Dextrose vs Maltodextrin

Nutrition
41

[quote]Hawkson101 wrote:
I used to take 3 scoops of dextrose after a workout and i was never sore. I also sometimes got tired and sluggish during my workout and didnt always have good workouts. Now I am at 2 scoops malto and 1 scoop dextrose(50g malto, 50g dextrose) along with the usual protein. QUestion-how much protein do you drink? Also, i sip roughly 2/3s of what i take during my workout and finish the rest right after my workout.[/quote]

40g protein, 30g dextrose, 50g malto. I use more malto than dextrose because I think the dextrose makes it too sweet. So, I would really like to know what I’m getting in the NOW malto (fast or slow digesting carbs). Do you have any thoughts on it Hawk?

42

well the ‘optimum amount’ is 0.8g/kg of carbs (50/50 split malto and dextro) and 0.4g/kg protein - as recommended per JB article. My main concern would be is the maltose worth it? especially in relation to what Dr stig has to say.

43

[quote]supermick wrote:
well the ‘optimum amount’ is 0.8g/kg of carbs (50/50 split malto and dextro) and 0.4g/kg protein - as recommended per JB article. My main concern would be is the maltose worth it? especially in relation to what Dr stig has to say.[/quote]

Consider the varying GI of the different maltodextrin types (sources) and work from there, taking into consideration ingesting enough carbs at that point overall.

44

[quote]mtotry wrote:

I have heard 2 different things about Surge not sure which is accurate…

But Considering Biotest can choose whats best I would tell you all to buy Surge if you can, if not then make your post workout drink as similiar to it as possible…why reinvent the wheel? when you already have TC, JB, and company doing all the work for you…

  1. 45 grams of d-glucose and 4 Grams Malto

or

  1. 25 grams of d-glucose and 25 grams of maltodextrin

I had been doing 25grams of each dextrose and malto for the last several months…Today I tried 45 grams of dextrose and 5 grams of malto…MUCH MORE sweet…ill monitor my recovery the next few days/weeks and see if I can feel the difference…

anybody else play around with these ratios??[/quote]

im sticking with:

45 grams of d-glucose and 4 Grams Malto

that seems to be what is in Surge…

45

[quote]dr stig wrote:
supermick wrote:
well the ‘optimum amount’ is 0.8g/kg of carbs (50/50 split malto and dextro) and 0.4g/kg protein - as recommended per JB article. My main concern would be is the maltose worth it? especially in relation to what Dr stig has to say.

Consider the varying GI of the different maltodextrin types (sources) and work from there, taking into consideration ingesting enough carbs at that point overall.

[/quote]

What do you use post workout Doc? Im assuming you use something other than Surge due to the availability of Biotest in the UK.

46

[quote]supermick wrote:
dr stig wrote:
supermick wrote:
well the ‘optimum amount’ is 0.8g/kg of carbs (50/50 split malto and dextro) and 0.4g/kg protein - as recommended per JB article. My main concern would be is the maltose worth it? especially in relation to what Dr stig has to say.

Consider the varying GI of the different maltodextrin types (sources) and work from there, taking into consideration ingesting enough carbs at that point overall.

What do you use post workout Doc? Im assuming you use something other than Surge due to the availability of Biotest in the UK.[/quote]

I second that question.

47

[quote]supermick wrote:
dr stig wrote:
supermick wrote:
well the ‘optimum amount’ is 0.8g/kg of carbs (50/50 split malto and dextro) and 0.4g/kg protein - as recommended per JB article. My main concern would be is the maltose worth it? especially in relation to what Dr stig has to say.

Consider the varying GI of the different maltodextrin types (sources) and work from there, taking into consideration ingesting enough carbs at that point overall.

What do you use post workout Doc? Im assuming you use something other than Surge due to the availability of Biotest in the UK.[/quote]

I eat 2 cans of pineapple chunks in syrup. I wait 10 mins and drink about 35g worth of whey protein mixed with about 150ml of skim milk and 350ml of water.

Well you did ask.

48

[quote]dr stig wrote:
supermick wrote:
dr stig wrote:
supermick wrote:
well the ‘optimum amount’ is 0.8g/kg of carbs (50/50 split malto and dextro) and 0.4g/kg protein - as recommended per JB article. My main concern would be is the maltose worth it? especially in relation to what Dr stig has to say.

Consider the varying GI of the different maltodextrin types (sources) and work from there, taking into consideration ingesting enough carbs at that point overall.

What do you use post workout Doc? Im assuming you use something other than Surge due to the availability of Biotest in the UK.

I eat 2 cans of pineapple chunks in syrup. I wait 10 mins and drink about 35g worth of whey protein mixed with about 150ml of skim milk and 350ml of water.

Well you did ask.
[/quote]

I guess I was supposed to say I use ‘brand X’ maltodextrin made from the ‘Jaloobada’ tree in Outer Mongolia.

49

[quote]dr stig wrote:

I guess I was supposed to say I use ‘brand X’ maltodextrin made from the ‘Jaloobada’ tree in Outer Mongolia.[/quote]

I must admit, I can’t pretend I’m not disappointed.

50

[quote]dr stig wrote:
dr stig wrote:
supermick wrote:
dr stig wrote:
supermick wrote:
well the ‘optimum amount’ is 0.8g/kg of carbs (50/50 split malto and dextro) and 0.4g/kg protein - as recommended per JB article. My main concern would be is the maltose worth it? especially in relation to what Dr stig has to say.

Consider the varying GI of the different maltodextrin types (sources) and work from there, taking into consideration ingesting enough carbs at that point overall.

What do you use post workout Doc? Im assuming you use something other than Surge due to the availability of Biotest in the UK.

I eat 2 cans of pineapple chunks in syrup. I wait 10 mins and drink about 35g worth of whey protein mixed with about 150ml of skim milk and 350ml of water.

Well you did ask.

I guess I was supposed to say I use ‘brand X’ maltodextrin made from the ‘Jaloobada’ tree in Outer Mongolia.[/quote]

Not really, and the jaloobada tree is in india.

51

I’ll get me coat.

52

[quote]randomweights2 wrote:
At the brewing store the guy told me that the “powdered corn syrup” they were selling is the same as maltodextrin. Is this true? I always thought corn syrup was best avoided.[/quote]

Not sure what he meant, but to my knowledge, “corn sugar”=dextrose.

R

53

I’m gonna further confuse the issue:

What about waxy maize starch and trehalose as alternitive and possibly better than dextrose/maltodextrin ?
(I wouldn’t use either one yet, I’m poor…)

54

The good doctor still hasn’t really helped us poor saps who use maltodextrin. So, I will try one more time.

Maltodextrine that is derived from corn starch - is it high GI or low GI? How close is it to dextrose?

And, anyone else can answer as well.

55

[quote]Nomancer wrote:
I’m gonna further confuse the issue:

What about waxy maize starch and trehalose as alternitive and possibly better than dextrose/maltodextrin ?
(I wouldn’t use either one yet, I’m poor…)[/quote]

Waxy…good for texturising foods if you are in food production.

Trehalose (mycose) isn’t particularly soluble plus you need the enzyme trehalase in decent amounts present.Its also not very sweet.

56

[quote]terribleivan wrote:
The good doctor still hasn’t really helped us poor saps who use maltodextrin. So, I will try one more time.

Maltodextrine that is derived from corn starch - is it high GI or low GI? How close is it to dextrose?

And, anyone else can answer as well.[/quote]

Most of the time Maltodextrin will be sourced from Corn starch but also rice and potato sources are viable alternatives. Giving all Maltodextrin one GI rating is pretty much ignorant. Its a myth that pretty much needs stomping on.

You have basically two major factors in the eventual GI of the product, this is primarily the source but also the processing techniques.

Some Maltodextrin sources are also blends. As I mentioned before some low GI stuff (I think made from spuds) is lower GI than Corn Starch.

But the processing techniques used are had to discover. Usually any ingredients dec will say ‘maltodextrin’. So I can’t recc a particular type as you’d be going straight to the manufacturer and demanding the source and manuf process to work out what it originated as, and how it was made.

So in other words, just use whatever maltodextrin you can get and add something to it like dextrose if you are worried the GI might be too low.

57

Just wanted to thank Dr Stig for clearing up this subject. I always thought that malto was a slow release carb. I have a tub of malto carb powder here, it is broken down as:

monosaccharides…17%
disaccharides…5%
trisaccharides…7%
tetrasaccharides…5%
pentasaccharides & above…66%

My reasoning was that monosaccharides are a simple carb making 17% and pentassacharides are a slower carb making 66% so it must be a complex carbohydrate powder as it says on the label. This is misleading, thanks again for clearing this up. You seem very knowledgeable by the way in many of your posts.

tin can

p.s. I nearly shit myself when I saw what some people are paying for malto… Guys, I’ve seen it for $40 for 50 fuckin’ pounds! Keep looking…

58

I’ve heard that waxy maize starch absorbs even faster than dex or malto? Any truth to this?

Would it be possibly better (at double the price, ouch) than dex/malto?

59

[quote]Nomancer wrote:
I’ve heard that waxy maize starch absorbs even faster than dex or malto? Any truth to this?

Would it be possibly better (at double the price, ouch) than dex/malto?[/quote]

The price reflects that fact that they are used in the manufacture of food and other stuff like textiles, there is great demand.

Without going into lengthy details or ‘waxing’ lyrical (no pun intended) waxy’s (inc other things besides maize) are also differing in how they are made, for instance they can be drum dried which would alter their behaviour.

The best thing would be to get a book and get reading, its a complex (also no pun intended) subject the old carbohydrate forms.

60

[quote]Nomancer wrote:
I’ve heard that waxy maize starch absorbs even faster than dex or malto? Any truth to this?

[/quote]

To be more specific and to avoid confusion, nearly all ‘Waxy’ starches (and just like maltodextrin they have varying sources such as maize, rice ,barley and sorghum), will have no amylose and contain essentially 100% amylopectin. Sorghum BTW is a cultivated topical cereal grass.

Anyway’s, unlike the ‘waxy’s’… your average maltodextrin you will have a ratio of amylose to amylopectin.

As a basic food science lesson, amylose is the mostly straight-chain polymer, with long chains of glucose units joined by alpha 1,4 linkages.

Conversely, amylopectin, has branched-chained molecules and usually consists of shorter chains of glucose monomers linked by some alpha 1,4 linkages and many alpha 1,6 branch points.

The majority of these two polymers in any given starch granule depends on the plant of origin (hence my original point about classifying all Maltodextrins as the same), which also influences the number of glucose units. So you don’t have to be the worlds smartest dude to realise this is how the GI and other factors can be different.

As for Waxy Maize starch, as its more or less 100% amylopectin you get quicker absorption as starches that are high in amylopectin are digested and absorbed more quickly than starches with a high amylose content.

From this snippet we deduce also that a maltodextrin with a ratio of amylopectin to amylose which favours amylopectin will induce a greater insulin response, and vice versa.

Also, Amylopectin starch induces nonreversible insulin resistance in rats, so it may not be great to use long term as regular (but not specific!) maltodextrin.