. Does it really matter if you don’t eat every 2-3 hours? No. It’s not gonna kill you or destroy your progress as long as you are consistent overall. So be sure to keep the balance.
Hyok, yes it is as Ian King has said. That over time, your training will progress to lower reps. For me, it seems to be working well. I think the key has also been a lot of hard work. And that is something that I have always been wishy washy about. And that is the reason my gains, or lack thereof, have been up and down and it has been a constant struggle. Things are on track now. I feel great, my recovery has been good, my workouts are fantastic, I make progress every week. My motivation is high and I'm enjoying life. I only wish the gains came a little faster! I'm working hard and want it to happen sooner than later. :)
Part Deux of Deux
Dre…my man, we gotta hook you up with some full-time Internet access, brutha. You’re one hella cool T-bro and we need ya in the looptie loop. Man, I never meant anything by my comment about why you’re not 200, it was all in jest. You know exactly what you want, how to get it and you got the rhymes and reasons to back yo’ thang up, baby! I really look forward to tapping that keg of knowledge, experience and expertise you’ve got ridin’ on the killa set traps you’re rollin’ wit. I also look forward to posting some very impressive stats in your next survey
Gamer! where ya been, big fella...I was waiting to hear from ya cuz I know you're always watchin' my back. Just like Nate Diggity Dogg, you help me realize that "there's more to life than" (how's song go) just bodybuilding...I've been eating, sleeping and breathing this for a while too long now and I've got little to show for it except a 6-pack??? That's crap and like I've said before, your main man Timbo's going to makes some changes. Thanks for sharing some of your own thoughts on the state of the game and getting me back into reality. I used to be a balla, shot calla, and a sports freak...it's time to get back into those kinds of things.
Kelly and Mike M...thanks for the comments they're appreciated. Anybody else, sorry if I didn't get back to you personally but I think the moderator's going to open a can of whoopass on me here soon:-) I did want to mention that I don't exactly look for the magic supplement or blow a lot of money on supps...yeah, I've been spinning wheels for a while but really the only supps you'll find in my cupboards are some protein powder, MRPs and some glutamine (and Surge soon). Also, the BASICS do make up the core of my programs.
Oh, and JB...I really appreciate your thoughts, too, buddy. Your words mean more than you know. Like my man whopper, you've been in these same shoes...and you both took action, so now it's Timbo's turn! Thanks, everyone.
This is yet another Two-Parter
SB’s in the house…finally:-)
Okay, a few general words: just wanted to thank all the T-guys and T-gals who’ve posted and shared their insight, experiences and opinions. The current plan for bodybuilding…well, I’ve accepted whopper’s generous offer of getting my bulk on with him hardcore in October. But, that doesn’t mean I’m going to sit around for now and just do nothing. I have yet to write out the plan–Nate’s advised me to do something I should have done a while ago…write down the goals I wish to achieve–but I plan on bulking from now until June, then look pretty for summer. However, these bodybuilding goals aren’t the only ones…it should be pretty clear by now that Timbo’s got some other issues that are far more important to rectify that will take priority. These include family, friends, a social life and rounding myself and my life out. I’ll definitely keep you all posted with my progress–and that’s exactly what it’ll be–and I want to continue to participate in the forum sharing my knowledge and learning from others…a few shout outs:
Nate Dogg, bro, you've been a hella cool pal, my man...I can't wait to get down to G-Ville and chill wit ya, bro. You've opened my eyes to more than you know, my man. I've got a bright outlook on the future right now, my man, a real bright outlook. You can bet your ass that things are going to start *rounding* out for your boy. It's PMA all the way. You have done a great job of getting your life and priorities in order, you've overcome some major things in your personal and training life and I look up to you like a big bro...
Whopper...my man, I've said it before, and I'll say it again, I got nuthin' but love for ya, bro. You've really sparked a fire under my ass...you tell it like it is, you can relate with where I am and where I want to be. You've got things in order for you...a great wife and kid and life in general. You should be commended on your life accomplishments. I have the utmost respect and admiration for you and what you've done, big guy. I look forward to you showing me how its done in October, my man. But until that time, your lil' SB's gonna find out what works for HIM.
I was just reading thru some of the posts another time and had a few observations:
Nate Dogg, my man, I thought I was the last goon who did deads and squats SuperFly Jimmy Snuka barefoot style:-) LOL!
Whopper, I think my hidden talent of being a barber (I cut my own rug) will come in handy after you lay the smack down on those other fools in the ring…I can see it now, Big Whopper on the TitanTron…Timbo and Nate Dogg come from underneath the ring after the chumps are knocked out and get in some cheap shots:-)
And all the while the Big Fella eats his Big Montanas and washes 'em down with a slurpee, ha!