[quote]BrickHead wrote:
Paul Dillet, quite smooth. Full offseason mode.
[/quote]
Uh, that’s a guest posing.
WTF?
[quote]The Mighty Stu wrote:
I’ve been reading the muscle rags and following the sport of bodybuilding since the early 90’s, and there’s no way the ‘offseason’ IFBB pros guest posing back then were even near contest lean. Sure they relied on a hell of a lot of PEDs to diet down quicker than a natty competitor would, but to look at pics, even from the golden 90’s and say that these guys were 12 weeks out from contest ready is just silly.
S[/quote]
Every pic he is showing isn’t full off season mode.
If they are in posing trunks on a stage, they are probably guest posing.
Then your concept of conditioning and contest readiness and contest dieting is way off.
[quote]Smashingweights wrote:
^hes wearing trunks. He must be near contest condition.[/quote]
You can see veins everywhere on him. He is just holding water because he isn’t using any diruetics.
You can’t possibly think they would go to a guest posing in full off season mode.
Chances are, if they are at a guest posing, they got FATTER than that in full off season mode.
[quote]BrickHead wrote:
Then your concept of conditioning and contest readiness and contest dieting is way off. [/quote]
That pic of Paul Dillet is not full off season mode. He is months away from contest condition.
Not to mention I still have not heard how a picture of Paul Dillet means you can’t gain 80lbs of lean body mass.
[quote]Professor X wrote:
Not to mention I still have not heard how a picture of Paul Dillet means you can’t gain 80lbs of lean body mass.[/quote]
Of course you can. He probably did.
[quote]BrickHead wrote:
[quote]Professor X wrote:
Not to mention I still have not heard how a picture of Paul Dillet means you can’t gain 80lbs of lean body mass.[/quote]
Of course you can. He probably did. [/quote]
Yeah, I would say he did…but again, why are you posting pictures of these guys?
What do they have to do with whether someone can gain 80lbs of lean body mass?
You are just doing this to show your opinion of what certain levels of fatness look like?
That pic of Paul Dillet he’s under 10% bf, look at the leg separation, the veins, the shoulder/arm and shoulder/trap separation. He’s just holding the niagra falls on him.
[quote]myself1992 wrote:
That pic of Paul Dillet he’s under 10% bf, look at the leg separation, the veins, the shoulder/arm and shoulder/trap separation. He’s just holding the niagra falls on him.[/quote]
Exactly.
That is near contest shape…with water bloat. Not sure how someone thinks that is full blown off season mode for any of them especially in the 90’s. Cormier got way fatter than that.
PD
[quote]Professor X wrote:
[quote]jskrabac wrote:
Think about it man. You had to start a thread talking about how awesome it is that SOME people are finally talking about staying lean in a god damned BODYBUILDING forum!!! That’s like going to the emergency room and being like, “Hey docs, it’s really cool you all are actually trying to heal people now.”
[/quote]
If this is a bodybuilding forum, why is the actual BUILDING THE MUSCLE PART being downplayed in favor of staying lean all of the time?
Real question.
No one, and I mean no one is talking down to guys who want to stay leaner. That is their choice.
The ONLY thing that was debated was the belief that those who do will gain the same muscle at the same speed as those who just work on size for a while.
Quit distorting the actual discussion and debate.[/quote]
Well, considering that after a few years of natty training, gains come in grams or ounces a month and over bulking doesn’t do much for those gains.
[quote]BrickHead wrote:
[quote]Professor X wrote:
[quote]jskrabac wrote:
Think about it man. You had to start a thread talking about how awesome it is that SOME people are finally talking about staying lean in a god damned BODYBUILDING forum!!! That’s like going to the emergency room and being like, “Hey docs, it’s really cool you all are actually trying to heal people now.”
[/quote]
If this is a bodybuilding forum, why is the actual BUILDING THE MUSCLE PART being downplayed in favor of staying lean all of the time?
Real question.
No one, and I mean no one is talking down to guys who want to stay leaner. That is their choice.
The ONLY thing that was debated was the belief that those who do will gain the same muscle at the same speed as those who just work on size for a while.
Quit distorting the actual discussion and debate.[/quote]
Well, considering that after a few years of natty training, gains come in grams or ounces a month and over bulking doesn’t do much for those gains.
[/quote]
Even assisted you don’t see guys getting much over 10% anymore. The body likes to grow when it’s lean, it’s just more efficient when it is. At least that’s what I believe. But the fastest way to get a lean shredded physique with muscle on it is still bulking up the first year or two of training and then cutting down, almost everyone with an impressive physique has done this.
[quote]myself1992 wrote:
[quote]BrickHead wrote:
[quote]Professor X wrote:
[quote]jskrabac wrote:
Think about it man. You had to start a thread talking about how awesome it is that SOME people are finally talking about staying lean in a god damned BODYBUILDING forum!!! That’s like going to the emergency room and being like, “Hey docs, it’s really cool you all are actually trying to heal people now.”
[/quote]
If this is a bodybuilding forum, why is the actual BUILDING THE MUSCLE PART being downplayed in favor of staying lean all of the time?
Real question.
No one, and I mean no one is talking down to guys who want to stay leaner. That is their choice.
The ONLY thing that was debated was the belief that those who do will gain the same muscle at the same speed as those who just work on size for a while.
Quit distorting the actual discussion and debate.[/quote]
Well, considering that after a few years of natty training, gains come in grams or ounces a month and over bulking doesn’t do much for those gains.
[/quote]
Even assisted you don’t see guys getting much over 10% anymore. The body likes to grow when it’s lean, it’s just more efficient when it is. At least that’s what I believe. But the fastest way to get a lean shredded physique with muscle on it is still bulking up the first year or two of training and then cutting down, almost everyone with an impressive physique has done this.
[/quote]
I agree with ALL of this.
[quote]BrickHead wrote:
Well, considering that after a few years of natty training, gains come in grams or ounces a month and over bulking doesn’t do much for those gains.
[/quote]
You are overgeneralizing to a fault.
Yes, gains may slow down but it is INDIVIDUAL at what stage someone sees a true significant slow down in progress made…which is why you can not make that claim.
Once again, I posted the pics and have for years. If I was just gaining fat, there is no way in hell I would have bulked up like that.
[quote]myself1992 wrote:
Even assisted you don’t see guys getting much over 10% anymore. The body likes to grow when it’s lean, it’s just more efficient when it is. At least that’s what I believe.
[/quote]
It may be what you believe, but that doesn’t equal truth. Everyone has a different level of body comp where they see the most growth.
The mistake is assuming that all people grow best really lean. This is false.
That is why you need to see where your own body grows optimally at instead of assuming what you did based on nothing.
There is no evidence at all that I will grow better at “10%” over “15%”. It is up to my individual results and genetics.
[quote]Professor X wrote:
[quote]myself1992 wrote:
Even assisted you don’t see guys getting much over 10% anymore. The body likes to grow when it’s lean, it’s just more efficient when it is. At least that’s what I believe.
[/quote]
It may be what you believe, but that doesn’t equal truth. Everyone has a different level of body comp where they see the most growth.
The mistake is assuming that all people grow best really lean. This is false.
That is why you need to see where your own body grows optimally at instead of assuming what you did based on nothing.
There is no evidence at all that I will grow better at “10%” over “15%”. It is up to my individual results and genetics.[/quote]
Sure, not EVERYONE. But there is evidence that I grow better at sub 10% than over that, the leaner I get the more my body wants to grow, and not fat, muscle, you’ll see in a few months don’t take my word for it. Instead of seeing how much bigger you get on every bulk, why don’t you see how much leaner, yet heavier, you can get with every cut? Fuck, if you got shredded you could do some damage on an NPC stage.
[quote]myself1992 wrote:
But there is evidence that I grow better at sub 10% than over that[/quote]
If you have evidence of that then train that way.
The PROBLEM is telling everyone that all people will see the same and that everyone should do that…when the truth is, it will hold back progress on those who see more optimal progress at higher body fat percentages.
If someone else grows better at “15%” than “sub 10%” then they will be held back if they try to act like you.
[quote]Professor X wrote:
[quote]jskrabac wrote:
Think about it man. You had to start a thread talking about how awesome it is that SOME people are finally talking about staying lean in a god damned BODYBUILDING forum!!! That’s like going to the emergency room and being like, “Hey docs, it’s really cool you all are actually trying to heal people now.”
[/quote]
If this is a bodybuilding forum, why is the actual BUILDING THE MUSCLE PART being downplayed in favor of staying lean all of the time?
Real question.
No one, and I mean no one is talking down to guys who want to stay leaner. That is their choice.
The ONLY thing that was debated was the belief that those who do will gain the same muscle at the same speed as those who just work on size for a while.
Quit distorting the actual discussion and debate.[/quote]
Please show me where
-
I said people are talking down wanting to stay lean.
-
I endorsed downplaying muscle building.
All aspects of this sport deserve equal weight and attention in a BBing forum…one might even say there needs to be a certain…symmetry…to it… 
…you see what I did there? 
[quote]Professor X wrote:
[quote]BrickHead wrote:
Well, considering that after a few years of natty training, gains come in grams or ounces a month and over bulking doesn’t do much for those gains.
[/quote]
You are overgeneralizing to a fault.
Yes, gains may slow down but it is INDIVIDUAL at what stage someone sees a true significant slow down in progress made…which is why you can not make that claim.
Once again, I posted the pics and have for years. If I was just gaining fat, there is no way in hell I would have bulked up like that.[/quote]
You didn’t gain just fat, but you gained far less muscle than you claim.