Dips and Chin-Up PB (Videos)

Training Bodybuilding
41

[quote]Sxio wrote:
Because at the end of a dip you’re already in a position to do it. Muscles grow most on the eccentric right? And you’re right there, all you have to do is slowly lower yourself one last time. Gives you an extra hit for no cost at all.You’d be mad not to, you’re just shortchanging yourself. [/quote]
It’s really not that important and you’re really kind of nitpicking here.
Not to mention you definitely are overstating your case. In some cases you certainly wouldn’t be “mad” not to.

This exercise I find is pretty hard on the elbows and shoulders and with 100+ lbs added on I don’t think I’d want to be doing a negative at the end of a max effort.

Also for a given program negatives at the end of a max effort may take the intensity into overtraining.

Your advice that he reduce the weight and use better form was really bad advice also. It’s not like someone bouncing a bench press off their chest. On a chin a little more weight and some kipping is still going to work your back and biceps just as hard and doesn’t increase the chance of injury.

42

[quote]Da Fruitarian 1 wrote:
I just eat what I need, when I need it, I don’t believe in the protien, calorie, vitamin and mineral stuff!!!
the way I see it it’s not what I want it’s what my body needs and that’s what I listen to!!!

I have reached the point where I eat very little fruit sometimes I will go a day with out eating at all just because I can, for instance this season I’ve been living off of oranges juice(sucking juice from wedges)and maybe 4 bananas a day, I don’t force myself to do this it’s just the way it is!
[/quote]

Yeah, right.

43

[quote]Jay Sherman wrote:
It’s really not that important and you’re really kind of nitpicking here.
Not to mention you definitely are overstating your case.

Your advice that he reduce the weight and use better form was really bad advice also. [/quote]

Statements such as “reduce weight and use better form” are always controversial aren’t they?

Whilst I don’t deny that I can talk and write in an excited way, i definitely don’t think I am overstating my case. You and I both do this movement. On every set I do the extra eccentric. I’m doing at least, 1/5th more work each set (there are now five components to the lift). If you agree that the eccentric portions of the lift more fully stresses the muscle, then you might even say I’m getting up to 1/3 more out of the exercise (as there are now 3 eccentrics).

I’m working harder than you. I’m more fully stressing my muscles and getting more practise at the movement. Who do you think will see more benefit after 6-8wks?

Even though it’s more work, it won’t lead to overtraining. It’s only a portion of a lift extra. Not 5 sets extra. Work a ittle harder in the first set and you’ll simply have a little less energy to put into the 2nd.

It’ll just work the muscle a little more thoroughly in a way that’s beneficial for muscle growth. But do it, don’t do it, i don’t care either way. I will continue spreading my “bad” advice such as “reduce weight and concentrate on form”. But thanks anyway ‘Jay’.

44

[quote]Da Fruitarian 1 wrote:
Thank you so much Jimi!!! I get by on very little!! this season I’m living off orange juice(sucking the juice out of orange wedges) and maybe 4 bananas or an avocado a day if that! hope that helped!!![/quote]

Wow. That is amazing. Your body is, like, tuned, dude. Instinctive training and eating is definitely the way to go.

[quote]jehovasfitness wrote:
talk about malnutrition[/quote]

If that’s all you need to stay in positive nitrogen balance then that’s cool with me. I don’t see anything bad about your nutrition. You’re in tune with your body so you know what you need to eat. You can tell from what you see in the mirror and from the poundages you can move in the gym whether you need to eat more.

[quote]JMB wrote:
Da Fruitarian 1 wrote:
I just eat what I need, when I need it, I don’t believe in the protien, calorie, vitamin and mineral stuff!!!
the way I see it it’s not what I want it’s what my body needs and that’s what I listen to!!!

I have reached the point where I eat very little fruit sometimes I will go a day with out eating at all just because I can, for instance this season I’ve been living off of oranges juice(sucking juice from wedges)and maybe 4 bananas a day, I don’t force myself to do this it’s just the way it is!

Yeah, right.[/quote]

I know you wouldn’t lie about your diet and I can understand that you only want to eat when you feel hungry. As long as you feel strong and you are sure that you are in a state of growth then that’s cool.

You have a lot of experience with this and you know what you are doing. Now you’ve found what works for you just keep it up and carry on perfecting it : )

45

[quote]Da Fruitarian 1 wrote:
JimiB wrote:
Hi everyone. This is a very interesting thread.

Great work to “Da Fruitarian”. You have our support and respect. Awesome poundages and great physique. You seem to be right on track towards achieving your goals, which is always motivational and inspirational.

I am also very interested in how you meet your macronutrient requirements.

Perhaps you could post an example of a typical daily menu.

Many thanks,

Jimi

Thank you so much Jimi!!! I get by on very little!! this season I’m living off orange juice(sucking the juice out of orange wedges) and maybe 4 bananas or an avocado a day if that! hope that helped!!![/quote]

Wow. That is amazing. Your body is, like, tuned, dude. Instinctive training and eating is definitely the way to go.

[quote]jehovasfitness wrote:
talk about malnutrition[/quote]

If that’s all you need to stay in positive nitrogen balance then that’s cool with me. I don’t see anything bad about your nutrition. You’re in tune with your body so you know what you need to eat. You can tell from what you see in the mirror and from the poundages you can move in the gym whether you need to eat more.

[quote]JMB wrote:
Da Fruitarian 1 wrote:
I just eat what I need, when I need it, I don’t believe in the protien, calorie, vitamin and mineral stuff!!!
the way I see it it’s not what I want it’s what my body needs and that’s what I listen to!!!

I have reached the point where I eat very little fruit sometimes I will go a day with out eating at all just because I can, for instance this season I’ve been living off of oranges juice(sucking juice from wedges)and maybe 4 bananas a day, I don’t force myself to do this it’s just the way it is!

Yeah, right.[/quote]

I know you wouldn’t lie about your diet and I can understand that you only want to eat when you feel hungry. As long as you feel strong and you are sure that you are in a state of growth then that’s cool.

You have a lot of experience with this and you know what you are doing. Now you’ve found what works for you just keep it up and carry on perfecting it : )

46

[quote]Sxio wrote:
Jay Sherman wrote:
It’s really not that important and you’re really kind of nitpicking here.
Not to mention you definitely are overstating your case.

Your advice that he reduce the weight and use better form was really bad advice also.

Statements such as “reduce weight and use better form” are always controversial aren’t they?

Whilst I don’t deny that I can talk and write in an excited way, i definitely don’t think I am overstating my case. You and I both do this movement. On every set I do the extra eccentric. I’m doing at least, 1/5th more work each set (there are now five components to the lift). If you agree that the eccentric portions of the lift more fully stresses the muscle, then you might even say I’m getting up to 1/3 more out of the exercise (as there are now 3 eccentrics).

I’m working harder than you. I’m more fully stressing my muscles and getting more practise at the movement. Who do you think will see more benefit after 6-8wks?

Even though it’s more work, it won’t lead to overtraining. It’s only a portion of a lift extra. Not 5 sets extra. Work a ittle harder in the first set and you’ll simply have a little less energy to put into the 2nd.

It’ll just work the muscle a little more thoroughly in a way that’s beneficial for muscle growth. But do it, don’t do it, i don’t care either way. I will continue spreading my “bad” advice such as “reduce weight and concentrate on form”. But thanks anyway ‘Jay’. [/quote]

Hi guys! your both right! but the thing is here is that I was not aiming for perfect form if I was aiming for perfect form I would not of used heavy wieghts, I would of simply used my own body wieght, I was just having some fun with my training partner and having a good ole blast out before I changed my routine! I was just concerned with getting the wieghts up there! and if you watch the video of the chins you will see that me kicking made no difference at all when it came to getting the weight up! as for the dips, I could just about hold myself up let a lone use perfect form! (smile)

47

Yeah, I’ve been through a lot what with my detox and cleaning out but my goals now are to build on what I have.

48

Sorry for the double post. It doubled up when I edited it. No worries.

49

IME, working on the negative with heavy dips is a mistake. It only takes an inch too low and your in trouble. The issue isn’t the immediate damage but cumulative damage of 6-8 years instead of 6-8 weeks.

Fruitarian,
any sites you recommend to check. My sister was talking about this during the holidays and I’d like to read up on so I can support her decision intelligently. I’ve found some but question the sanity of the information.

50

[quote]JMB wrote:
Yeah, right.

JimiB wrote:
I know you wouldn’t lie about your diet and I can understand that you only want to eat when you feel hungry. As long as you feel strong and you are sure that you are in a state of growth then that’s cool.

You have a lot of experience with this and you know what you are doing. Now you’ve found what works for you just keep it up and carry on perfecting it : )[/quote]

I think JMB might have been coming from this avenue of thought:

  • Da Frutarian joins the forum, and on the same date posts his videos.

  • He looks quite buff and is strong…yet claims to eat only fruit, and not even nuts.

  • He hasn’t revealed to us his source of protein.

  • He says most days he just eats a few bananas, some orange juice and an avocado, which is nowhere near enough calories to fuel a person of his size.

  • He says some days he doesn’t even eat.

Now, if I were given these facts on a piece of paper and asked for my opinion, I would call bullshit, tube steak boogie, or both.

Da Fruitarian, if everything you’ve posted is true, and if you continue to build strength and size on this diet, please visit your nearest medical school so they can study you in depth. Science would have a lot to learn from your body, and I’d be very interested in reading about it.

51

[quote]Miserere wrote:
JMB wrote:
Yeah, right.

JimiB wrote:
I know you wouldn’t lie about your diet and I can understand that you only want to eat when you feel hungry. As long as you feel strong and you are sure that you are in a state of growth then that’s cool.

You have a lot of experience with this and you know what you are doing. Now you’ve found what works for you just keep it up and carry on perfecting it : )

I think JMB might have been coming from this avenue of thought:

  • Da Frutarian joins the forum, and on the same date posts his videos.

  • He looks quite buff and is strong…yet claims to eat only fruit, and not even nuts.

  • He hasn’t revealed to us his source of protein.

  • He says most days he just eats a few bananas, some orange juice and an avocado, which is nowhere near enough calories to fuel a person of his size.

  • He says some days he doesn’t even eat.

Now, if I were given these facts on a piece of paper and asked for my opinion, I would call bullshit, tube steak boogie, or both.

Da Fruitarian, if everything you’ve posted is true, and if you continue to build strength and size on this diet, please visit your nearest medical school so they can study you in depth. Science would have a lot to learn from your body, and I’d be very interested in reading about it.[/quote]

I really don’t care if anyone believes me or not and I don’t have anything to prove to anybody, I eat what I eat because it’s the best for me and I’m proud of my decision, infact I take it as a great compliment that you and others would have such disbelief!!!

52

[quote]Da Fruitarian 1 wrote:
me kicking made no difference at all when it came to getting the weight up![/quote]

Then why were you kicking?

53

[quote]MookJong wrote:
Da Fruitarian 1 wrote:
me kicking made no difference at all when it came to getting the weight up!

Then why were you kicking?[/quote]

Coz I was busting my guts and I wanted to get the wieghts up by any means necessery (smile) but it didn’t make any difference anyway! some of you guys make me laugh because you act like you all train with perfect form or something!

54

[quote]Da Fruitarian 1 wrote:
some of you guys make me laugh because you act like you all train with perfect form or something![/quote]

Fruitarian,
Perhaps you don’t know this but the majority of the people on this site are either fitness models, powerlifters, Mr./Ms. Olympia, have 3 PhD’s…

Of course they are going to correct your form because it’s always easier to critique than to do.

I say those who know so much should post their videos with the same weight attached, demonstrating perfect form of course.

55

[quote]Da Fruitarian 1 wrote:
some of you guys make me laugh because you act like you all train with perfect form or something![/quote]

Lol. But I do. Seriously. I always push myself as hard as possible, but within the confines of perfect technique.

I don’t think going for numbers is helpful if it’s at the expense of form. It’s how injuries occur.

56

[quote]Sxio wrote:
I don’t think going for numbers is helpful if it’s at the expense of form. It’s how injuries occur. [/quote]

The injury potential for chins is doing way too much volume too soon.

There is zero injury potential from the nitpicking of his chinning form you have provided here.

There is a great chance of injury doing negative dips at the end of a max effort set with double bodyweight.

Please quit spreading misinformation before you cause someone to get injured.

57

[quote]Miserere wrote:

  • Da Frutarian joins the forum, and on the same date posts his videos.[/quote]

Why would a fruitarian spend much time here? Without having a video of himself doing something impressive if he mentioned he was a fruitarian he’d just get told he was an idiot, liar, troll, stupid, etc, etc. So now you’ve got the a video. So he must be lying about his diet of course…

Hey I get 50 to 70 grams of protein a day at a bodyweight of 215 (thin for me) and coming close to one arm chins. That’s after 15 years of being certain I needed at least 200 if not 300 grams of protein a day to be strong.

That someone has gone even lower on protein and is still strong doesn’t surprise me at this point.

I’m afraid he did. The trace amounts in fruits.

[quote] * He says most days he just eats a few bananas, some orange juice and an avocado, which is nowhere near enough calories to fuel a person of his size.

  • He says some days he doesn’t even eat.[/quote]

Eh, maybe “few” means ten? “some OJ” means a gallon? I don’t know.

58

[quote]Jay Sherman wrote:
The injury potential for chins is doing way too much volume too soon.

Please quit spreading misinformation before you cause someone to get injured. [/quote]

It’s amusing that you’re asking ME to stop posting misinformation (such as concentrating on form before weight) when it doesn’t seem like you have a clue yourself as evidenced by your statement ‘injury potential for chins is doing way too much volume too soon’.

Most people can’t do 8 chin ups consecutively, so how are they going to do a volume high enough to cause an injury? Those who can, are obviously strong people. So why are they at risk of injury from doing lots of chin ups? Are you saying that it would be safer to do low reps than high reps for chin ups?

Do you know what you’re talking about in any way? Prove it. Why do lots of chins up give you a higher risk of injury?

59

at a bodyweight of 160 my best dips were a set of 8 with 150 and a set of 6 with 155 the next week.

Chin-ups, not as good a set of 5 with 75 when I weighed in the 140s.

Right now I am weighing 150 and maxed at 80 X 1 the other day, job is more strenuous though. Will have the dips back up to par soon though.

-Seth

60

Just looked at the videos…

I dont think you cleared the bar with your chin once… dips looked scary. I believe I will have to post my own videos in a few months when I get back up to par. Probably just a dipping video since I have plates, a belt. and dipping bars here. Cant do the chins, dont think the gym wants me brining a camcorder in there.

I don’t want to come across as negative, you put in a great effort and with a slight drop in weight you might have nailed them all perfectly. Just seems like you were trying to hard for the most weight you could “handle”.

  • Seth