Combat/Self Defense BJJ

Training
41

Apologies that English is not my first language and everyone understands whatever he wants.
I will share this video of a Turkish guy

Judging by his footwork and stance he has amateur background. His steps while moving and punching backwards are a typical Cuban/Soviet boxing footwork. Where I come from we call them едноименни стъпки or same name steps, which means step back with right feet, hit with the right hand, step back with the left and hit with the left. That gets drilled to death in the beginners in order to learn to punch back / counter punch, when attacked and in a need to keep long and mid range distance, which is what ami boxing is all about.

You can see him adding 45 degree pivots at some of the steps, which speaks good level amateur, as he adds angles. His jab is very precise and drops people.

In conclusion boxing is pretty good against non trained people. Gives excellent tools for defense with a solid stance, balance and footwork. And excellent tools for attack with solid fists.

42

Regarding the self defence cases. The co worker threw a phone, a pen and another tool, which name I do not know how is named in English in my face. What I am supposed to do? Watch him throw other stuff at me?

Regarding the drunk old man. When he walks in a street 40 meters wide with no people in the dark, just us 2 and him into your girl and bumps into her, while touching her… what are you going to do? Let it pass, or take measures so the creep does not follow you?

Regarding the friend I may have been an asshole, but I do not like people challenging me infront of my pack and get away with it.

Regarding the bar fight. The guy hit me with a hook from the back which landed at the side of my chin, bellow my ear. No clue if it is still the chin in English. I dropped him first, then the guy I was arguing with. These were the closest people. Then I saw nobody else wants to argue and fight.

I had other experiences. Such as a mass fight where it did not end well for us but we were lucky the agression did not escalate too much but the initial brawl. I got dropped by a kick in the head from behind and then kicked in the back while on the ground.

I was once attacked by 5 + guys and after eathing some punches I managed to get away by punching out my way and managed to run away.

And I lost a 1v1 fight against a guy who somehow landed a pretty strong kick in my mid section so I was unnable to breath. He got lucky in that one. Because I am pretty sure I got him well some punches and he just panic kicked.

43

Okay let’s wrap this up. You are advising that someone interested in learning Jiu Jitsu as a fighting art INSTEAD should train to box at a very low amateur level.

Then start trouble and punch your way out of it.

Thanks for your contributions to this training topic.

44

In fairness to ins his tactics work. My toddler grandson attacked me with his Buzz Lightyear toy last night. I resolved the situation with a feint a jab and a right hook. He went down like a bag of bricks and a swift low kick finished the fight.

45

@twojarslave Thankyou for your contributions on this thread, it cheered up my otherwise very dull afternoon.

46

You’re welcome. I enjoy writing about this topic and I’m glad others enjoy it.

To throw our overseas pugilist a bone, he is largely correct that a little bit of boxing will put you ahead of the curve in many situations. Consider the following:

Most fights are social displays of dominance. The goal is not to take something or even necessarily cause great harm. The goal is to dominate and be seen dominating, or very similar types of motivation.

One person will, generally speaking, “win” the fight. This is true whether a drunk fights a bouncer, two MMA pros are going at it or two untrained idiots start throwing hands over a soccer dispute. Someone will probably come out on top unless you get one of those rare Matt Hughes double unconscious situations.

Most people cannot mount an organized response to violence, even though they may initiate the violence. It typically takes very little to break their fighting spirit. All kinds of things can get the job done. It may just take a hard shove. Firm language. Foul language. A simple trip or takedown. Or, like our pugilist has shown, a little one-two to the face can be very effective against old men and irritating coworkers.

When we consider these truths it is unsurprising that some low level amateur boxing and an eagerness to punch people will “win” violent encounters with untrained office workers and elderly street denizens.

You don’t need martial arts at all for that kind of behavior. Being an aggressive asshole will probably win you just as many pointless fights in silly circumstances.

With that out of the way, let’s go back to self defense. That term means a lot of things to a lot of people. When I think about whether someone knows self defense or not, I start with a simple test.

Can they defend themselves from me? I have, after all, come out on top. A lot.

Back to the original topic of sport vs self defense, my instructor and ALL of his peers (black and high level brown belts at his school) could WHOOP MY ASS. No question. Big or small. They’re that good. All I’d have is a distant punchers chance at goon-based luck prevailing. This is NOT true at all for MANY sport school black and brown belts I’ve rolled with. Not that those guys are pushovers, but I’d have space to work and opportunities that don’t exist when someone can just take it all away from you so decisively.

Of course, the sport guys would still have an easy time rag-dolling just about any amateur boxer you put in front of them.

Meanwhile we just let a boxer go at the bar. The reasons were many, but the fact that he got his ass handed to him multiple times didn’t help his case.

Train Jiu Jitsu.

47

You certainly make some good points here. The hit first and hit hard option is certainly one that will work for many situations but depending on the skill or strength or speed of the person hitting and the training or readiness of the person getting hit, it is not always going to work for everyone.
I think the one think that a lot of people miss when they talk about ‘self defense’ as opposed to fighting is the importance of situational and self awareness. The most important thing in self defence is to be able to read a situation and know if or when things are going to turn ugly. Be able to spot trouble and either walk away or intervene very early and remove the threat through passive means, can eliminate the need for conflict in the first place. Of course having some skill, training or experience to deal with the problem if this doesn’t work is also pretty useful.

48

Someone once asked Royce about multiple opponents. His response to someone saying they could beat more than one person would be: let me pick the opponents. Someone asked Rickson what he would do if faced with multiple opponents and he said he would get his brothers. If that wasn’t an option he said that’s why he carries a gun. They had no delusions.

49

This is absolutely correct. I would add that there’s another component that’s just as vital (at least in bar fights and the lead-up’s to them), which is the willingness to walk away from an asshole. Some guys (and gals) just can’t let it go, and then things get ugly. All over some drunk asshole you don’t know and don’t want to know.

Self-defense 101. Avoid violent conflict.

50

Yer the thought of losing an argument to win a fight is foreign to most people.

51

What are people’s opinions on the value of some of the weekend course self defence offerings available? I’ve heard good things about Kelly McCann’s Kembatives courses. Obviously you aren’t going to walk out of a weekend course as Bruce Lee but it may be possible to pick up and become somewhat proficient in a handful of techniques that could help you survive a sticky situation. Anybody have any experience with these?

52

All of these skills are perishable so you need to be consistent with training them. Otherwise you might simply be learning enough to get yourself killed.

53

I just wonder how is your bjj gonna work once I jab you in the nose and break it, with a follow up with a cross to the solar that will take your breath… you have no idea how to defend punches, nor how to react against someone that can punch… just wondering

54

So now we’re having a dick measuring contest over which style is better, which was kind of my point above: there is no best style. It comes down to the individual and the scenario. A boxer with grappling knowledge can be effective. So can a grappler with boxing knowledge.

Don’t play the “my style can beat your style” game. It’s stupid.

55

Are you bulletproof?

56

I am not that stupid to enter such s debate. We know that wrestling is effective and in s trained vs trained sports fight the wrestler will win the majority of the contests. Bjj and wrestling are very effective no doubt about that.

We are talking self defence here. The point I was trying to bring is that someone mentioned if you are an aggressive asshole you will win the majority of the fights. Which is true. You need very little to ruin someones fight spirit.

However not every agressive asshole will be able to do that. You need precision, drilling the technique and actually learning to punch/hit. According to my experience everyone should develop at least 1 strong hit to be able to finish fights as quick as possible. For me thats a jab or a left hook. For my ex kick boxing coach that was a low kick. He is an ex pro MMA fighter and works as bouncer during the summmer. The guy kicks like a truck and according to him this is the safest way to end fights. Strong low kicks.

Getting back to the point of self defence. Does BJJ work it does. But if I was trained in bjj I would learn to hit and defend basic punching if I was after self defence.

For myself as someone having some experience in boxing and very little in kick boxing I d probably benefit more if I learn to grapple.

57

I love BJJ above all martial arts. But I’m glad my Dad taught me the basics of boxing very early (as a black kid during the Ali/Frazier/Foreman era, this was a no-brainer). I’m also grateful that I spent my late elementary/middle school years doing TKD to learn basic kicking mechanics.

I think striking (especially punching) is a bit inefficient/scales poorly in terms of fighting. But I’d hate to have to learn basic striking mechanics for the first time as an adult. It’s like people who don’t learn how to run properly as kids. It’s a little harder to do later.

58

That sounds terrifying. If there’s one person I’m glad I didn’t run into as a bouncer, it’s an 0-2 amateur boxer who threatens people over the internet.

59

Its OK @twojarslave you would be too out of breath from the punch to the solar to be scared !!

60

I am also glad I did not run into a bouncer with a bad sense of humour :slight_smile:
I wonder, have you ever fought in an ami competition that involves striking? Because you always bring bouncing as a job description as it is the ultimate title for self defence expertise. So have you ever fought?