[quote]Iron Dwarf wrote:
One of the things I despise about our culture is that everything has to have a fucking label. People can’t deal with anything other than black & white.
It’s so easy to be an armchair expert on any subject as long as it’s labeled for convenience. Short guys get accused of having “Napoleon Complex”.
Ambitious women get tagged with “Penis Envy”, and so forth. Usually there’s some sort of blame, or dysfunction attached to the label.
The media loves it and so do the idiot average Americans.
[/quote]
Not only does everything have to have a label, but everything has to be a problem or a sickness. Addicted to food? - Like anyone could give up eating the way someone can give up drugs… But that is how stupid it is. There are few things left that are not yet considered problems - I guess next is addicted to breathing.
Agree with the comments about everything needing a label now. It also often means that people are never at fault, because they have a condition that ‘makes’ them do it.
Why are bodybuilders said to have bigorexia, but olympic sprinters aren’t said to have fastorexia. Longjumpers don’t have jumporexia.
[quote]Professor X wrote:
angus_beef wrote:
If there’s anyone out there who believes in anorexia and don’t believe in bigorexia, then you are simply a hypocrite. The guy has 19 inch arms yet still he thinks he’s “skinny”, this is definitely psychological.
Thats like a girl with every single rib visible yet still she thinks she’s fat. This guy is easily over 200lbs and he’s definitely not tall from what i can see. I doubt anyone on here who is under 5 10" and over 200 lbs sees themselves as skinny.
You may not consider yourself big and you may still want to make gains and improvement, but i doubt you see yourself as “skinny”. If you do then you need help also.
That guy also wants to be on tv. [/quote]
Maybe so, but i was just addressing the fact that the condition is real. From the comments on this thread it seems like alot of the guys were taking this personal, as though it was directed towards them or targeted at all bodybuilders. I believe thats why a comparison to all sports is being made in an attempt to justify the “label” argument.
[quote]angus_beef wrote:
Professor X wrote:
angus_beef wrote:
If there’s anyone out there who believes in anorexia and don’t believe in bigorexia, then you are simply a hypocrite. The guy has 19 inch arms yet still he thinks he’s “skinny”, this is definitely psychological.
Thats like a girl with every single rib visible yet still she thinks she’s fat. This guy is easily over 200lbs and he’s definitely not tall from what i can see. I doubt anyone on here who is under 5 10" and over 200 lbs sees themselves as skinny.
You may not consider yourself big and you may still want to make gains and improvement, but i doubt you see yourself as “skinny”. If you do then you need help also.
That guy also wants to be on tv.
Maybe so, but i was just addressing the fact that the condition is real. From the comments on this thread it seems like alot of the guys were taking this personal, as though it was directed towards them or targeted at all bodybuilders. I believe thats why a comparison to all sports is being made in an attempt to justify the “label” argument.
[/quote]
It IS directed at bodybuilders. Let me explain something to you, if YOU at your present weight gained 50lbs of solid muscle by this time next year, do you think your self image would match every single pound gained or do you think that self image was ingrained at a much earlier age making mental perception a lagging phenomena in anyone who experiences large physical change?
The person who gets plastic surgery will not walk out of the hospital seeing themselves as the new person immediately. It will take time, maybe years, for them to adapt to the new situation…yet for some reason as it concerns bodybuilding, this is left out of every single discussion in favor of rushing to an “insane” conclusion.
[quote]angus_beef wrote:
If there’s anyone out there who believes in anorexia and don’t believe in bigorexia, then you are simply a hypocrite. The guy has 19 inch arms yet still he thinks he’s “skinny”, this is definitely psychological.
Thats like a girl with every single rib visible yet still she thinks she’s fat. This guy is easily over 200lbs and he’s definitely not tall from what i can see. I doubt anyone on here who is under 5 10" and over 200 lbs sees themselves as skinny.
You may not consider yourself big and you may still want to make gains and improvement, but i doubt you see yourself as “skinny”. If you do then you need help also.[/quote]
This guy obviously has a problem. In my case, just because I want to be bigger doesn’t mean I think I’m abnormal (too small). I’m motivated to excel, to get bigger, but I don’t have “bigorexia”.
The problem with discovering people who think like this guy is that everyone who wants to get bigger is then accused of having this disorder. My wife thinks I suffer from bigorexia, but I don’t–I know I’m bigger than most, and I want to get even bigger.
I’m a bodybuilder if you want to label it. Don’t tell me I have a disorder just because I’m motivated to add more size than a normal person.
I love how fat, lazy, insecure assholes try and turn dedication into a disease. I know, im bigger/stronger than you, I have to have issues!! So many people dont have the mental capacity or the physical fortitude to last in what we put ourselves through for years.
The ART of bodybuilding is a 24/7 job, and i know that a vast majority of people cant “handle” it, but its not them i pity, its those who get so damn defensive and try to turn it around like WE are the mentally unbalanced ones.
You’re right, i am an insecure, mentally unbalanced perfectionist that outclasses you physically in every aspect, Boo hoo, inc a tissue.
[quote]Professor X wrote:
angus_beef wrote:
Professor X wrote:
angus_beef wrote:
If there’s anyone out there who believes in anorexia and don’t believe in bigorexia, then you are simply a hypocrite. The guy has 19 inch arms yet still he thinks he’s “skinny”, this is definitely psychological.
Thats like a girl with every single rib visible yet still she thinks she’s fat. This guy is easily over 200lbs and he’s definitely not tall from what i can see. I doubt anyone on here who is under 5 10" and over 200 lbs sees themselves as skinny.
You may not consider yourself big and you may still want to make gains and improvement, but i doubt you see yourself as “skinny”. If you do then you need help also.
That guy also wants to be on tv.
Maybe so, but i was just addressing the fact that the condition is real. From the comments on this thread it seems like alot of the guys were taking this personal, as though it was directed towards them or targeted at all bodybuilders. I believe thats why a comparison to all sports is being made in an attempt to justify the “label” argument.
It IS directed at bodybuilders. Let me explain something to you, if YOU at your present weight gained 50lbs of solid muscle by this time next year, do you think your self image would match every single pound gained or do you think that self image was ingrained at a much earlier age making mental perception a lagging phenomena in anyone who experiences large physical change?
The person who gets plastic surgery will not walk out of the hospital seeing themselves as the new person immediately. It will take time, maybe years, for them to adapt to the new situation…yet for some reason as it concerns bodybuilding, this is left out of every single discussion in favor of rushing to an “insane” conclusion.[/quote]
Correct, others often see you better than you see yourself. And that is ingrained at an early age especially if you were small or skinny growing up( at least from what i have observed)
[quote]davidcox1 wrote:
angus_beef wrote:
If there’s anyone out there who believes in anorexia and don’t believe in bigorexia, then you are simply a hypocrite. The guy has 19 inch arms yet still he thinks he’s “skinny”, this is definitely psychological.
Thats like a girl with every single rib visible yet still she thinks she’s fat. This guy is easily over 200lbs and he’s definitely not tall from what i can see. I doubt anyone on here who is under 5 10" and over 200 lbs sees themselves as skinny.
You may not consider yourself big and you may still want to make gains and improvement, but i doubt you see yourself as “skinny”. If you do then you need help also.
This guy obviously has a problem. In my case, just because I want to be bigger doesn’t mean I think I’m abnormal (too small). I’m motivated to excel, to get bigger, but I don’t have “bigorexia”. The problem with discovering people who think like this guy is that everyone who wants to get bigger is then accused of having this disorder.
My wife thinks I suffer from bigorexia, but I don’t–I know I’m bigger than most, and I want to get even bigger. I’m a bodybuilder if you want to label it. Don’t tell me I have a disorder just because I’m motivated to add more size than a normal person.[/quote]
Thats what i’m trying to point out. This guy does have a problem. We all want to get bigger. We may see ourselves as too small, but thats only in relation to where we want to be/our ultimate goal. When we reach that goal we may decide to kept pushing our selves. That doesn’t mean we have bigorexia.
But if at 200 lbs and 19 inch arms you see yourself as “skinny” something is definitely wrong with you. You might be smaller than you want to be, but in no way are you “skinny”.
This documentary seemed to be focused on this one guy in particular, not everyone who wants to be bigger. So lighten up, no one here has bigorexia but the disorder is real.
[quote]Professor X wrote:
angus_beef wrote:
Professor X wrote:
angus_beef wrote:
If there’s anyone out there who believes in anorexia and don’t believe in bigorexia, then you are simply a hypocrite. The guy has 19 inch arms yet still he thinks he’s “skinny”, this is definitely psychological.
Thats like a girl with every single rib visible yet still she thinks she’s fat. This guy is easily over 200lbs and he’s definitely not tall from what i can see. I doubt anyone on here who is under 5 10" and over 200 lbs sees themselves as skinny. You may not consider yourself big and you may still want to make gains and improvement, but i doubt you see yourself as “skinny”. If you do then you need help also.
That guy also wants to be on tv.
Maybe so, but i was just addressing the fact that the condition is real. From the comments on this thread it seems like alot of the guys were taking this personal, as though it was directed towards them or targeted at all bodybuilders. I believe thats why a comparison to all sports is being made in an attempt to justify the “label” argument.
It IS directed at bodybuilders. Let me explain something to you, if YOU at your present weight gained 50lbs of solid muscle by this time next year, do you think your self image would match every single pound gained or do you think that self image was ingrained at a much earlier age making mental perception a lagging phenomena in anyone who experiences large physical change?
The person who gets plastic surgery will not walk out of the hospital seeing themselves as the new person immediately. It will take time, maybe years, for them to adapt to the new situation…yet for some reason as it concerns bodybuilding, this is left out of every single discussion in favor of rushing to an “insane” conclusion.[/quote]
It’s wayyy deeper than that. Obviously individuals won’t see subtle changes in their bodies because we see ourselves everyday. But conditions like anorexia and bigorexia are extreme cases. If a 75lb mature female with visible bones thinks she is fat, do you think something is psychologically wrong?
Angus, you are wrong about this for one very simple reason. Every person who is actually passionate about bodybuilding and wants to exceed in competition compares themselves to the pro’s. When compared to them, we ARE small.
[quote]Iron Dwarf wrote:
One of the things I despise about our culture is that everything has to have a fucking label. People can’t deal with anything other than black & white. It’s so easy to be an armchair expert on any subject as long as it’s labeled for convenience.
Short guys get accused of having “Napoleon Complex”. Ambitious women get tagged with “Penis Envy”, and so forth. Usually there’s some sort of blame, or dysfunction attached to the label.
The media loves it and so do the idiot average Americans.
[/quote]
It’s because this country is obsessed with statistics.
Have you ever watched 2 Minute Drill on ESPN? The bonus questions were things like:
“What is high school nickname of Michael Vick’s junior prom date?”
“How many Tuesdays have NFL quarterbacks broken records?”
Really obscure, mindless shit…but guess what? The stat obviously exists.
It makes sense that most people on this site get defensive when this subject is broached, and while I will admit that oftentimes the information regarding it is a little silly, I think this clip gave the subject a pretty fair shake (could’ve been better at times, admittedly).
Ken doesn’t seem like a guy who trains for love of the game or because of any sort of passion… he comes off as someone who does it because he feels compelled to (he describes it as being similar to a compulsive gambler).
Most people in this thread are missing the point in regards to this “disorder” as it relates to Ken. With him, it appears that it isn’t about simply wanting to be bigger or stronger and “enjoying the ride”, so to speak.
It seems like he is attempting to build his body to some unrealistic standard of perfection and that he can’t gain any measure of satisfaction or sense of accomplishment in what he does until that is achieved.
If you judge your self-worth by how big your muscles are and can’t derive any satisfaction from your efforts in the gym because you have a compulsion to achieve some unrealistic image of how you SHOULD look in order to feel adequate, you DO have a problem.
Most people on this site lift weights because they enjoy the process - they like getting to the gym, hitting PR’s, seeing the scale move up and even the lifestyle appeals to them… they find enjoyment and a sense of satisfaction in the process.
This video seemed to suggest that some people do all that not because they WANT to, but because they feel they HAVE to, and that they can’t derive any sort of pleasure or sense of accomplishment in their efforts, because they constantly feel inadequate despite their achievements.
When the subject of the video likens his situation to a gambling addiction and says he sometimes wishes he could just be normal, you shouldn’t attempt to write off what he is experiencing just because you feel it may reflect on you in some way. Of course, a 4:30 clip really doesn’t tell enough about him to say much with certainty.
It IS directed at bodybuilders. Let me explain something to you, if YOU at your present weight gained 50lbs of solid muscle by this time next year, do you think your self image would match every single pound gained or do you think that self image was ingrained at a much earlier age making mental perception a lagging phenomena in anyone who experiences large physical change?
The person who gets plastic surgery will not walk out of the hospital seeing themselves as the new person immediately. It will take time, maybe years, for them to adapt to the new situation…yet for some reason as it concerns bodybuilding, this is left out of every single discussion in favor of rushing to an “insane” conclusion.[/quote]
everything is a mental disorder to them… if you are anything other than perfectly complacent toward your physical appearance, they have a label for it and a pill for it
In my opinion it becomes offensive when a video like this one is made:
When it pegs people that just want to improve themselves as ALL having “muscle dysmorphia”, and then a fat sloppy dude in an armchair can sit and talk about how low their self esteem is.
Body Dysmorphia is not just wanting to improve, just as being happy doesn’t make you manic, dieting doesn’t mean you’re anorexic and being sad doesn’t mean that you have clinical depression. The extreme form of the behavior is the problem and when it interferes significant;y with your ability to function, and causes you emotional distress…that is where it starts to become more of a disorder than simply a choice.
People that suffer from mental disorders are often stuck in behaviors that make their lives a living hell.
[quote]amphibian wrote:
Body Dysmorphia is not just wanting to improve, just as being happy doesn’t make you manic, dieting doesn’t mean you’re anorexic and being sad doesn’t mean that you have clinical depression. The extreme form of the behavior is the problem and when it interferes significant;y with your ability to function, and causes you emotional distress…that is where it starts to become more of a disorder than simply a choice.
People that suffer from mental disorders are often stuck in behaviors that make their lives a living hell.
[/quote]
The debate here is not whether mental disorders EXIST. The argument here is that because they are so freely throwing this label around to anyone who takes this beyond what the average person does, anyone with any real size on them gets labeled as the same by LAY PEOPLE.
The average person on the street is not waiting on some psychologist to diagnose someone with something. They will simply throw this at anyone who makes them feel inferior or anyone who takes this to an extreme level.
NO, the bodybuilder who simply wants to get bigger and trains his ass off because he feels he is far from the mark is NOT bigorexic and that is the discussion.
No one will know whether the guy in that video actually has it BECAUSE THAT IS TV. They wouldn’t have a fucking show if they simply had some well built guy who claimed he loved it and that guy could simply be saying that to be on tv.
Ask any of the people who have been on the MTV Real World whether the producers manipulate their actions and cut/splice scenes to make a better show.
[quote]waylanderxx wrote:
Angus, you are wrong about this for one very simple reason. Every person who is actually passionate about bodybuilding and wants to exceed in competition compares themselves to the pro’s. When compared to them, we ARE small.[/quote]
You’re assuming that most top end professional bodybuilders have healthy mind sets. Even guys like Ronnie Coleman who have BMI’s in the 40’s are constantly trying to get bigger no matter the cost. If the trend continued to where the pros weighed 400 pounds at 5% body fat, do you think those guys would be that much more dedicated? Or do you think there would be an underlying mental image problem?
Bigger is not always better. That should make sense to anyone.
The debate here is not whether mental disorders EXIST. The argument here is that because they are so freely throwing this label around to anyone who takes this beyond what the average person does, anyone with any real size on them gets labeled as the same by LAY PEOPLE.
The average person on the street is not waiting on some psychologist to diagnose someone with something. They will simply throw this at anyone who makes them feel inferior or anyone who takes this to an extreme level.
NO, the bodybuilder who simply wants to get bigger and trains his ass off because he feels he is far from the mark is NOT bigorexic and that is the discussion.
No one will know whether the guy in that video actually has it BECAUSE THAT IS TV. They wouldn’t have a fucking show if they simply had some well built guy who claimed he loved it and that guy could simply be saying that to be on tv.
Ask any of the people who have been on the MTV Real World whether the producers manipulate their actions and cut/splice scenes to make a better show.[/quote]
Bottom line: If you’re not happy with yourself when you working hard and eating right, you have a problem. What’s the point of work if you’re not happy while working or at least afterword?
