Bodybuilders: Non-Functional Mass

Training Bodybuilding
181

People took what I said a bit too seriously. It’s no secret that a fighter at over 200 lean and very strong can dominate in any fight. But Ken Shamrock did get his ass kicked by Royce Gracie in UFC 1, and Ken is a big guy (and has been known for steroid use). Royce Gracie would be lucky if he could bench 185.

If Prof X trained in MMA hard for about a year, he’d be a machine. Once a person learns how to properly use their size/strength while at the same time using technique, they will become a very powerful fighter.

182

[quote]Professor X wrote:
So, everyone who used MAG-10 is now “unnatural”?[/quote]

I didn’t say that and you know it. I made a clear example. All the supplements in the world will not give you the same accelerated gains as roids will. Yes I know, the distance is thinning, and I said that already. But it’s not that thin yet and you can pretty clearly say that the pros are unnatural no matter what you compare it to. There’s a difference between using an assault rifle and driving a tank or consuming caffeine and meth. I’m not interested in playing a word game, it seems that’s what you’re trying to do. If that’s the case then I’ll tell you straight up that I don’t think anyone should tell a person what they can put in their own body. That’s not my issue.

183

[quote]Majin wrote:
Professor X wrote:
So, everyone who used MAG-10 is now “unnatural”?

I didn’t say that and you know it.[/quote]

You didn’t have to. It was implied when you wrote that anything other than protein is unnatural.

[quote]
I made a clear example. All the supplements in the world will not give you the same accelerated gains as roids will.[/quote]

What if I don’t believe you?

[quote]
Yes I know, the distance is thinning, and I said that already. But it’s not that thin yet and you can pretty clearly say that the pros are unnatural no matter what you compare it to. There’s a difference between using an assault rifle and driving a tank or consuming caffeine and meth. I’m not interested in playing a word game, it seems that’s what you’re trying to do. If that’s the case then I’ll tell you straight up that I don’t think anyone should tell a person what they can put in their own body. That’s not my issue.[/quote]

Word games? That’s not what I’m playing. Words are just a means to an end.

184

Time to toss Bruce Lee into the equation…

185

Majin,

I think you are confused.

The roids help you grow. They don’t magically change the nature of muscle. Muscle is muscle… it has fairly well defined characteristics.

Now, if someone is not training for strength, then they won’t be as strong, but it is simply the training, not the fact that they are able to add more muscles due to use of anabolics.

If you simply said something about the fact that people are able to put on and keep more muscle when using steroids, nobody would take exception to that.

However, claiming that various chemicals magically induce strength for short periods of time makes you sound like a complete lunatic.

I believe the issue is that some bodybuilders don’t train specifically for strength attributes, so for their size they are possibly not as strong as they may appear.

As for the rest of the bullshit, super hero fighter wanna be crap, a heavier person will beat a lighter person, assuming equal skill, almost all of the time.

How many times does this have to be pointed out for people to get off their skinny little high horses?

186

[quote]Rockscar wrote:
Would anyone care to lend me a handfull of shit so I can throw it?[/quote]

You could probably just scrape some off the fan. It got fairly gunked up with the stuff just after this thread was started…

187

[quote]Rykker wrote:
Rockscar wrote:
Would anyone care to lend me a handfull of shit so I can throw it?

You could probably just scrape some off the fan. It got fairly gunked up with the stuff just after this thread was started…
[/quote]

I’m printing this out again…

188

[quote]Professor X wrote:
Majin wrote:
Professor X wrote:
So, everyone who used MAG-10 is now “unnatural”?

I didn’t say that and you know it.

You didn’t have to. It was implied when you wrote that anything other than protein is unnatural.[/quote]

I did not say that, I said ‘for the sake of simplicity’ and used that divide to illustrate a different point.

[quote]Professor X wrote:
Majin wrote:
I made a clear example. All the supplements in the world will not give you the same accelerated gains as roids will.

What if I don’t believe you?[/quote]

You don’t have to, just look at all the pro-bodybuilders and then at ones who don’t use roids. Or then, according to your question, what fools the pros must be to endanger their bodies instead of just using supplements.

[quote]Professor X wrote:
Word games? That’s not what I’m playing. Words are just a means to an end.[/quote]

Look, I know you’re fond of Ronnie and you follow pro-bodybuilding. But you gotta take it with a grain of salt. Damn, it’s not just ‘a recent image problem’ with pro-bodybuilding, as you put it. They’re using tons of drugs that are responsible for not only a huge part of their gains, but also the speed at which they aquire these gains. These guys are disciplined and work hard, but they still get where they are with magic bullets.

I don’t get it, if you like something then why are you ashamed of embracing it for what it is? You like anabolic monsters? Good for you, but don’t deny what they are. Don’t glorify their other characteristics just to protect their image. Because they could have been the same great guys with cool personalities and dedicated approach to training, but if it weren’t for roids you wouldn’t even know most of their names.

Not once has anyone been cool enough about it to say - ‘Hey, there could be glowing neon-green liquid dripping from their ears but I just like watching these huge bastards, it gives me motivation.’

189

[quote]vroom wrote:
If you simply said something about the fact that people are able to put on and keep more muscle when using steroids, nobody would take exception to that.[/quote]

That IS what I said. Maybe it came off sounding the wrong way. If so I appologize. But I was mentioning the notion that on steroids you are able to gain more size without strength than without steroids. Not that that’s what every single steroid user is doing but that it is possible and it is common. If you lift heavy you’ll be strong, roids or not, I have no illusions with that.

[quote]vroom wrote:
However, claiming that various chemicals magically induce strength for short periods of time makes you sound like a complete lunatic.[/quote]

I’ve heard juiced guys say that since their injection coinsided with the same day as the workout they felt an extra surge of strength. Perhaps they didn’t know what they were talking about. But there’s no denial that steroids improve strength. Everyone I talked to who’s juiced says that your strength goes up significantly and pretty fast.

190

Sure, because the muscles are undergoing incredible amounts of anabolic activity… but doesn’t this counter your claim that they put on lots of muscle without strength?

Which is it?

191

[quote]vroom wrote:
Everyone I talked to who’s juiced says that your strength goes up significantly and pretty fast.

Sure, because the muscles are undergoing incredible amounts of anabolic activity… but doesn’t this counter your claim that they put on lots of muscle without strength?

Which is it?[/quote]

They COULD do it, not that they are necessarily all doing it. They could have their strength go up with AAS but instead work with lighter weights and gain alot more size than strength. Like when they have period of high rep work.

192

[quote]Majin wrote:
vroom wrote:
Everyone I talked to who’s juiced says that your strength goes up significantly and pretty fast.

Sure, because the muscles are undergoing incredible amounts of anabolic activity… but doesn’t this counter your claim that they put on lots of muscle without strength?

Which is it?

They COULD do it, not that they are necessarily all doing it. They could have their strength go up like crazy but instead work with lighter weights and gain alot more size than strength. Like when they have period of high rep work.
[/quote]

The thing is that most of them that I have seen don’t workout like this. I’ve never seen a bodybuilder doing 3 sets of 15 and thats all they do. Anyone who knows ANYTHING about lifting knows that the stronger ya are the bigger you can get.

193

[quote]K-Narf wrote:
Majin wrote:
vroom wrote:
Everyone I talked to who’s juiced says that your strength goes up significantly and pretty fast.

Sure, because the muscles are undergoing incredible amounts of anabolic activity… but doesn’t this counter your claim that they put on lots of muscle without strength?

Which is it?

They COULD do it, not that they are necessarily all doing it. They could have their strength go up like crazy but instead work with lighter weights and gain alot more size than strength. Like when they have period of high rep work.

The thing is that most of them that I have seen don’t workout like this. I’ve never seen a bodybuilder doing 3 sets of 15 and thats all they do. Anyone who knows ANYTHING about lifting knows that the stronger ya are the bigger you can get.

[/quote]

I don’t see how that contradicts with what I’ve said. Sometimes they lift heavy and sometimes they lift light, it’s simple routine variation. I illustrated what they can do for a period of time, not what they are doing ALL the time.

194

[quote]michael2507 wrote:
Time to toss Bruce Lee into the equation…[/quote]

I just had to say Thank You for that one. Nice timing.

195

[quote]Rockscar wrote:
Rykker wrote:
Rockscar wrote:
Would anyone care to lend me a handfull of shit so I can throw it?

You could probably just scrape some off the fan. It got fairly gunked up with the stuff just after this thread was started…

I’m printing this out again…[/quote]

Sorry. Got caught-up in the stupidity… won’t happen again.

196

[quote]Kliplemet wrote:
only matt furey disciples, pilates practitioners,woble board trainers and swiss ball huggers have functional strength.

seriously though, i think this hits the nail on the head:
Mohammed F. El-Hewie wrote:
Healthy strength is a balance between: mobility, stability, coordination, flexibility, and agility. If you develop strength like a bodybuilder you jeopardize 4 out 5 elements of healthy strength: less mobility, poor coordination, poor flexibility, and diminished agility. If you develop strength like a powerlifter, you jeopardize 5 out 5 elements of healthy strength.

Powerlifters develop awesome groups of muscles that incur serous joints imbalance and put the person in compromising situation of injuries. If you develop the strength of a wrestler you only compromise the stability element, since wrestlers have to concentrate on agility. Free-style weightlifting would be you best bid for long healthy strength.
think about it, it makes perfect sense.[/quote]

the squat, bench press, and deadlift are now counter-productive exersizes for athletes?

for years now I’ve been working under the assumption that squatting, benching, deadlifting, and some sort of row type exersize (chinups, pullups, and the like) should be the corner stones of almost every athletes workouts…

man have I been dupped!

thanks for enlightening me.

197

Yeah that makes no sense. Westside for Skinny Bastards is one of the best programs for athletes (in my opinions) and it is modified from powerlifting workouts. The main difference is there is more unilateral work, which is obviously important for athletics.

By the way, the guy who talked about track and field made a very good point. Sure, an elite sprinter would kick an elite miler’s ass any day of the week in the 100m. But an elite miler would smoke a “decent” or even “good” sprinter in the 100m. Sure, an elite powerlifter will probably be able to bench more than an elite bodybuilder, but I can guarantee you that an elite bodybuilder would trash a “decent” or even “good” powerlifter.

198

body builder or not, the only “functional” muscle i need is my trigger finger. wait a minute. it’s still bodybuilding. it’s a compound exercise, curl and press. CURL my finger, and PRESS the trigger. power lift your way outta that shit. bitches