Just a quick thought: It does make sense that Meltdown Program is suited for someone with a higher BF%. That means, if done in conjunction with a low/no carb diet - wouldn’t someone with the higher BF% have more energy than someone else with a lower BF% (and performing the same routine/diet)? Of course then once they do lower their BF% significantly they will be hating life.
Now, as many of you know, I have 10% BF now, and was about to embark on Meltdown. However, I was not going to go on a low carb diet - but just modify my diet according to my needs. Does this mean I will be losing out on the effectiveness of Meltdown? And then, would this 5x5 Program be better suited for me? I was about to consider Staley's EDT program as well.
When I was doing high reps during a cutting phase I started to get soft and weak. I have changed to a 5x5 protocol and my strength is going through the roof. That is just my personal experience with two different types of training while cutting.
Joel and Heb- I know that this issue has been addressed on another thread but can I once more take you up on the notion of increasing muscle “tone” or resting muscle tension i.e improving the hardness of a muscle, which you both mention?
My understanding from speaking to exercise physiologists has always been that residual tension in a resting muscle is a neurolgical phenomenon not amenable to change and therefore talk of “toning” both in a scientific and popular sense are not possible. I appreciate that your perception is that you have improved muscle tone or hardness of the resting muscle but is it just a perception?
In the current Reader’s mail, on this very topic T.C Luoma takes the view that the hard look is pretty much a lack of body fat and that muscle by its nature is soft. It would be useful if someone can provide the science on this one way or the other.
How you doing hun? I would definitely go with the 5x5 program as your starting BF% is already very very lean for a female lifter. The great amount of tension put on the muscle through heavy training is exactly what you are looking for to achieve a incredibly ripped physique with defintion that will have any guy drooling. Both EDT and Meltdown are very taxing on glycogen stores even with moderate carbohyrate restriction in the 1g/lb LBM range. You can bet your stores will be pretty low, and recovery will suffer in the process. For an experienced lifter like yourself, I would prescribe 2 exercises per body part (at least one of those a compound movement) for a total of ~50 reps.
If I was a female lifter, I think I'd very rarely train with anything higher than 7 reps; and you could bet I'd be one of the leanest, hardest females in the business ;)
Aside the the potential benefits of increased muscle tone (I’ll say it that way so people can judge for themselves when they try it out), any strength based programs is going to be easier to do while dieting.
I think the reasons have already been covered, but lower volume/higher load programs are well suited for a cutting phase when energy is low. This type of lifting preserves lean body mass and strength which is vital when cutting. Low body fat is nice, but you need some muscle to show off when your body fat gets low enough or you get that "I'm a drugged out rock-n-roll singer" kinda look.
While Meltdown may be a significant shock to the system for someone who is overweight and has a lot of extra energy to burn, it may not be the optimal program for someone like you, who is already in phenomenal shape.
I'd stick with a strength based lifting program (save EDT for a hypertrophy stage in your training) to preserve strength and lean body mass and then lose the fat via dietary manipulation, supplemenation, aerobic training and anaerobic interval/Fartlek training.
I have tried both Meltdown I and Heavy/Low rep (not exactly 5x5 but something incredibly similar) while on T-dawg diet and I got better results from the Heavy/low rep method. The reason I prefered it was because I held on to my strength MUCH better when RESUMING hypertrophy training. And I would also feel more alert and energetic outside of the gym. Next cutting phase I will conitue with 5x5 protocol and add some light cardio as Norcross as recommended. I also wanted to chime in that Meltdown I might be better on a higher carb diet. Although I havent tried this approach you “feel” that there wasnt enough carbs to do this program with T-dawg.
Heavy training is the only type of training that promotes considerable, noticable hypertrophy of the contractile proteins actin and myosin. You train heavy and you get stronger; the only way you get stronger is through the hypertrophy of the contractile proteins. Also, myosin is the most dense portion of skeletal muscle and incorporating training that hypertrophies this protein translates into greater muscle density.
Heavy training puts greater tension on the muscle. Greater tension = greater muscle tone. That is what body building posing is all about. Why do you think the pros spend hours flexing in front of the mirrors before a competition? Posing puts incredible tension on muscle tissue, thus bringing out striation, after striation, after striation that would not have been visible otherwise.
Unless you have some serious genetics, the dense, rugged look can only be achieved through heavy training.
Joel, I don’t consider myself an expert on training, but can’t one increase strength through neuro-adaptations without increases in muscle size? I believe Charles Poliquin said this is what many athletes do to increase strength and stay in their respective weight class.
Joel- many thanks for taking the trouble to reply. Forgive me for remaining a little sceptical. Bodybuilders may need to learn how to tense a muscle for best effect but this does not neceessarily affect the tension of a muscle in a relaxed state. I suspect that science (and TC!) may be against you on this one but I appreciate your response.
Peter: What Joel is saying is correct (about static posing). I have experienced this “phenomena” first hand. Usually about a three months out from a contest, I begin posing practice - then by two weeks out from a contest, I’m spending at least thirty to sixty minutes a night posing and most of my gym time is dedicated to posing. Reason? This gets me “harder looking”. Purely cosmetic. Agreed, but it works. Try it.
Joel and Jason: Thanks so much for the input. I have decided to use Meltdown only for pre-contest and 5x5 for gaining strength and LBM. Another good thread.
To elaborate on Joel’s reply, which hit all the main attributes of heavy, high tension lifting, I wanted to add that you’re also right that the neuro-muscular connection definately has a big impact on resting muscle tension. And it is heavy lifting that conditions or “forces the adaption of” the neuro-muscular connection, not higher rep “hypertrophy” style lifting, so it stands to reason that yes, heavy, low rep lifting reinforces the neuro-muscular connection leading to immediate strength gains via that mechanism witch carries over into higher resting muscle tension through the neuro system like you alluded. There is only one “camp” of exercise physiologists that doesn’t support this adaption (mainly some college profs). For a good discussion of this with referenced studies, read Pavel’s “Power to the People” and some of his other works. Pavel discusses resting muscle tension or tone extensively and makes a good case for heavy lifting and backs it up with many Russian studies. And for those that don’t respect Pavel - he does know his stuff and was highly educated in the Soviet Union during the time when the Russians were spending enormous amounts of effort, time, and money on sports research. The western world has been trying to benefit from Soviet sports research ever since. And yes, lifting progressively heavier poundages does develope the neuro-muscular connection which translates to incresed strenght with or with out hypertrophy and carries over to better resting muscle tension. Pavel explains how athletes with higher developed resting muscle tensions can achieve greater muscular velocity and power and the Soviets exploited this in some of their training.
Heb, thank you for elaborating. I should not have said that hypertrophy of the contractile proteins is the only way to gain strength; it is the major way, but not the only way.
Yes there are plenty of nueral pathways related to strength. Utilization of various high-tension techniques can considerably improve lifts almost instantaneously. And just like anything else, when you practice, you get better at it.
So on a diet what kind of volume per muscle group are we looking at? I’d be interested to see how many sets per body part and workout should be prescribed. Also what about how many training sessions per week? Lastly, would this have to be done on all body parts, or could muscles like bis and tris be excluded due to all the pressing and pulling being done.
Yes, you work all body parts. A three day split sample program can be found on the Getting Ripped Support Group Part II thread; post: Joel Marion, Re:
You can up the volume to ~50 reps per body part by simply incorporating another exercise for each body part. This can be very time consuming, so if you choose to do this, you are going to have to do less body parts per session and up the frequency to 5 days a week. Personally, I don't think its neccesary unless you are very, very serious about bodybuilding and looking for an extreme edge (i.e. you compete or something of that nature).
The general idea is a M,W,F split with 2-3 big exercises at each workout. Cleans, deads, bench press, overhead press, squats, chins, bent-over rows, dips should be the foundational exercises. You could do a few sets for bis, tris at the end of the foundational exercises and should also do some ab work. Here is an example:
M - Bench Press, Bent-Over Rows and Chins (all done 5x5)
W - Squats, Power Cleans (all done 5x5) and ab work
F - Deadlifts, Push Presses, Calf Raises (all done 5x5)
Basically you need to pick foundational exercises as the core and then you can add a little extra work at the end, but just a little. Then use diet, aerobic training and anaerobic training to really create the negative energy balance.
Thanks for the responses guys. Last question – would it be ok for me to go ito a 5x5 program while dieting even though I started the first 3 weeks of my diet doing the 6/1 program with 1 exercise per bodypart (5 sets)?
Yes, going into a 5x5 program while dieting should be fine. It will help to preserve lean body mass and you may see an increase in strength even while dieting (of course this depends on the severity of the diet).