There’s a Q/A with Alex. His numbers have been confirmed. But then again, there’s always people out there who say it’s impossible just because they can’t do it.
[quote]CxTucker wrote:
Here’s a Q/A with Alex. His numbers have been confirmed. But then again, there’s always people out there who say it’s impossible just because they can’t do it.[/quote]
Where have his numbers been confirmed?
[quote]LoRez wrote:
[quote]Ecchastang wrote:
Viada’s claim of a mile PR of 4:15 is more than enough to qualify for Division 1 scholarships. That’s a really really fast mile, for those unfamiliar. [/quote]
It is a really really fast mile. Sub-5 minutes is a fast mile.
That said, a guy I ran with in high school ran a 4:13 mile as a high school sophomore, and 4:02 in college. These days he’s running ultramarathons and regularly placing first in those (e.g., a 100 miler in less than 18 hours). Granted, he was an anomaly on an already good team.
Viada’s claims seem to be stretching things a bit, but not so far as to be entirely unrealistic. On the other hand, I can’t find any info on actual races he ran, which is weird to say the least.[/quote]I bet the sophomore didn’t weigh 230 lbs. The high school record is something like 3:53, but these are absolutely elite runners, not lifters. I would give viada 100 dollars for a sub 4:45 mile. I would be super shocked if he could pull a sub 5.
Viada says “the 4:15 was…A few months back I believe.” He doesn’t even seem sure of it himself. Dude, I can tell you when I ran my best mile at 5:15, it was the Bay Minette city 5k and 1 mile fun run, and my best 5k was 17:29 at the Alabama state cross country championships, and I am certain it was a short course, because I wasn’t better than an 18:30 runner. I can tell you when I benched 305 for the first time, 315, 350 and 365. I can tell you my first V8, 12a, 12b, 12c, and 12d climbing. People remember important PR’s.
[quote]CxTucker wrote:
There’s a Q/A with Alex. His numbers have been confirmed. But then again, there’s always people out there who say it’s impossible just because they can’t do it.
[/quote]
“Confirmed” how? He says himself that the mile was just something he did tooling around and he timed himself with a GPS watch! How can that be “confirmed” ?
Lifts in a meet are obviously verifiable.
Gym lifts on a video are also verifiable.
Running times in a race are verifiable.
Running times that you ran by yourself on a trail with a GPS watch are not really verifiable.
So I’d like to hear more about “his numbers have been confirmed” please.
[quote]Ecchastang wrote:
I would give viada 100 dollars for a sub 4:45 mile. I would be super shocked if he could pull a sub 5.
[/quote]
Sub-5 is certainly possible. Long anecdote coming.
For lack of a better way of putting this, a few years ago, I was pretty fast and still very big for a runner. I played college football, and before getting back into lifting and showing up here in early 2014, I spent most of the 2008-2013 period doing some semi-serious running with a group of local semi-Elites (a few of the best in the group poking around the fringes of making the Oly Trials in the marathon), but I never lost all of the football bulk.
There’s an pic in my hub of me running a 5K in 2012. I was about 200 pounds at the time, maybe a hair under that. I ran an 18:20. In spring 2013, in comparable or slightly better shape but still weighing about 200 pounds, I entered a college track meet as an unattached runner (I still live near my alma mater, and being a good soldier in the athletic department as a college student-athlete, I had a pretty good relationship with all of the coaches - so the track coach gave me the OK to run unattached in one of their low-key invitational meets) and ran a 1500 meter race in 4:56 (coming in last place by about three seconds, lol). That’s the closest thing I have to a recorded mile PR.
Point is, I’m very much an average athlete and I was able to drop about a 5:15ish mile equivalent at 200 pounds. So I would absolutely believe that there’s a really jacked 230-pound dude who can run a sub-5 mile.
But here’s the rub: shaving that extra time from 5:00 down to 4:15 is an enormous difference. Probably about equivalent to the difference between benching 400 and benching 600. One is a very, very strong lift/time but something that thousands of people in the world do every year. The other is scraping near the level of world-class athletes.
So, while some folks might want to play the “I guess you’re just disbelieving because you can’t do it yourself” card - it’s pretty easy to not-believe someone who claims that they’re posting a near-world-class mile time on random daily runs if they can’t enter one timed race to prove it. Doubly humorous when it’s someone that DNF’s an ultra claiming a “stress fracture” who is back in the gym deadlifting a few days later. Stress fracture? Right. That was it.
Same thing with Brian MacKenzie and his CFE bullshit. He talked a lot of trash, and if you looked around CF enthusiast forums for a while you would have found a lot of love for B-Mack and how he was going to show all those skeptical distance running haters how it was done in his documentary. He actually did complete a few ultras in 2006 and 2007 (although he wasn’t winning them or even especially close; he came in 89th of 200-some at the 2006 Western States 100)
Shortly after those 2006-07 races, he started playing up the CFE angle of how he was going to drop some world-class times in the ultra using CFE methodology, and started getting featured in magazine articles and writing books.
He then proceeded to completely tank and/or DNF the few ultramarathon attempts he did make - making hilarious excuses with every new failure - and humorously enough, even after a couple of his disasters, he was/is still being featured in magazine articles and publishing books and getting Q & A’s from blogs. See, look, here’s a Q & A:
This was published on November 10, 2014. Somehow, eight years after his last ultra result and with a string of failures behind him, he has just published a book called “Unbreakable Runner” (an absolutely hilarious title when one considers that he DNF’d most of his major races back when he was peddling this stuff).
Sorry, that’s a super long digression. The point is that just because someone is bragging about what they can do, that doesn’t mean they can actually do it.
Several years belated, but nice job on the 18:20.
@ActivitiesGuy - Great post above. And yes, I have no doubt that there are some 200+ dudes that could train a bit and pull a sub 5 mile, but not 4:15, and while not training running all the freaking time.
BTW, my 5:15 which was my fastest mile, was about 20 minutes after running the 5k race in sub 19 minutes. I weighted about 140 at the time though.
Usually in a 5K, I’d hit a 5:25-5:35 for the first mile. I sucked at pacing, clearly, since I think I only broke 18 minutes once. Didn’t help that I had undiagnosed exercise-induced asthma, but still.
Otherwise, on a track, I hated running anything longer than an 800. I vaguely remember running a 5:05 mile once in training, but that wasn’t something I cared about, and really wasn’t very good when 4:45 is what puts you in the “kinda good” category.
Long story (stories) short, the 4:15 just isn’t that believable, given the context.
[quote]LoRez wrote:
Long story (stories) short, the 4:15 just isn’t that believable, given the context.[/quote]
Extending this point one step further: why is this such a big deal? Let’s chat about this for a second.
I can imagine some defenders of his saying “So, maybe he doesn’t remember the exact details because it’s not a big deal to him” or “So what if he actually ran 5:15 instead of 4:15 and he’s just embellishing a little? It’s still damn impressive for a man his size!”
Those defenses would miss the point. He (apparently) makes part or all of his living as a coach/trainer. If he is selling himself based on these exaggerated and/or untrue claims, that’s fraudulent. VERY fradulent. His whole image is based on the fact that he’s both an Elite powerlifter AND an Elite endurance athlete, from the Googling and reading I’ve done this morning. From a recent Q & A with him:
“Alex spends his free time training for and competing in marathons, ultramarathons, triathlons and powerlifting, and aims to achieve both a sub-eleven hour Ironman and an Elite powerlifting total in the 220 pound classâ?¦”
Another:
“Alex Viada squats 705 pounds. He deadlifts 745 pounds. He benches over 400 pounds. He stays at about 7-8% body fat or less year round. It gets crazier: He can also run a 4:15 mile. And he runs marathons and ultramarathons. And he’s an Ironman triathlete.”
The powerlifting numbers can probably be corroborated.
The running? Not so much. I can find one record of him DNF’ing an ultra last fall. I can find zero marathon results for him in the last three years. I found one from 2011 where he ran a marathon in 4 hours and 17 minutes (Wrightsville Beach); assuming that is the same guy, a 4:17 is a psuedo-impressive accomplishment for a man of his size, but that’s a time that 55 year old ladies around the world beat every weekend. FWIW, I ran a full marathon in 2011 on a lark to pace a friend as I was coming off injury and not in serious race shape (I’d been running once a week leading up to the race and had not gone over 8 miles, doing a couple workouts a week on my spinning bike and elliptical as I tried in vain to keep my conditioning up) - we trotted our way through a 4:16. And this was mediocre-old-me, 200 pounds, nearly untrained, on a monstrously hilly course (Pittsburgh is known as a tough marathon course; Wrightsville Beach is not, lol) actually beating the time that Elite-coach-ALex-Viada has posted in his best marathon?
While I admit the Google may not reach every corner of the Earth, you would think that someone pitching himself as an Elite athlete on both sides of the fence would have at least one notable result, right? Doesn’t someone building their image as the “Elite powerlifter who also runs marathons, ultramarathons, and triathlons” (again, this is a direct quote from a recent profile of his) seem like a little bit of a fraud if he’s not actually running any of those things? Doesn’t this just make him a pretty good powerlifter?
So it’s a little silly to sell himself as “The Ironman Bodybuilder: How to Become a Big, Lean, and Strong Endurance Athlete” when the whole endurance athlete part of that is an enormous stretch.
Let’s imagine this going in the reverse direction. This would be like one of my friends from the Pittsburgh area running club who actually is a semi-elite runner (say, a 2:40 marathoner) giving interviews as “the Elite runner who also dominates powerlifting competitions” when they entered one powerlifting meet and benched 225. That’s an equivalent level of performance to 4:17 marathon. Something most people can’t just walk in off the street and do, but a very, VERY low bar for a trained athlete, nevermind someone selling themselves as a coach in this image.
@ActivitiesGuy - That’s my mistake, as a trainer I suppose. I should bill myself as an elite powerlifter AND world class rock climber, since many of my clients are climbers. As is, I say I am pretty good at both, but that I understand principles that will help others to possibly exceed where I am at (especially at climbing).
^Ecchastang: I actually agree with you that one need not be a world-class athlete to coach world-class athletes. Coaching seems to be aided by some high-level experience in the sport, but as you said it’s more important for a good coach to understand the principles of the sport and training for it. The problem comes when one makes outlandish claims about one’s prowess in an effort to seem more impressive to clients.
Since I’m sure someone will come out of the woodwork to refute my screed above with a response along the lines of “So what, ya hater, he’s still damn strong, can you match his numbers?” - let’s cut that off now. That’s a strawman defense that changes the subject. No, I cannot match his powerlifting numbers, but I’m not giving interviews and Q & A’s selling myself as the “Elite powerlifter who also runs marathons, ultramarathons, and Ironman triathlons” either. My athletic prowess vs. Viada’s has zero to do with the discussion above.
He is, if not directly lying his ass off, using a very misleading presentation of himself. Now that I’ve researched this, the only difference between this and Brian MacKenzie is that Viada actually does have strong powerlifting numbers that can be corroborated, so at least he’s telling the truth on one side of the coin. But he probably ought to drop any discussion of himself as a “marathoner, ultramarathoner, and Ironman triathlete” until he actually has a noteworthy accomplishment in that regard.
ActivitiesGuy - 100% agree. That was my point above. I don’t exaggerate my athletic prowess just to gain clients. Viada is strong, and would do just fine without making up unbelievable claims.
ActivitiesGuy and Ecchastang - That makes a lot of sense. I personally had a hard time trying to excel in strength training and a mile-run and found his claims hard to believe at first too. But I was ignorant and didn’t bother to look into it, haha.
[quote]JTO3221 wrote:
was wanting a idea of how to incorporate westside while doing crossfit yes you read that right keep the sarcastic comments to your self probably the better question would be how to use west side for your olympic lifts with bands and chains i look at Crossfit as Gpp work like conditioning i just love the competition aspect of it maybe wods in A.M and speed work at night for my lifts? thanks for the serious answers ahead of time open to all advice[/quote]
This thread has taken an interesting turn. For the OP’s original question (are you still here, OP?), I highly recommend you check out the Outlaw Crossfit website and their Outlaw Way programming. They use conjugate methods with the Olympic lifts and provide WODs that compliment the daily lifting.
I think that’s about as close to your original question as you’re going to get.
[quote]LiftingStrumpet wrote:
[quote]JTO3221 wrote:
was wanting a idea of how to incorporate westside while doing crossfit yes you read that right keep the sarcastic comments to your self probably the better question would be how to use west side for your olympic lifts with bands and chains i look at Crossfit as Gpp work like conditioning i just love the competition aspect of it maybe wods in A.M and speed work at night for my lifts? thanks for the serious answers ahead of time open to all advice[/quote]
This thread has taken an interesting turn. For the OP’s original question (are you still here, OP?), I highly recommend you check out the Outlaw Crossfit website and their Outlaw Way programming. They use conjugate methods with the Olympic lifts and provide WODs that compliment the daily lifting.
I think that’s about as close to your original question as you’re going to get.
[/quote]
That or signing up on wodfollow so they could follow crossfit conjugate, the guys that you know started the whole conjugating crossfit training 
[quote]corstijeir wrote:
[quote]LiftingStrumpet wrote:
[quote]JTO3221 wrote:
was wanting a idea of how to incorporate westside while doing crossfit yes you read that right keep the sarcastic comments to your self probably the better question would be how to use west side for your olympic lifts with bands and chains i look at Crossfit as Gpp work like conditioning i just love the competition aspect of it maybe wods in A.M and speed work at night for my lifts? thanks for the serious answers ahead of time open to all advice[/quote]
This thread has taken an interesting turn. For the OP’s original question (are you still here, OP?), I highly recommend you check out the Outlaw Crossfit website and their Outlaw Way programming. They use conjugate methods with the Olympic lifts and provide WODs that compliment the daily lifting.
I think that’s about as close to your original question as you’re going to get.
[/quote]
That or signing up on wodfollow so they could follow crossfit conjugate, the guys that you know started the whole conjugating crossfit training :P[/quote]
Interesting. I wasn’t familiar with them. Outlaw does have the advantage of providing their public programming for free. Is the Crossfit Conjugate programming good enough to justify the $45 month price?
[quote]LiftingStrumpet wrote:
[quote]corstijeir wrote:
[quote]LiftingStrumpet wrote:
[quote]JTO3221 wrote:
was wanting a idea of how to incorporate westside while doing crossfit yes you read that right keep the sarcastic comments to your self probably the better question would be how to use west side for your olympic lifts with bands and chains i look at Crossfit as Gpp work like conditioning i just love the competition aspect of it maybe wods in A.M and speed work at night for my lifts? thanks for the serious answers ahead of time open to all advice[/quote]
This thread has taken an interesting turn. For the OP’s original question (are you still here, OP?), I highly recommend you check out the Outlaw Crossfit website and their Outlaw Way programming. They use conjugate methods with the Olympic lifts and provide WODs that compliment the daily lifting.
I think that’s about as close to your original question as you’re going to get.
[/quote]
That or signing up on wodfollow so they could follow crossfit conjugate, the guys that you know started the whole conjugating crossfit training :P[/quote]
Interesting. I wasn’t familiar with them. Outlaw does have the advantage of providing their public programming for free. Is the Crossfit Conjugate programming good enough to justify the $45 month price?
[/quote]
Having seen some of it in person I’d say yes. Besides you can easily split that cost between a few people to have someone else do your programming that has clear results ( see the conjugate black team’s standings )