Dorian Yates said something like this when he was on with Joe Rogan
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Well I don’t mind agreeing with him!
There are plenty of good supporting examples right here on these forums too. Guys that are either completely natural- well developed and accomplished, on trt level doses, or were well advanced before ever using and have done even better since.
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There is unquestionably an over-reliance on PEDs these days if you ask me. Especially when you’ve got “coaches” being hired solely for their drug experience and advice, and more often than not the end (stage) result isn’t half as good as the average (decent) natural competitor.
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disagree, it’s dependent on genetics and work ethic. Two guys with good genetics, diets and work ethic start training for a competition. One uses INSANE, full retard dosages of PED’s, perhaps over relying on PED’s to acquire the size for the win… but his diet and training are on point
The guy on PED’s will look a LOT better… and die about 30 years earlier… I think we all S know T what E the R right O decision I to D make S here is
just kidding… but yes, the first cycle recommendations nowadays blow me away… a GRAM of gear in many circles is considered normal… acceptable even to run for a first cycle… there was one guy here on his first cycle… he ramped up to 1-2g tren weekly… for like 3 months (the guy WILL die within the next 10 years if you ask me)
People want a shortcut, and honestly I can’t blame them… humans tend to be impatient. That being said when looking for a shortcut, at least TRY to look behind you and think “yes, I’ll get there quicker, or even surpass my goal… but at what cost?”
I’d also say that Shaw is able to continue living his life due to the access of medical care. Not everyone has that, or can even afford it. Even more so when we look at other areas outside of the U.S, and other first world countries.
The ability to be able to monitor your body, pay for scans/exams, pain management, physical therapy, medication, etc. I think play a very big role in reasons why guys like Shaw don’t make it, while Shaw is still alive and breathing.
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If you think the thing that prevented Priest from beating Flex or Shawn Ray or Dorian was his steroid cycle, I think you’re greatly oversimplifying the sport of bodybuilding, especially at the highest level.
I believe this describes a large majority of IFBB pros, or at least it did back in the day.
This was Priest at ages 8 and 12. The dude had a natural headstart (no pun intended) from Day One.
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I don’t think that. I also don’t think that Priest’s largest cycle was 400 test 600 deca or whatever he said. I think Priest was a top guy in his day (I know there was some politics going on with Lee, so his placing is likely a bit lower than it should have been).
Do you think within an individual that a larger dose of AAS usually results in more muscle with less fat accumulated (things important for BBing)? Lee was right up there with the best physiques in the world. If in fact his dose was what he said it was, I would think increasing his dosage would help him. However, I don’t believe his stated dosage.
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Clearly on gear at age 12 (just kidding lol)
However I don’t believe he won Mr Olympia with the dosages he claims two have used… I believe he abused the substances just like ALL IFBB pro’s do… He probably wasn’t using 5 grams of gear weekly/the retarded dosages we see all too commonly nowadays, but I can almost guarantee he used his fair share.
Neither do I, neither does @Singhbuilder and many others on the Pharma forum
Lee should have won the Olympia at least once though, he had one of the best physiques bodybuilding has seen to date, esp his forearms…
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PED’s will help with size gains IF everything else is being intelligently (or even less than intelligently, but not totally bone-headedly) adressed. I’ve seen countless gym idiots pumping their weekly PEDs and ending up with not much to show for it. On the other hand, I’ve seen guys who win their pro card clean (or sometimes just some Clen and T-4 for their prep) and then use laughable amounts of gear, and seemingly “blow up”.
When it comes to stage conditioning though, Gear is a toss up based on how experienced you are. Too many variables to land that plane on a dime for the average gym goer to bring it all together in my opinion. THat’s why sitting in the audience at any number of local NPC shows, you can find me rolling my eyes and shaking my head at how bloated and smooth most of the competitors look.
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We’ve gotten a bit off the original topic, and “Do Pros Lie About Their Doses?” could/should definitely be a thread of its own to get more in-depth.
Yes and no. I think there’s definitely a point of diminishing returns, especially when there’s relatively little room for drastic progress. At 5’4" and 225ish on stage, I doubt he’d be able to put on another 20 pounds of lean muscle by doubling his doses.
And if he did somehow put on a ton more muscle, it wouldn’t necessarily translate to a better physique, letalone a higher placing.
I guess the question is: Why would he consistently, for the last 25+ years, be very open about his use of anabolics and growth hormone while also lying about his actual doses? It’s illogical.
When, specifically? Or if you meant in general, that’s a testament to that era, but also largely fanboying (not meaning the term as derogatory, since it describes more than a few of us here.)
Flex “should’ve” won at least one Olympia. Nasser (probably, if you ask Brick) “should’ve” won at least one Olympia. Levrone and Ray are likely on that list too. The '90s were packed with killers on stage.
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Just to circle back to the original dude the thread’s about. Just saw that he put this up most recently.
I didn’t know calves could wrap around the leg and attach under the patella at the front of the shin.
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See, I would never notice stuff like that. Rest looks “unaltered” or not?
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I think we mostly agree here. Maybe I was a bit sloppy with my original post. I do think that a cycle of 400 test and 600 deca is far away from where diminishing returns comes into play. Whether that (more gear) would help him or not is debatable.
One possible explanation is to make him look good. It is clear he is on, why deny that. If he is able to get people to think that he only uses a little it makes him look like a hard worker, with superior genetics, and smart to be able to put together a physique like that with only a moderate cycle.
The year in which Nasser lost to Dorian was a disgrace. It was clear Nasser was far better.
Not even close. Nasser’s arms looked way better (Dorian’s look terrible for Olympia stage IMO), but virtually every muscle group looked better on Nasser that year.
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Yeah, Nasser Took most of the front shots that year, but if you pull up every rear pose and most of the side ones, Dorian still edged him.
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Must not have had his arms in the rear poses. IMO, the bicep tear and with his arms being his weakest point, it was just not there compared to Nasser. Nasser had a lot more leg development too.
BBing is subjective. I personally don’t see a way that Dorian wins. I mean he maybe had him by a bit on the back shots (IMO Nasser looked better from behind shots with arms in them), but the front shots of Dorian are so bad (in comparison to Nasser), I don’t care what his back looks like.
Not really, he has a fan base… many of whom are young, impressionable etc. As we know… many young people… are retarded… thus lying about his dosages may serve as a deterrent mechanism… otherwise I don’t know why he’d lie, but then again I don’t know why sooooo many bodybuilders lie… you’ve got people like Dave Draper and whatnot stating “I took one dbol per day”… then you’ve got guys like Pete Gyrmkowski from the same golden age era “I took 10,000mgs per day”… both are retarded claims that I refuse to believe… guy claims around contest he was taking 27ccs + a fuck ton of orals daily… I don’t believe him either… bodybuilding appears to be full of vein, narcissistic individuals who will lie to keep their egos in check… god forbid the general populace thinks AAS helped fairly significantly in relation to being able to put on so much mass.
Regardless we can agree to disagree on this. Lee recently had his upper arm circumference measured, 20+ inches… and he’s still relatively lean, I highly doubt he’s on “nothing” even today. Makes it even more impressive that he’s so short… perhaps he has a myostatin deficiency (MSTN gene mutation)… if so then yes, he may actually be telling the truth.
Of course I’m a fanboy dude… the guy is short and has CHRONIC PAIN in relation to a car accident he was in many years ago… but he still manages to train… fanboy all the way lol
As for people like Craig Golias… I’m actually convinced they’re legitimately ill… mentally… he must be on grams of gear weekly as a cruise… to keep THAT level of size year round despite knowing it’ll probably kill him within the next five years is just stupid… why? Then there’s the photoshop, the awkward angles he takes his photos at (just to convince us he’s SOOO huge… and he is huge, but the awkwardly angled photos, clear photoshop used etc… his moto about getting bigger) just makes me think “this guy is off his rocker”…
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I’m trying to find the editing here and the only thing that stands out is the box. It almost looks like it’s too far away for his ass to reach it…
Maybe he just shrinks his head?