Sorry Boys, don’t get on here alot.
I must of misremembered what i wrote last time, what i meant to write was:
Why in the world, if you want to lift heavy weight, would you waste your time power cleaning.
eh?
There, i hope i got it right this time.
LB
So home boy in the video is about where I catch all my cleans. I am reading the wil Fleming stuff and backing off on the weight as per the advice! Because I’m a nut bar I have been doing some higher rep work then I would ever ever normally do. Sets of 6 and 8 weigh 50% 55% and of course singles with some higher percentages.
Appreciate the feedback and if anyone else has any video links I’d appreciate it!
The big difference between my clean and c+j is because my delts are weak. Straight up. I’m a puller not a pusher. Has improved a lot though even in the past month.
Push jerked 185 for 3 sets of triples yesterday. Completely different level of violence coming through lately and I like it!!!
Also just want to state that the clean and front squat combo is something he recommends as we’ll! Way to go self on the deductive reasoning
[quote]Jbott1988 wrote:
Appreciate the feedback and if anyone else has any video links I’d appreciate it![/quote]
I mostly posted that video to show that there are some current elite lifters who do the power versions of the lifts in their training (that’s Behdad Salimi, current snatch world record holder, 2010 and 2011 world champion and 2012 Olympic champion), but if you want more videos -
That’s George Kobaladze, the top superheavyweight in Canada right now.
[quote]LBramble wrote:
eh?
[/quote]
Are you Canadian?
[quote]TheJonty wrote:
[quote]LBramble wrote:
eh?
[/quote]
Are you Canadian?[/quote]
Translocated Ukrainian from Saskatchewan to now callin Tennessee home. Tryin to fit in with the good ole boys down here, they sure like there football, but it just looks like slow hockey to me. Real slow.
And sure, good lifters power clean, but for nothin more than to break up the menotony. But americans eat it up on video cause its usually way over anything they see being full C&J’d. But do you really think it makes up any reasonable % of all the lifts an elite lifter does? Really?
Now that Ilin is posting much longer clips of his typical workouts, go tell me what percentage involve the all might power clean?
If your best clean is only 5 kg better than your best power clean then your afraid of cleans. And that’s very understandable. I’m afraid of heights and being out on the ocean where i can’t see land.
LB
[quote]LBramble wrote:
Translocated Ukrainian from Saskatchewan to now callin Tennessee home. Tryin to fit in with the good ole boys down here, they sure like there football, but it just looks like slow hockey to me. Real slow.[/quote]
Cool, I was born in Saskatoon. I must confess to being a bit more of a football fan than a hockey fan, however.
[quote]LBramble wrote:
And sure, good lifters power clean, but for nothin more than to break up the menotony. But americans eat it up on video cause its usually way over anything they see being full C&J’d. But do you really think it makes up any reasonable % of all the lifts an elite lifter does? Really?
Now that Ilin is posting much longer clips of his typical workouts, go tell me what percentage involve the all might power clean?
If your best clean is only 5 kg better than your best power clean then your afraid of cleans. And that’s very understandable. I’m afraid of heights and being out on the ocean where i can’t see land.
LB
[/quote]
I posted the first video mostly because it seemed like amayakyrol didn’t think they exist, and the second because OP asked for it. Personally, I’ve found my max effort cleans are crisper when I’m not doing heavy power cleans, which I generally try to avoid anyways because they aggravate my knees. Elite level lifters can get away with doing the power versions of the lifts because they do so much volume of the full lifts anyways. Also, if I’m not mistaken, Ilya Ilin trains under a system in Kazakhstan that generally emphasizes the full lifts and squats at high intensity, a more “Bulgarian” system if you will. I wouldn’t expect too many power cleans/snatches from him.
If your full clean isn’t much more than your power clean it’s not necessarily a fear thing. As I alluded to somewhere on the last page, if your technique is off and you’re putting the bar in a place that makes it difficult to get underneath (as an example, pushing it forward), you’re going to be continually frustrated at heavier weights, regardless of how big your balls are.
[quote]amayakyrol wrote:
Koing, how does doing cleans from the hang improve speed if you’re still only able to get under a weight you excessively high? My power clean is only about 5 kilos under my best clean and I’m getting under my best clean well above parallel and riding it down. [/quote]
Lifts from the hang generally help lifters with speed as they won’t be able to pull the bar so high.
The focus for a beginner shouldn’t be to pull the bar excessively high, but to pull to their belly button, get under it with speed and a solid receive position.
The problem with your lifts without actually seeing videos of your lifts is you aren’t use to getting under the bar when it’s heavy and doesn’t go high. I’d lift with a bit less weight for a bit or at least do more working sets at a lighter weight so you get use to getting under the bar when it doesn’t get so high. This will help you lift heavier cleans.
You shouldn’t really be able to Clean only 5kg more than your PC. This would indicate an issue with your clean technique.
Koing
I’m jumping forward. I’m not sure if it’s from not finishing the pull or hitting it off my hips.
[quote]amayakyrol wrote:
I’m jumping forward. I’m not sure if it’s from not finishing the pull or hitting it off my hips.[/quote]
Your hips shoot up too fast.
I don’t know about that. I’ve never seen a tall/long femur lifter keep their hips down as low as everyone says they should. I would need a much stronger lower back to keep my hips down.
[quote]amayakyrol wrote:
I don’t know about that. I’ve never seen a tall/long femur lifter keep their hips down as low as everyone says they should. I would need a much stronger lower back to keep my hips down.
[/quote]
The Chinese and Russians (at Klokov) advocate have crazy strong backs for just that purpose. So, your hips still move up too fast.
I’ll try to keep my hips down and stick to 80% or lighter weight, but if that doesn’t work I’ll just hang clean until I build up my back more.
[quote]amayakyrol wrote:
I don’t know about that. I’ve never seen a tall/long femur lifter keep their hips down as low as everyone says they should. I would need a much stronger lower back to keep my hips down.
[/quote]
You’d never seen an elite lifter do a power clean either.
What determines how low a lifter can keep their hips is more relative femur length as opposed to height. Salimi (the first power clean video I posted on the last page) is 6’5 or 6’6 I think, and his hips don’t shoot up. Szymon Kolecki is about 6’1 and lifted at 94, and he stayed fairly upright through the clean:
When I think of guys who lift more with their back Marcin Dolega comes to mind, but he stays a little more upright and keeps his back angle more constant than you:
Of course, then you have a guy like Jorge Arroyo, who lifts with his hips fairly high, but I don’t think your femurs are quite as proportionately long as his:
And one other thing these guys all do better than you? Finish the pull. When I say finish the pull, I mean being patient, waiting just a little longer, and getting the bar a little higher and a little further back before you pop. I know finishing the pull is one of the things you originally mentioned, but it’s generally much easier to finish the pull properly if you begin it properly.
How tall are you?
Seriously, how how obtuse do you have to be not realize that I was being sarcastic about not seeing elite lifters do power cleans? The post was clearly sarcastic and I already said before that it was sarcastic.
[quote]amayakyrol wrote:
Seriously, how how obtuse do you have to be not realize that I was being sarcastic about not seeing elite lifters do power cleans? The post was clearly sarcastic and I already said before that it was sarcastic. [/quote]
Hmm. I read that bit wrong. I must’ve still been confused how somebody who has yet to snatch 100kg could be blowing off Tommy Kono because he “doesn’t know what he’s talking about.”
Doesn’t change the fact that when you clean your hips come up faster than your shoulders and you pop a little too early, both of which contribute to you pushing the bar forward and having to jump after it.
[quote]TheJonty wrote:
[quote]amayakyrol wrote:
Seriously, how how obtuse do you have to be not realize that I was being sarcastic about not seeing elite lifters do power cleans? The post was clearly sarcastic and I already said before that it was sarcastic. [/quote]
Hmm. I read that bit wrong. I must’ve still been confused how somebody who has yet to snatch 100kg could be blowing off Tommy Kono because he “doesn’t know what he’s talking about.”
Doesn’t change the fact that when you clean your hips come up faster than your shoulders and you pop a little too early, both of which contribute to you pushing the bar forward and having to jump after it.[/quote]
Hey Jonty, tell me, what is a power clean?
Clean video
-upper back isn’t neutral when you set your position
-hips pop up too fast,
-chest pitches down quite a lot, more than that is really acceptable IMO. Yeah Dolega hips pitch up as well but he’s also an ex WR holder in the Sn 
-back rounds more
-be more patient with the pull, use your lats to bring the bar closer to your hips, don’t bend your arms though, minimise this
-drive up
-bend arms at the correct time, this will help keep the bar in about/ just after contact
-your bar goes away as you keep your arms too straight and it swings out
-you jump forwards due to swinging/ bumping the bar out
Correct one of these things at a time.
Koing
Okay. I’ll work from the hang position on fixing the second/third pulls first with light and then move to the floor.
All my pulls from the floor are difficult to set up, including deadlifts even though I’ve DLed 226 kg in Olympic shoes.
Looking at some older videos makes me think that the problem is just pulling from the floor and that I can pull from blocks/hang reasonably well.
Not quite sure if full extension or not. Leaning towards no. Bar comes backwards slightly.
First one - bar slightly end, but there is no forward jump. It looks like I pulled it back towards me. Second pull looks better to me.
I think hang/block pulls from right above the knees will enable me to get into the best position for the movement.
[quote]Koing wrote:
Hey Jonty, tell me, what is a power clean?[/quote]
Seems like most people nowadays define it as a clean caught at or above parallel (parallel defined as the crease of the hip being no lower than the top of the knee). Personally, if I’m doing anything power, I keep it light enough so I can catch it standing fairly tall. When I start catching heavy weights at around parallel I hear about it from my knees. Also saw a video of Ian Wilson doing a “power” clean and jerk where he caught the clean below parallel but above rock bottom.
[quote]Koing wrote:
Clean video
-upper back isn’t neutral when you set your position
-hips pop up too fast,
-chest pitches down quite a lot, more than that is really acceptable IMO. Yeah Dolega hips pitch up as well but he’s also an ex WR holder in the Sn
-back rounds more
-be more patient with the pull, use your lats to bring the bar closer to your hips, don’t bend your arms though, minimise this
-drive up
-bend arms at the correct time, this will help keep the bar in about/ just after contact
-your bar goes away as you keep your arms too straight and it swings out
-you jump forwards due to swinging/ bumping the bar out
Correct one of these things at a time.
Koing[/quote]
Nice to see I’m not the only one that writes long-winded responses sometimes.