I don’t claim to have large upper traps. I don’t want large upper traps. That’s why I was asking how to minimize their involvement in an exercise.
The trouble with this site is some people go off like they’re some sort of guru when really their input isn?t anything special. I asked about how to minimize trap work on pull-ups- there are ways to minimize it, there is no arguing that, so just answer and be done with.
Instead of answering, people, profx, in particular, will go off about how I?m ignoring major muscle groups, which is unfounded, there’s no reason to assume the only exercise I ever do is this variation of pull-ups I?m seeking to find, or about how my traps aren?t big enough so I shouldn?t be asking the question.
They’re my damn traps and I?ll grow them as I please. I didn?t ask if they are big enough. There’s no point in pretending you’re the king of the gym and the final judge of physiques just to hammer others to try to show they know what a real body looks like as if somehow having basic standards equivalent to a long-time bodybuilder makes others think you?re on their level- don’t kid yourselves. And profx- get a life.
[quote]P1 wrote:
I don’t claim to have large upper traps. I don’t want large upper traps. That’s why I was asking how to minimize their involvement in an exercise.
The trouble with this site is some people go off like they?re some sort of guru when really their input isn?t anything special. I asked about how to minimize trap work on pull-ups- there are ways to minimize it, there is no arguing that, so just answer and be done with.
Instead of answering, people, profx, in particular, will go off about how I?m ignoring major muscle groups, which is unfounded, there?s no reason to assume the only exercise I ever do is this variation of pull-ups I?m seeking to find, or about how my traps aren?t big enough so I shouldn?t be asking the question.
They?re my damn traps and I?ll grow them as I please. I didn?t ask if they are big enough. There?s no point in pretending you?re the king of the gym and the final judge of physiques just to hammer others to try to show they know what a real body looks like as if somehow having basic standards equivalent to a long-time bodybuilder makes others think you?re on their level- don?t kid yourselves. And profx- get a life.
[/quote]
I think the problem that everyone, and namely professor x, is objecting to, is your unacknowledged ignorance. Sure, you’ll grow your traps as you please but apparently you aren’t aware that pull-ups aren’t gonna do shit to grow those traps of yours.
The fact that you ask how to remove the trapezius muscles from an exercise that blatantly does not affect the trapezius muscles enough to promote hypertrophy, suggests you know absolutely nothing about how to build your body.
In response, professor x and others kindly (at least for him) informed you that you have no idea what the hell you’re talking about and really aren’t asking questions appropriate to bodybuilding. It would be like going into a car forum and asking how to decorate your upholstery to maximize gas mileage. The semantics of your question suggest you just need to learn some basics.
[quote]P1 wrote:
I don’t claim to have large upper traps. I don’t want large upper traps. That’s why I was asking how to minimize their involvement in an exercise.
The trouble with this site is some people go off like they’re some sort of guru when really their input isn?t anything special. I asked about how to minimize trap work on pull-ups- there are ways to minimize it, there is no arguing that, so just answer and be done with.
Instead of answering, people, profx, in particular, will go off about how I?m ignoring major muscle groups, which is unfounded, there’s no reason to assume the only exercise I ever do is this variation of pull-ups I?m seeking to find, or about how my traps aren?t big enough so I shouldn?t be asking the question.
They’re my damn traps and I?ll grow them as I please. I didn?t ask if they are big enough. There’s no point in pretending you’re the king of the gym and the final judge of physiques just to hammer others to try to show they know what a real body looks like as if somehow having basic standards equivalent to a long-time bodybuilder makes others think you?re on their level- don’t kid yourselves. And profx- get a life.
[/quote]
You’re a dumbass. Your question has now been answered several times over and you STILL don’t seem to get the key point being made to you. I suggest you also worry about how to decrease activation of your gluteus maximus while doing overhead presses. They’ll grow simply fucking huge if you don’t learn to “deactivate” them.
[quote]SkyzykS wrote:
hardcoreukno0359 wrote:
oh secondly, someone explain to me how you can train for thickness, if muscle grows in cross sectional area, muscles only contract and thats it, i don’t think they are that smart in terms of knowing how to grow thick or ???, dependent on the exercise you do.
.
It is very strange that you can use the words “cross sectional area” in a sentence, and not know how that would apply to thickness.
Heres an example.
You have a cylinder. It is one inch in diameter, and has a .5 in. radius because the radius is half of the diameter. Its cross sectional area would be related to the radius in the formula- A=pi*(r^2)
Now increase that cylinders diameter to two inches. Its “cross sectional area” has changed proportionaly to the difference in the radius.
How does this relate to muscle thickness? As a muscle grows, it gets thicker (like the cylinder), and increases in cross sectional area.
See, this right here is exactly the problem with acces to a bunch of information with out the foundation of knowledge to understand it.
You get guys misunderstanding entire concepts, and throwing around words like “cross sectional area” without a clue as to what they actualy mean.
[/quote]
wow, its not that i dont get the concept of cross sectional area, all i have a problem with is the concept of thickness can be worked by certain exercises, the point i was making, is that technically all exercises work the “thickness” of a muscle
[quote]P1 wrote:
I don’t claim to have large upper traps. I don’t want large upper traps. That’s why I was asking how to minimize their involvement in an exercise.
[/quote]
And it was explicitly explained to you on numerous occasions that pull-ups don’t activate the upper traps, AT ALL.
See above comment. The reason why people were/are getting impatient with you is that you still haven’t seemed to realize that your question made no sense. Which, suggests that you have a complete lack of knowledge of physiology/biomechanics. Why you even thought that pull-ups work the upper traps is a question in and of itself.
But people did/have answered your question several times.
See, here is the problem. You are obviously a newbe who really has no idea what they are doing, or what exercises work what muscles. So, you come here and ask us a question that doesn’t make any sense. Thus, we know that you’re a newbe.
Then, when we tell you what you need to hear and in effect answer your question; you get mad, because it wasn’t the answer you wanted to hear. And on top of ignoring our attempts to try to set you straight (help you), you get all insulting.
Look man, no one here has anything to gain by steering you in the wrong direction. We are all here on our own free will and are taking time out of our lives to honestly try to answer your questions, dispel your misunderstandings, and overall point you in the right direction.
You need to realize that none of us needs to do this. We’re not getting paid to come onto this board or share our hard earned experience with you or anyone else. We do it because we choose to. We do it because we feel that we have learned lessons that we can pass on to the next generation so that they don’t have to make the same mistakes that we did, or that we see many people around us make.
On this board there is a great wealth of knowledge and experience. Let me ask you this…how long have you been training? I’ve been training for 8 years, have a degree in exercise science, am a certified personal trainer, and actually get results out of the people I train. I’ve also trained with some world class strength coaches.
But, I’m not even close to the most experienced person here. There are people on here who put my experience to shame and have 20+ years of experience.
What’s the point of all of this? The point is that we have been where you are, you haven’t been where we are. Lose the ego and listen to the people who have been there and done that. You might learn something.
[quote]robo1 wrote:
Body Hammer wrote:
kinein wrote:
In the spirit of the subject title I ask this. If a killer whale and a space monkey were to race, who would win, and why?
The space monkey of course, what kind of retard are you for even asking a question like that??? Jeez!
You’re reasoning is flawed body hammer. Space money’s don’t have the level of development needed to win such a competition because they spend too much time ignoring major muscle groups. In my gym alone I frequently have to kick the space monkeys out of the curl rack so I can squat. Killer whales, on the other hand, are just badasses all around.[/quote]
Now you’re just being discriminatory. Of course you don’t see killer whales in the goddamn curl rack, they don’t have arms! Jesus!
I have seen a killer whale attempt to enter a squat rack tho. Unfortunately the Space Monkey was dragging it away for who knows what.
Reiterating the knowledge shared in this post. Chin-up and Traps shouldn’t be mentioned in the same sentence.
Here if you still don’t believe anyone let’s try the simplest way for you to feel some of your traps.
Grab a barbell weighted nicely, or 2 mediocre weights, proceed to shrug and contract and hold at the top.
Or the look even meaner method, as inspired by CW - Grab a pair of light dumbells, pink if you can find some. Then straddle a incline bench and peer over the top as if bent on the destruction of mankind.
politely raise weights in a neutral grip like you were raise a bed sheet to hang on a outside line. ( or as if you were trying to impress a woman in the 7th century by holding 2 newly gutted woodland furry creatures.
Now go do a pullup/chin-up, do you feel your traps being used? Just curious!
There is alot of good info on this thread. To the OP, do the damn chins or pullups, your traps WILL NOT become mountains. How’s that? It’s widely agreed that olympic lifts, shrugs and DL’s build the traps the most. So since you won’t want “imbalanced” traps, don’t do the exercises above even though rows will still work your traps… It’s been said on this thread many times that your question was answered.
[quote]aussie486 wrote:
kinein wrote:
In the spirit of the subject title I ask this. If a killer whale and a space monkey were to race, who would win, and why?
The space monkey would, it has more ‘‘functional strength’’.
wow, its not that i dont get the concept of cross sectional area, all i have a problem with is the concept of thickness can be worked by certain exercises, the point i was making, is that technically all exercises work the “thickness” of a muscle[/quote]
You’re getting confused by semantics. Yes, from a physiological standpoint muscle fibers grow thicker, regardless of exercise. But, unlike the biceps brachii, or triceps which are considered one muscle, the “back” is actually made up of many different muscles (lats, traps, rhomboids, erector spinae, teres major, etc…).
Now, the two largest groups of muscles of these are the lats and traps.
When the lats grow (albeit they technically increase their cross sectional area and grow “thicker”) they increase the “width” of the back if one were to look at it from the front or back.
When the traps grow on the other hand they increase the “thickness” of the back if one were to view it from the side.
These terms aren’t physiological terms, they’re bodybuilding slang. But, it makes it easy to differentiate between an increase in front to back size, and side to side size.
wow, its not that i dont get the concept of cross sectional area, all i have a problem with is the concept of thickness can be worked by certain exercises, the point i was making, is that technically all exercises work the “thickness” of a muscle
You’re getting confused by semantics. Yes, from a physiological standpoint muscle fibers grow thicker, regardless of exercise. But, unlike the biceps brachii, or triceps which are considered one muscle, the “back” is actually made up of many different muscles (lats, traps, rhomboids, erector spinae, teres major, etc…).
Now, the two largest groups of muscles of these are the lats and traps.
When the lats grow (albeit they technically increase their cross sectional area and grow “thicker”) they increase the “width” of the back if one were to look at it from the front or back.
When the traps grow on the other hand they increase the “thickness” of the back if one were to view it from the side.
These terms aren’t physiological terms, they’re bodybuilding slang. But, it makes it easy to differentiate between an increase in front to back size, and side to side size.
Hope that helps,
Sentoguy[/quote]
gotcha, just wanted to clarify the way pepole use those terms
[quote]dollarbill44 wrote:
hardcoreukno0359 wrote:
just food for thought, why dont we all just pool our knowledge, answer the question and thats it, theres no use ranting about the image in your head that is acceptable, the poster asked a question and all we need to do is answer it and worry about nothing else, seems like life is too short to me.
oh secondly, someone explain to me how you can train for thickness, if muscle grows in cross sectional area, muscles only contract and thats it, i don’t think they are that smart in terms of knowing how to grow thick or ???, dependent on the exercise you do.
also for upper back size everyone revisit Poliquin’s article on the best upper back exercises, most of them pull-up variations with super high contractions.
The only way to train for thickness (which I read as front to back depth, i.e. from the vertical center of body backward) is to go heavy on pulling and rowing and eat big.
To the OP, you can’t have a “thick” back without thick traps. Traps are a major part of the upper back. If you want width, that is a different issue because you can get lat width without a thick back - just do lots and lots of t-bar rows to the mid-section. You can also do full-range pullups and chinups. The amount you work your lats vs the amount you work you traps means that you will put on far more mass in your lats than in your traps. This will reduce any imbalance in traps that you think you have.
Think in terms of a a square rotated so that the corners are pointing up-down and right-left (otherwise called a diamond). If you stretch it out from the corners by pulling the right-left (your lats) 3" and the top corner 1" (your traps), what happens to the shape? Sure, the diamond grew taller, but because it grew disproportionately width-wise, you don’t really notice the vertical increase.
And the race between the space monkey and the killer whale is dependent on the venue (air/land/sea/space). In space, the monkey wins a close one because he doesn’t die near the finish - like the whale. In the sea, clearly the whale. On land, the whale can’t move, yet the space monkey can’t handle the gravity, so neither of them win. In the air, it’s an African Swallow. Since the African Swallow can also walk on land, it is a superior racer to the other two.
Keep in mind you’re posting this in the BODYBUILDING section of TESTOSTERONE NATION. Show some fucking respect to those who deserve it (aka people who have lifted weights for more than 3 months and know what they’re doing).
All of you think this is funny but its not ! You see ,about 5 years ago I started really hitting the pullups for a little help with the lats.I started out with a set or two 2 days a week.However pretty soon I was a man possesed I was up to 4 sets of 10 ,three days a week.Then one morning I awoke and looked at my self in the mirror.What I saw was not a man but a twisted ugly creature.
I sreamed, Nooooooooooo!My traps had become over stimulated, I no longer had a neck or head their was just one giant hump from shoulder to shoulder, with two beady little eyes peering out in horror.Now ,after 64 surgeries and hundreds of hours of counseling I am able to tell my story.Whatever you do dont ever and I mean ever do a Pullup again, it is simply not worth it!!!
If ever there was proof that this site has taken a turn to the estro-soy-boy, twink-chic look, this is the thread.
You could do chins until the cows come home, and you would never “over stimulate” the traps - upper, middle, lower, or otherwise. Imbalance my white ass.
I guess the OP digs the skinny Katherine Hepburn neck. Not that there is anything wrong with that.
If ever there was proof that this site has taken a turn to the estro-soy-boy, twink-chic look, this is the thread.
You could do chins until the cows come home, and you would never “over stimulate” the traps - upper, middle, lower, or otherwise. Imbalance my white ass.
I guess the OP digs the skinny Katherine Hepburn neck. Not that there is anything wrong with that.
DO people still try to build muscle anymore? [/quote]
The real question is, why is he even doing the chin ups if he hates muscle mass so much.