Simple question, which is the best exercise for leg development and which is the best for functional strength?
Which should I use as my primary leg exercise? My goal is to add mass to my lower body. I know Pavel prefers deads but I’d appreciate the thoughts of my fellow T-Men, I’d also be interested on Coach Davis’ take on this subject.
Please indicate which excercise variation you’re recommending i.e. deep squats, box squats, trap-bar deads, sumo deads, etc.
Many thanks!
A much more complicated question than it appears. I do have a article coming up likely this week that will address this question. First, in my opinion there needs to be variation. Each of the above exercises you mentioned are superb and I cannot tell you how right you are to mention the work of “masters” such as Pavel and Louie. You did also mention functional strength and that has my attention peaked - are you goals related to sport? Let me know - this is a great topic!
In faith,
Coach Davies
I like deads–the standard bent leg variety. I think the quad stimulation is pretty decent and I think its application to the real world is more valid than squats. When do you ever lift anything on your shoulders? Most often, you have to lift something in front of your body. The stimulation of the upper back and the whole posterior chain is fantastic. As for quad work, I do isolation exercises (like…gasp leg extension) just for the asthetic effect. If I had a trap bar, I would do squats with that, but since I work out alone, the standard back squats make me nervous.
Hey this is a good question. Coach Davies, I am a Kin major and my goal is to be a college strength and condition coach. So I’m interested in functional training for athletes. I am trying to get as much info as I can. I just got order some stuff from Simmons, I plan on ordering everything Ian has ever written, some stuff from Pavel, Staley, Poliquin and so on. I was wondering if you had any products out there for us budding strength coaches? Here’s my two cents on the question though, tell me if I’m even close. The deadlift is a great tool, especially for athletes because it starts from the ground up and uses so many muscles together, that is how the body works not like a tricep kickback, and the squat is good because it teaches control of the body and has a good power application also. I like the squat for myself because I think there fun to do. That’s my two cents, what do you think?
Coach, thanks for the response.
My goals are primarily aesthetic but I do play a little rugby (shout out to UK T-men!). I believe that the stronger you are physically, the heavier loads you can lift which subsequently leads to bigger muscles.
I’m torn between focusing on sumo deads (I don’t have access to a trap bar) and box squats and would appreciate your comments.
Thanks in advance.
If somebody held a gun to my head and asked for a definite answer to a broad question, I’d say podium DLs - they address your posterior chain as well as vastus medialus to some degree. As far as function goes, very few activities rely solely on leg strength - your butt and back almost always have some role in any activity, be it sprinting movements, lifting an object in pretty much any plane, etc…but as coach Davies said, it’s all relative to what activity you’re training for and/or where your current weaknesses lie.
Siscokid-good choice with Louie and Pavel - Get to the library and look at Soviet sports review. Contact me directly and I can go through a huge stack of work for professionals. Good comments but expand more, as a kin major I know you’ve got a lot more input.T-Rex, why concern yourself about the bar. Some of best gyms are in the UK because they arent contaminated by commercial crap like they are here. -Try be the old coach and walking into a “pretty-boy” gym with chalk and performing Snatch lifts-Try Overhead Squats mixed with Super Heavy Lunges and then walking with a loaded barbell.
In faith,
Coach Davies
Hey coach, siscokid here again, after reading the other sites, I have to say as a hopeful, budding strength coach, your willingness to help us in unbelievable!!! I have to say a big thanks for that. I too would like to see you publish something, maybe some videos(those are my favorite), that would be great. Also how does a guy get to work under your wing, like Kato? I will be appling to work at the athlete training center here at school to get a start in the game. After I graduate, I would like to try to work under someone of like you are some other coach (King, Poliquin). I know that might be far fetched of a request, but it would be very cool.
Thanks again.
Siscokid there’s a thread about books somebody’s started. For functional strength, there’s of course Dinosaur Training (+ the new notebook) by Brooks Kubik & anything off the superstrengthbooks site. As for squats vs. deads, I’d say that both are really good. Switch things up once in a while, as well as their variations (on a podium, w/dumbells, 1 1/4 squats, etc)
siscokid-I have resisted publishing particularily with videos because of the lack of integrity as a teaching forum. I may have bridged that gap now and you might here something. I have a professionals only mentor program and do have a huge array of work available to that group. Where are you located ? As far as being available, it is my greatest wish to be able to pass on knowledge to young coaches like yourself.
In faith,
Coach Davies
Coach, I’d be extremely interested in information about your mentor program. Just FYI, I live in Austin Texas.
for functional strength i would recomend deads but for leg developement i would definitly recomend deep squats.
the other concept I should have mentioned is complexes with an assortment of the power moves. Nathan, drop me an email. I will likely be in your area in September.
In faith,
Coach Davies
Hey coach Davies, I plan on being a strength coach in the future like siscokid. I read everything I can find, but I would like to take a look at that Soviet sports review you mentioned. Would any library have what you are talking about? Obviously I read everything on this site, plus I’m reading Supertraining by Siff right now. Is there any other readings your would suggest for someone like me. Thanks for the help.
goto the Dryessis site (hint hint). They are a bit expensive, but alot of people endorse them. Even functional is relative. for the best “functional” strength powercleans are probably better.
Coach, thanks for the input.
I’ve never performed overhead squats before so would appreciate any tips you have on form. Would this exercise interfere with my upper-body training?
Thanks in advance.
T-Rex, overhead squats are performed similar to a drop snatch or snatch balance (if you’re familiar with those exercises). You’ll most likely want to take a wide grip on the bar (easier to balance). You can set the bar high so you can take it off the rack, or if using lighter weights, you can press it above you. Then you squat down while keeping the bar above your head. This will feel very awkward at first and balance may be an issue. So you will want to start with lighter weights. I usually squat all the way down (ass to ground), and then back up. You will probably want to do it slowly since it is a difficult exercise.
You will notice it working your legs and back like you wouldn’t believe! So if you’re worried about it interferring with your upper body workouts, then you may want to do back training on the same day as the overhead squats. Because you will be sore the next day. I hope that helps. I’m sure Coach Davies has a better explaination of the exercise. This is how I was taught to do them when I competed in Olympic weightlifting.
T-Rex, yes they will terrorize you upper body. Tell me about your training pattern and I might be able to suggest how you can try this exercise. In faith, Coach Davies
Nate Dogg - thanks for the advice, it’s much appreciated.
Coach - thanks for taking the time to respond (again), this forum is fast turning into the 'Ask Coach Davies' problem page!
My current split is as follows: -
Sunday - Legs (box squats, stiff-legged deads, calves).
Monday - Chest (flat bench, incline DB bench, dips).
Wednesday - Back/Biceps (chins, seated row, incline shrugs, db curls).
Thursday - Shoulders (military press, db overhead press, upright row.
I am interested in incorporating the execises you suggest including bent presses (I’m not familiar with the olympic lifts) but I’m not really sure of the best split and volume to apply.
As always, I would appreciate your input.
Nate - great explanation, thank you. T-Rex, you could easily incorporate Bent Presses on Monday. Now would you be able to more you Thursday workout to Friday. Because if so you could begin to incoporate a wide variety of work. In faith. Coach Davies