[quote]CaliforniaLaw wrote:
mmafan wrote: Penn’s S and C coaches should promptly be fired. If you compare penn’s strength training to gsp’s it’s pathetically obvious who is doing the right kind of training.
How do you know?
What if Penn doesn’t have the joints for heavy lifting?
What if Penn hurt his back or tore his knee doing heavy lifting? If you train heavy, injuries are inevitable. Show me anyone who has “go heavy” for years and who hasn’t been sidelined with an injury. You can’t.
You do know that many training injuries that sideline fighters happen in the weight room, right?
And, of course, Sean Sherk got his ass handed to him by Penn.
According to your logic, Sherk should have won. Some “logic.”
If Penn loses, it will be because he should not have jumped into a higher weight class. Penn is not a natural welterweight. He’s a natural light weight. That will be the biggest difference in this fight.[/quote]
I didn’t say anywhere that you have to be strong or train right to win fights. All I said is Penn could get a much better S and C coach. Penn has never been good because he has been strong or explosive, he is just such a technical fighter. I think a solid S and C coach could really help BJ out where he is lacking though.
[quote]CaliforniaLaw wrote:
Andyyboy wrote:CaliforniaLaw: How does machine shoulder presses in any way improve your fighting skill level?
Why do you think a fighter lifts weights to improve his “fight skill level”? Fighting isn’t like Dungeons and Dragons, where you need to up your strength attribute.
Many lift simply to strengthen bones and ligaments. Some do it as a way to get a workout in when they are otherwise not up to a skills-training session. There are many reasons.
Fact is, BJ Penn is a champ and has hung with the best. The presumption should be that we have something to learn from him.
Answer me this: Why did Sherk lose to BJ Penn?
[/quote]
Obviously because Penn is the superior fighter. Nobody is saying the fighters that can lift the most weights are the best, just that penn’s strength training is far from optimal.
[quote]Andyyboy wrote:
CaliforniaLaw: How does machine shoulder presses in any way improve your fighting skill level? No mobility, just straight pushing. Do you ever replicate that movement in a match? Why not to military presses, pushpresses etc instead?
Thats the first thing that came to mind watching my video and i automatically judged his coach as a total idiot.[/quote]
I’ll tell you right here and now. As an actual fighter, who spars and trains balls to the wall every single day, full body movements like military presses and push presses or even clean and jerks cannot always be utilised and aren’t always the best choice. That’s just one of many reasons, and CaliLaw rebuts most of the presumptions in this thread pretty well.
I really would like some guys here to train like these guys do and then go ahead with all their “T-man” deadlift/squat/clean and jerk training 4-5 days a week to actually build muscle.
If you have ever seen any of his other S and C
videos as he gets closer to the fight
you’ll see him do different shit.
he posts most of it on his site
and plenty of others too.
ladder agility drills, sprints
big runs ,med ball stuff, tire drags, flips,
and sledgehammer crap.
Youll see him sport a weighted vest too.
heart rate monitor blah blah blah.
Who the fuck cares what he does in the weight room.
Im not a pro fighter.
But I have gone further with wrestling than most of you have or can.
If you are paying for lessons classes or the bulk of your own training, transport or equipment you have not went that far. not to be a jerk but Think about that.
Ill say what the others here always say.
from xen to c-law nikkos just said it.
you cant lift and train the way you think you can.
weights 3 hours a week is probably pushing it.
watch him hit the focus mitts.
watch him roll, and spar
far far more telling then then his bench.
and california Law love, hate him, feel a little sting from him has kind of nullified most of the
comments here in a way that I have to agree with.
[quote]CaliforniaLaw wrote:
ZeusNathan wrote: i concur that bj’s coaches are idiots…
What makes you qualified to make that statement?
Have you trained BJ Penn? Do you know his training history? His injury history? Do you know how heavy lifting affects his ability to train other areas of his game?
How many UFC champions have you trained?
How many UFC champions have your favorite S&C “gurus” trained?
Why do you think you know so much more than BJ Penn’s coaches?[/quote]
shut the fuck up you politically correct mofo
a sophomore in high school can coach bj and he’ll will still kick ass.
which is the point you obviously missed you damn butt mongrel
[quote]Nikiforos wrote:
Andyyboy wrote:
CaliforniaLaw: How does machine shoulder presses in any way improve your fighting skill level? No mobility, just straight pushing. Do you ever replicate that movement in a match? Why not to military presses, pushpresses etc instead?
Thats the first thing that came to mind watching my video and i automatically judged his coach as a total idiot.
I’ll tell you right here and now. As an actual fighter, who spars and trains balls to the wall every single day, full body movements like military presses and push presses or even clean and jerks cannot always be utilised and aren’t always the best choice. That’s just one of many reasons, and CaliLaw rebuts most of the presumptions in this thread pretty well.
I really would like some guys here to train like these guys do and then go ahead with all their “T-man” deadlift/squat/clean and jerk training 4-5 days a week to actually build muscle.[/quote]
Well, as a fighter your not really intrested in building muscle are you? You would most likely be intrested in building strength. I do my cleans, snatches, deads and jerks, but if your actually lifting 5 times a week next to sparring 7 days a week id have to say your coach is retarded as well. Unless your in off season ofcourse.
[quote]CaliforniaLaw wrote:
Andyyboy wrote:CaliforniaLaw: How does machine shoulder presses in any way improve your fighting skill level?
Why do you think a fighter lifts weights to improve his “fight skill level”? Fighting isn’t like Dungeons and Dragons, where you need to up your strength attribute.
Many lift simply to strengthen bones and ligaments. Some do it as a way to get a workout in when they are otherwise not up to a skills-training session. There are many reasons.
Fact is, BJ Penn is a champ and has hung with the best. The presumption should be that we have something to learn from him.
Answer me this: Why did Sherk lose to BJ Penn?
[/quote]
Well, i’m guessing they do it for the same reason as us wrestlers, to get stronger. What’s dungeons and dragons? Sound like a bad bruce lee movie.
Because sherk lacks talent, but he has “heart”. BJ got talent, but lacks the proper weight training, but he still is a champion. I wrestle with peple who never lift and they can still be strong as fuck, but you know they would be even stronger with a proper lifting program?
So he was training his bones and ligaments, huh? ok.
Well, looks like SC is one of several things that didn’t work for BJ in this fight. He looked gassed after one round, as per usual. Fortunately he and his camp have plenty of excuses to fall back on in true Penn style. I’m glad he lost.
