I am not sure I have ever had a feeling of dead towards a training session. I look forward to going to the gym because it’s part of a process that ultimately brings me joy. I just dont find every session fun or enjoyable.
I don’t dread working out. I enjoy being in the gym. The title states “does training need to suck for best results”, seems I have very meek results, and those only come when everything fucking sucks. I’m eating like a robot and destroying myself in the gym.
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Another paraphrased Wendler quote:
“Oh poor me, my life is so physically undemanding and food is so plentiful, I have to invent fake work for myself to stop myself becoming grossly fat and unhealthy”
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If I could get the same results sitting on my ass, eating pizza and doughnuts, I would do that.
And it wouldn’t be a close call. Take results out of the picture and I’d choose not training 100 times out of 100.
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Only after a while i fully understood what you ment with the OP - its a bit different and more poetic meaning, yes.
What i think about this idea is that if you LOVE something then nothing is hard, no? My GF is into rough sex and technically speaking, some could say it is hard, because my heart rate and sweating is simmilar to HIIT training and after that i get some cramps, my dick hurts for the rest of the day, sometimes it even bleeds cuz it got smashed on her teeth etc… But i actually NEVER tought about it as hard, because i like it and enjoy it…
It is very hard to define “hard” or “feeling of suck” while doing something you like. For me - hardest part is eating enough to grow. I have to forcefeed myself, always full, take a diarhea like shit 3 times a day, vomit in my mouth every time i bend over, etc… But there are fat people all over the world who eat MORE, weigh 400lbs and actually enjoy life. For me its hard, for them its the thing they love… Its all about the perspective, isnt it? For me dieting is easy, cuz i enjoy fasting, i love training on empty stomach, i love the feeling its all clean and empty in my intestines. But for those who are morbidly obese and eat 7000kcals as a FUN activity, for them the dieting would be hard.
So… at the end of the day i believe that if you actually THINK about how hard the training is, its not for you and you shouldnt waste time of your life to do stuff that does not make you happy. For me - gym is my happy time. I wait for the next gym session as soon as i exit this one. I have a notebook with my training plans and i write the next workout on the OFF days, because at least thats how i can do something about the gym on off days 
Its the same as “motivation”. If a person needs motivation, he is not doing the right thing in his life. Fat people dont need motivation to get some cake - it comes easy for them. All the training i have done in my life MIGHT BE considered very hard and sucky for those who dont like it, but those who love it went there, actually paid money for that, and enjoyed it.
It is only hard if you dont like the process. I hope anyone can understand what im trying to say
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The Dark Place
The point where your mind starts to whisper “stop”
The point where the magic is starting to happen.
The point where the work begins
This is the period that has to be endured for LENGTH. It is best suited to conditioning sessions although @T3hPwnisher epic deadlift session counter acts that point.
This lays down the foundations to experience truly beautiful gains
High rep brutality. No other way.
You will never experience the dark place on conventional rep schemes however you will be able to crush them once you use the experience gained in the dark place
Dark Place training carries over beautifully over to traditional rep schemes and allows you to push harder.
On a personal level, my physique has improved ten fold since I left behind conventional training and embarked on high rep brutality. These long, torturous sessions have built mental armour which allows me to navigate the traditional rep schemes more effectively.
The Mind Muscle Connection is missing the point.
Remove the word connection and amazing things will start to happen.
The Mind Muscle is what must be tempered.
As an aside @hankthetank89 I agree with your opinion that people can go too far with the war analogies. I personally don’t remember making that link myself. If I ever did it was on the basis that I am going to war with myself.
The gym is boring.
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Hehe sometimes I think I really am autistic.
I would say that it depends. If you’re an advanced trainee who’s been trianing hard, with dedication, and progressed for 10 years, if you still want to progress, your training will probably have to suck.
And the more you would be the opposite, the more it probably shouldn’t suck.
Then again, you can’t train balls to the walls all year long, you need easier and harder periods.
But then again, we should define suck ahah…
To me suck is doing the same thing over and over. To others it would be hard grueling stuff.
I thought about this and it’s probably not just the suffering in itself. Honestly a grueling 2 minutes leg set is horrible. It’s really painful, I don’t enjoy it that much, the sensation (especially in the lower back or when you can’t breathe)
But I really do enjoy the fact that I can do it, that I’m able to push myself to the limit where most people cannot.
It’s like when you defeat a very hard boss in a videogame. A great feeling of accomplishment.
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To me, I train because deep inside of me is a loathing for what I can become if I did not train. It is, in itself, a dark place that takes me to the gym in the first place.
To me, my training does not suck, because it is a punishment for what I’ve done, and what I will do in the future. It’s painful for me to consider what I would become should I not be able to train. Training is my happy place.
Except calves….training calves def sucks.
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No. I am greatful for the ability to train, and I enjoy what my body allows me to do. I don’t enjoy pain, as it’s just a feedback. But I very much enjoy being able to express myself through various movements.
I’ve spoken about this in my log before but since I learned to practice gratitude I’ve found it a far more powerful resource than dark places
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I understand that mate but I’m order to get getter, I’m order to improve does the training itself have to suck?? Maybe suck is a poor word choice as it means different things to different people. (Might be why I chose that word). You train extreme hard and your results are clear for everyone to see. I am guessing that some of that training was hard and some of it you really didn’t enjoy. Is this where we need to be to get results?
At some point, you are going to have to work hard to get results. Whether this sucks or not really depends. For example, I could bench all day, every day. Max effort, loads of reps I don’t care I’m there…
On the other hand, Yoke above a certain point sucks ass and it doesn’t need to be max effort stuff.
I also remember a medley farmers, into light keg, into heavy keg into a backwards drag. Hot day, puking, nobody was enjoying that.
So I would say the suck is independent of the result unless it stops you from working hard then the you must embrace the suck or you will suck.
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T shirt quote right there mate. Like it.
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Had you said Hard instead of Suck, this thread would not have got the input it has received. Almost all of us agree it has to be hard. It’s just some of us welcome it and like the suffering. If I puked in a workout, I would be excited at the thought I worked so hard I lost control.
I was taught at a young age that you can dread going to work, or you can be positive for the opportunity. If you dread it, you are already in a negative mindset and will continue to have thoughts about how much you hate it. If you are positive, you can actually enjoy it. My first experience with this as a teenager was when I asked a butcher at my store why he always speaks to people and does things that he doesn’t have to do. He was a super nice guy. He is the one who broke it down for me. He said of course he doesn’t always feel like getting up and going to work, but ………. I learned from that. Each workout is an opportunity to better yourself. It will be hard and grueling. You can either dread it, or embrace the pain and love it. I have embraced the suffering. Not just in working out, but in life (except for cardio).
Cardio is totally different for me. That does suck. When I was racing triathlons, I embraced it. But now I just watch the clock and try to maintain.
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Shhhhh don’t tell anyone.
Lol true dat. But if it sucks and you do it, does it make you better 
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My two cents is it depends on what one enjoys doing.
My most productive strength blocks have been lower-rep, higher-intensity lifting sets with long-ish rests (two-plus minutes) and only occasional supersets. Even the grueling, heavy sets were more enjoyable than sucky to me. None of my strength blocks have sucked, and all of them have produced positive results.
Conversely, my strength-endurance conditioning isn’t the greatest. Light weight, high-rep rounds of calisthenics interspersed with lifts get my heart pounding and stomach churning. Because I don’t enjoy those sensations as much as grinding a few heavy reps, effective strength conditioning circuits currently suck to me.
I think this is a really good point that is worth exploring a bit more. A well programmed strength block can have most of the work done well under max effort or failure and still produce some good results. For me when these blocks get suitably heavy and have enough accessory work they are as you put it gruelling, so for me these is no fun and there is a certain amount of nervousness before these sessions. I wouldn’t say they suck but they are definitely not nice.
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Yeah bit initially you didn’t ask does training need to be hard, you asked if there was an inverse relationship between enjoyment.
Does training need to be hard? Yes, I believe so.