I imagine that changing my rep scheme from 11-20 to 20-30 will lower my db press weight down dramatically. Should i do that, instead of changing out the exercise? The reason i cant hit the weight is because my db’s here jump from 125 to 140. Damn gym is missing sets of db’s. Would changing my rep range in this situation be the same as changing lifts?
Sento,
Thanks for looking out
[quote]johnson575 wrote:
I imagine that changing my rep scheme from 11-20 to 20-30 will lower my db press weight down dramatically. Should i do that, instead of changing out the exercise? The reason i cant hit the weight is because my db’s here jump from 125 to 140. Damn gym is missing sets of db’s. Would changing my rep range in this situation be the same as changing lifts?[/quote]
the weight will go down a lot, but in the end, the volume would probably be more. you get more reps with lighter weight would probably be more than fewer reps with heavier weights. it also might be time to swap the exercise as you seem/are getting very close to maxing out the exercise (unless the dbs go to like 200 or something in your gym).
[quote]johnson575 wrote:
I imagine that changing my rep scheme from 11-20 to 20-30 will lower my db press weight down dramatically. Should i do that, instead of changing out the exercise? The reason i cant hit the weight is because my db’s here jump from 125 to 140. Damn gym is missing sets of db’s. Would changing my rep range in this situation be the same as changing lifts?[/quote]
Might want to invest in some Plate Mates, or other fractional plates. They make it easier to progress as they allow for smaller weight increases (15 lbs per DB is a big difference).
In your case, I might suggest keeping with the 140’s and just continuing to try to up reps. Or, maybe dropping to the 125’s until you can get over 30RP. The second would probably be the safer option, but the first might be ok as well if you aren’t having trouble getting into position during the second and third RP legs.
To answer your general question though, progression in reps is progression. Usually people will set a minimum rep progression for themselves that they have to get (like 2 reps more for instance) in order to consider it a successful progression.
Progression in terms of weight is preferred, and should be sought whenever possible. But there are going to be times when that’s not possible or appropriate (like if you for instance drop below your target rep range or are nearing the end of a blast) at which time progression in terms of reps might be a better option.
I would not get rid of the exercises unless you fail to get more reps or more weight on two consecutive attempts.
I have a question for the DC vets. Are anyone you doing the advanced 4-way? Don’t worry, I am not think about trying to anything ridiculous like that. I was just curious if anyone was doing it and when they noticed that they needed to change to keep progressing.
Also, regarding 1 arm preacher curls, I am assuming that I don’t take a rest between arms? Or do I do the left arm, then right arm, then 10-15 deep breathes. I guess I am assuming that doing the other arm counts as recovery.
[quote]ajweins wrote:
I have a question for the DC vets. Are anyone you doing the advanced 4-way? Don’t worry, I am not think about trying to anything ridiculous like that. I was just curious if anyone was doing it and when they noticed that they needed to change to keep progressing.
Also, regarding 1 arm preacher curls, I am assuming that I don’t take a rest between arms? Or do I do the left arm, then right arm, then 10-15 deep breathes. I guess I am assuming that doing the other arm counts as recovery.
[/quote]
if you are overall fatigued, then take a break, but for the most part, one arm curls shouldn’t cause total body fatigue.
[quote]ajweins wrote:
I have a question for the DC vets. Are anyone you doing the advanced 4-way? Don’t worry, I am not think about trying to anything ridiculous like that. I was just curious if anyone was doing it and when they noticed that they needed to change to keep progressing.
[/quote]
You mean the 3-way?
I’m not, but generally people switch to the 3 way when either:
-
they reach a level of development/strength which simply doesn’t allow them to recover sufficiently from the 2 way
-
they’ve built a substantial amount of mass (read, are at advanced levels of muscle mass) and need to start working on bringing up lagging body parts
-
have time management issues which prevent them from doing the 2 way
The 3 way is actually slower in terms of progress than the regular 2 way, and I suspect that if they could, most would continue doing the 2 way. There just comes a point when it eventually becomes necessary to switch.
[quote]ajweins wrote:
Also, regarding 1 arm preacher curls, I am assuming that I don’t take a rest between arms? Or do I do the left arm, then right arm, then 10-15 deep breathes. I guess I am assuming that doing the other arm counts as recovery.
[/quote]
You can warm up either with one side and then do your work set there, then switch to the other… Or warm-up both arms alternating and then first do the work set for your weaker arm (including all RP-mini-sets), then rest a minute or whatever (or not) and do your work set for the other arm…
Don’t switch arms during the RP set though lol, finish it with one first, then start with the other.
Hey guys, i felt i had to sign up when i saw this thread.
Im on my second blast of DC, and i made some changes from my first blast program. This is what im doing right now. Could someone review it and point out some flaws in it? So far ive gained about 6kgs on the doggcrapp =)
1A:
Incline Chest Press(RP) 11-15
Arnold Press(RP) 11-15
Dips(RP) 15-20
Pulldowns(RP) 15-20
Cable Rows 12
2A:
DB Bicep Curls(RP) 15-20
Wrist Curls 12
Standing Calf Press 12
Hamstring Levers Max
Squats 4-6 + 20
1B:
Flat BB Press(RP) 11-15
Military Press(RP) 11-15
Skullcrushers(RP) 15-30
Chinups(RP) 15-20
One arm rows 12
2B:
EZi curl(RP) 15-20
Rev wrist curls 12
One legged calf raises 12
SLDL 12rep (not sure about reps on this one)
Deadlifts 6-8 + 3-4
1C:
Machine Press(RP) 11-15
DB shoulder Press(RP) 11-15
Overhead tricep extensions(RP) 15-20
Pullups(RP) 15-20
Tbar Rows 12
2C:
Concentration Curls(RP) 15-20
Hammer Curls 12
Calf press in Leg press 12
Hamstring curls(RP) 20-30
Leg Press 6-10 + 20
[quote]Jonken wrote:
Hey guys, i felt i had to sign up when i saw this thread.
[/quote]
Welcome to the thread.
Bump the Arnold Press up to 15-30 or 20-30. All DB exercises are done in those RP ranges.
Give yourself a range on the Cable rows, maybe 10-12.
Also give yourself a range on wrist curls (10-20 might be good) as well as all calf raise variations (10-12).
What is a Hamstring Lever? And what rep range are you doing them in?
Flat BB press is generally not advocated in DC due to it’s high injury potential. If you absolutely must do them, then bump the RP range to 15-30.
Again, give yourself a range on the rows. If you’re doing them “Kroc” style, then higher reps seem to work well. Go with a range of like 15-20. If not, then just go 10-12.
Reverse wrist curls quite frankly suck balls in terms of progression potential. Switch to somesort of Reverse curl (since you’re already doing a hammer curl variation in your third “B” workout).
One legged calf raises also aren’t going to be great in terms of progression. It’s also gonna be very difficult to do them DC style correctly. I’d switch them to either a Hack Squat machine calf raise, donkey calf raise, or seated calf raises (might be a good idea since you don’t have a soleus exercise in your rotation).
Deadlifts are done as a back thickness exercise in DC, therefore they should not be done on a “2” day (and doing them after SLDL’s would be just asking for a lower back injury). Switch to
Machine Hack squats, place Leg presses here and do some other form of squat (BB hacks, V-squats, even a split squat variation) in 2C. You’d do this because you want to pair SLDL’s with a non lower back intensive quad exercise.
Also, when you do a SLDL variation it is one of the few times when exercise order changes a little. In these cases you do:
biceps
forearms
calves
quads (non lower back intensive exercise)
hamstrings
I’d also replace either one arm DB rows, or cable rows with Deadlifts 4-8 + 9-12 (or vice versa). The way your program is set up right now, I’d do which ever one you don’t replace in 1A, do T-bars in 1B, and do Deadlifts in 1C.
Again, DB pressing exercises are done 20-30RP or at least 15-30RP.
All triceps extensions are also done 15-30 RP.
go 10-12 on the t-bars (wherever you wind up placing them).
[quote]
2C:
Concentration Curls(RP) 15-20
Hammer Curls 12
Calf press in Leg press 12
Hamstring curls(RP) 20-30
Leg Press 6-10 + 20[/quote]
TBH concentration curls aren’t the greatest biceps exercise in terms of progression and don’t really do all that much for you in any other sense. I’d switch them to either something like DB incline curls (which are a great stretch exercise), spider curls (which provide better leverage than traditional preachers but still force you to be strict), or seated ez bar curls (which allow you to use a lot of weight while still keeping strict form).
Biceps exercises have actually recently been the topic of discussion, so if you look back over the last page or two you’ll find a bunch of options to choose from. Not saying that you must drop concentration curls, just that they aren’t generally considered a great biceps exercise in DC circles.
Generally you want to pair hamstring curls with some form of squatting exercise since they really don’t stress the back at all. I’d probably switch them to 2A and do the hamstring levers (whatever they may be) in 2C.
Ok thanks for the answer! Thats awesome. I feel i only have 1-2 weeks left on this blast anyway. So for the next blast i will change around quite a bit.
bump
…so I switched to 2RP mid-blast and was able to get a 12-week blast out of it. Taking a cruise now. Here’s what my last 2 weeks looked like with the 2RP setup:
A1
Incline DB Bench: 100(12,4) 15-20
Smith Shoulder: 185(11,4) 14-19
Dec. Skullcrusher: 105(12,4) 15-20
Nautilus Pulldown: 270(14,7) 15-20
DL - SS: 4058 & 36512 5-8, 9-12
B1
DB Alt Curl: 70(11,7) 16-20
BB Rev. Curl: 90(13,9) 16-20 (I like doing an RP set for forearms with the 2RP setup…)
Hor. Calf Push: 32012 10-12
Good Morning: 13510 18510 (just switched to these from leg curls so just feeling them out this time)
BB Squat: 3354 & 275*10 4-6, 10-15 (I don’t like my squat strength so I’m doing my 2nd set with heavier weight and lower reps than the usual WM)
A2
HS Inc. Bench: 280(10,3) 10-14
DB Press: 70(11,4) 14-19
HS Dip: 310(11,3) 13-18
Rack Chins: 10,10 11-15 (just switched to these from wide grip pullups so I was just getting a feel with body weight)
HS Low Row: 300(13,6) 15-20
B2
EZ BB Curl: 105(13,4) 15-20
Hammer Curl: 80(11,5) 15-20
Seat. Calf Raise: 14010 10-12
HS Hack Squat: 38010 & 36515 6-9, 10-15
RDL - SS: 4157 & 365*12 6-8, 10-12
A3
HS Decline Bench: 340(11,3) 10-14
HS Shoulder Press: 220(11,4) 14-19
Rev. Grip Smith: 265(13,5) 15-20
HS Pulldown: 300(15,6) 15-20
BB Row: 2658 & 23512 6-8, 10-12
B3
HS Curl: 110(13,4) 15-20
Pinwheel Curl: 80(13,7) 15-20
Hack Calf Raise: 18512 10-12
1-Leg Curl: R60(12,5) L60(12,5) 15-20
HS Leg Press: 8108 720*15 5-8, 15-20
Question for my triceps:
Basically, I ignored elbow pain for at least a month. I thought I would get over it but it progressively just kept getting worse and worse until finally it hurt outside the gym, and felt like it was on fire when in the gym. I let it go way to far, and yes, I have APT sleeves. My triceps were a big part of me taking this past cruise.
Anyway, I am starting up my new blast on Monday and have given my elbows a lot of rest and ice. Today was my day to lightly get back into lifting for my push exercises and it seems that any isolation exercises irritate my elbow still, however, major pressing exercises don’t bother it much at all. So I am considering using a smith RGBP, Inhuman CGBP on the smith, and a free weight CGBP as my tri exercises. Would this be too much major pressing? I tried to see if I could handle some isolation exercises (pushdowns, PJR’s, even dips) but they all bothered my elbow. Do any of you guys see a problem with this or can I go full speed ahead.
[quote]ajweins wrote:
Question for my triceps:
Basically, I ignored elbow pain for at least a month. I thought I would get over it but it progressively just kept getting worse and worse until finally it hurt outside the gym, and felt like it was on fire when in the gym. I let it go way to far, and yes, I have APT sleeves. My triceps were a big part of me taking this past cruise.
Anyway, I am starting up my new blast on Monday and have given my elbows a lot of rest and ice. Today was my day to lightly get back into lifting for my push exercises and it seems that any isolation exercises irritate my elbow still, however, major pressing exercises don’t bother it much at all.
So I am considering using a smith RGBP, Inhuman CGBP on the smith, and a free weight CGBP as my tri exercises. Would this be too much major pressing? I tried to see if I could handle some isolation exercises (pushdowns, PJR’s, even dips) but they all bothered my elbow. Do any of you guys see a problem with this or can I go full speed ahead.[/quote]
As far as I know, using big presses for all 3 tri exercises is perfectly fine and even encouraged in DC.
Full speed ahead.
Thanks for the input guys. Man I better start eating.
[quote]zenomaly wrote:
ajweins wrote:
Question for my triceps:
Basically, I ignored elbow pain for at least a month. I thought I would get over it but it progressively just kept getting worse and worse until finally it hurt outside the gym, and felt like it was on fire when in the gym. I let it go way to far, and yes, I have APT sleeves. My triceps were a big part of me taking this past cruise.
Anyway, I am starting up my new blast on Monday and have given my elbows a lot of rest and ice. Today was my day to lightly get back into lifting for my push exercises and it seems that any isolation exercises irritate my elbow still, however, major pressing exercises don’t bother it much at all.
So I am considering using a smith RGBP, Inhuman CGBP on the smith, and a free weight CGBP as my tri exercises. Would this be too much major pressing? I tried to see if I could handle some isolation exercises (pushdowns, PJR’s, even dips) but they all bothered my elbow. Do any of you guys see a problem with this or can I go full speed ahead.
As far as I know, using big presses for all 3 tri exercises is perfectly fine and even encouraged in DC.
[/quote]
Can and has been done… Just watch your shoulders… To be honest though, if even PJR’s bother your elbows, then I would personally let them heal and leave any pressing etc out of my routine as well… Perhaps work on your bis, back and legs more for a while… Anything there you want to bring up? Try a non-DC routine for that time maybe.
[quote]Cephalic_Carnage wrote:
zenomaly wrote:
ajweins wrote:
Question for my triceps:
Basically, I ignored elbow pain for at least a month. I thought I would get over it but it progressively just kept getting worse and worse until finally it hurt outside the gym, and felt like it was on fire when in the gym. I let it go way to far, and yes, I have APT sleeves. My triceps were a big part of me taking this past cruise.
Anyway, I am starting up my new blast on Monday and have given my elbows a lot of rest and ice. Today was my day to lightly get back into lifting for my push exercises and it seems that any isolation exercises irritate my elbow still, however, major pressing exercises don’t bother it much at all.
So I am considering using a smith RGBP, Inhuman CGBP on the smith, and a free weight CGBP as my tri exercises. Would this be too much major pressing? I tried to see if I could handle some isolation exercises (pushdowns, PJR’s, even dips) but they all bothered my elbow. Do any of you guys see a problem with this or can I go full speed ahead.
As far as I know, using big presses for all 3 tri exercises is perfectly fine and even encouraged in DC.
Can and has been done… Just watch your shoulders… To be honest though, if even PJR’s bother your elbows, then I would personally let them heal and leave any pressing etc out of my routine as well… Perhaps work on your bis, back and legs more for a while… Anything there you want to bring up? Try a non-DC routine for that time maybe.
[/quote]
The pain has improved a lot since I started my cruise. DC is lower volume than what I was doing previously so I was hoping that with a lot of ice and some NSAIDS short term, the pain will continue to subside. If my pain doesn’t continually lessen as I work into the blast I will probably cut out all tricep work, all pressing for shoulders, and maybe just 1-2 chest exercises using exercises that don’t bother them. I feel optimistic though since all of my chosen exercises for the blast do not overly bother my triceps. Like you said, lets just hope my shoulders can handle it.
[quote]ajweins wrote:
Cephalic_Carnage wrote:
zenomaly wrote:
ajweins wrote:
Question for my triceps:
Basically, I ignored elbow pain for at least a month. I thought I would get over it but it progressively just kept getting worse and worse until finally it hurt outside the gym, and felt like it was on fire when in the gym. I let it go way to far, and yes, I have APT sleeves. My triceps were a big part of me taking this past cruise.
Anyway, I am starting up my new blast on Monday and have given my elbows a lot of rest and ice. Today was my day to lightly get back into lifting for my push exercises and it seems that any isolation exercises irritate my elbow still, however, major pressing exercises don’t bother it much at all.
So I am considering using a smith RGBP, Inhuman CGBP on the smith, and a free weight CGBP as my tri exercises. Would this be too much major pressing? I tried to see if I could handle some isolation exercises (pushdowns, PJR’s, even dips) but they all bothered my elbow. Do any of you guys see a problem with this or can I go full speed ahead.
As far as I know, using big presses for all 3 tri exercises is perfectly fine and even encouraged in DC.
Can and has been done… Just watch your shoulders… To be honest though, if even PJR’s bother your elbows, then I would personally let them heal and leave any pressing etc out of my routine as well… Perhaps work on your bis, back and legs more for a while… Anything there you want to bring up? Try a non-DC routine for that time maybe.
The pain has improved a lot since I started my cruise. DC is lower volume than what I was doing previously so I was hoping that with a lot of ice and some NSAIDS short term, the pain will continue to subside. If my pain doesn’t continually lessen as I work into the blast I will probably cut out all tricep work, all pressing for shoulders, and maybe just 1-2 chest exercises using exercises that don’t bother them. I feel optimistic though since all of my chosen exercises for the blast do not overly bother my triceps. Like you said, lets just hope my shoulders can handle it.[/quote]
In that case, might want to even consider bumping all of your pressing exercise RP ranges to 15-30 (similar to Dante’s suggestion for older lifters) to take even more strain off of the elbow/shoulder joints.