Bigger, stronger, leaner.

Training
141

[quote]zraw wrote:

[quote]usmccds423 wrote:
zraw, are you like 5 years old dude, let it go, fuck. There is a whole thread dedicated to this garbage. Do you think we need to fuck up every single thread???[/quote]

Im just waiting for the bodybuilding forum to be clean my man

As far as I’m concerned I just asked a question which I can ask again

What is the difference between a young kid thats 165lbs and wants to be 155with abs and a guy that is going for “full house” look

Why should one be “ridiculised” while the other one shouldnt if bodybuilding is about “transforming” your body to something that you like[/quote]

Maybe neither should be ridiculed but, I will say that one takes years of commitment and consistency to training and eating. Where as I was 150 lbs with abs as a young teen with almost no lifting.

142

[quote]zraw wrote:

[quote]Christian Thibaudeau wrote:

[quote]super saiyan wrote:

[quote]Christian Thibaudeau wrote:

[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]LankyMofo wrote:

I honestly don’t see that on this forum at all. [/quote]

Funny, I see it almost daily.

We are literally have arguments because some of us don’t compete and don’t care about being contest level lean. There are arguments about how your gains don’t matter or can not be quantified unless in contest shape…and arguments about how hugely built people are so fat that their advice doesn’t matter.

If you are missing all of this, it is because you are not paying attention…or are biased about where it is coming from.[/quote]

PX have you noticed if it is more frequent recently? I know the competitive season is near for many of these people, there might be a correlation to be found.[/quote]

CT, you can’t honestly tell me that PX has no part in this. You can pick many threads, but these two recent ones are classic Profesor X behavior.

http://128.121.26.57/free_online_forum/sports_body_training_performance_bodybuilding/question_about_prefatiguing?id=5517813&pageNo=0

http://128.121.26.57/free_online_forum/sports_body_training_performance_bodybuilding/think_your_big_but_just_fat?id=5545581&pageNo=0

In the second thread PX goes on to complain about how we used to have “real” discussions around here. Then someone linked a thread from SIX years ago discussing the same topic.

The first couple of pages revealed the same Professor X trying to make people feel stupid and acting like he’s an all-knowing authority because he’s a dentist.

[quote]Professor X wrote:
I hope what you just wrote doesn’t make sense to even you.[/quote]

[quote]Professor X wrote:
Thank you for that. I have “doctor” in front of my name but there is always basic shit about biology that I missed. I shall credit that for my weight gain.[/quote]

[quote]Professor X wrote:
I could say that this is one more reason why you should not limit your thinking. You can make huge assumptions when you do. I am a DMD, the type who uses a scalpel and sutures on an almost daily basis.[/quote]

Professor X tries to act innocent but he can’t hide from the 50,000 posts that are in black and white for all to see.

So please, let’s keep it real if we are going to hash this out again. The truth is that PX is unable to have discussions like an adult with people who disagree with him. Even long-time, respected members have pointed this out to him to no avail.[/quote]

I am SO not getting into this… this is a forum to talk about training to get stronger, bigger and leaner… that’s where I’ll stop :)[/quote]

YOu asking PX if he saw a change lately in how “competitve” bodybuilders acted towards him/the forum recently was kinda getting into this though… not that I want you to get into this but just know how it probably was perceived… which was you agreeing with X[/quote]

I really didn’t want to imply this

143

[quote]Christian Thibaudeau wrote:

[quote]super saiyan wrote:

[quote]Christian Thibaudeau wrote:

[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]LankyMofo wrote:

[/quote].[/quote]
.[/quote]
[/quote]

I am SO not getting into this… this is a forum to talk about training to get stronger, bigger and leaner… that’s where I’ll stop :)[/quote]
I really hope people read what Christian wrote here.
Surely this is what we all want.

144

Dexter Jackson has always looked the same??? Negative lanky mofo! I have followed Dexter Jackson for years. His body has changed alot since his younger days.{as would anybody who has trained for as long as he has} The “blade” went on a size kick trying to keep up with some of the new mass monsters out there.{and cashed in with a MR.O title, but leaner and meaner was the old Dexter} How long have you followed bodybuilding? I am guessing…not for very long?

145

[quote]bambam1978 wrote:
Dexter Jackson has always looked the same??? Negative lanky mofo! I have followed Dexter Jackson for years. His body has changed alot since his younger days.{as would anybody who has trained for as long as he has} The “blade” went on a size kick trying to keep up with some of the new mass monsters out there.{and cashed in with a MR.O title, but leaner and meaner was the old Dexter} How long have you followed bodybuilding? I am guessing…not for very long?[/quote]

Exactly.

Bottom line, let’s keep the discussions here more grounded than what has been seen lately on this forum.

Acting like Dexter Jackson stagnated for years is a little insulting.

146

[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]bambam1978 wrote:
Dexter Jackson has always looked the same??? Negative lanky mofo! I have followed Dexter Jackson for years. His body has changed alot since his younger days.{as would anybody who has trained for as long as he has} The “blade” went on a size kick trying to keep up with some of the new mass monsters out there.{and cashed in with a MR.O title, but leaner and meaner was the old Dexter} How long have you followed bodybuilding? I am guessing…not for very long?[/quote][/quote]

ok.

[quote]
Exactly.

Bottom line, let’s keep the discussions here more grounded than what has been seen lately on this forum.

Acting like Dexter Jackson stagnated for years is a little insulting.[/quote]

ok.

147

dexter jackson does not just “look the same” every competition that is what someone with no knowledge of what they are looking at would say

he clearly looked amazing in the Master O in comparison to some of those prior, and was then a bit bigger and slightly leas lean in the AC (against the big Cedric, who has problems with condition, so Dexter let his slide slightly to focus on a bit more size to compete with Ced, who was thought of as his main competition pre-show by most).

this is just his two most recent shows im not going through his whole career.

these guys are always trying to improve, how exactly is dexter going to look dramatically different comp to comp after 20+ years maxing everything out?

of course the differences will be more subtle for experienced elite guys.

148

theres about 10-15 people who should just put X on ignore or shut the fuck up

it is boring for other people to read all this shit all the time

zraw starts a thread about ignoring him, then says he can’t post in the BB forum, when a new forum is created he comes in just to argue again!! i thought he was on ignore for fucks sake you made a thread about it lol

and i have no real preference between either poster both post good stuff but it is genuinely annoying to read so much childish shit

it has seemingly caused gregron to have some kind of mental breakdown and quit the internet, lets just all get along!

149

[quote]LankyMofo wrote:

[quote]Christian Thibaudeau wrote:

[quote]detazathoth wrote:

[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]The Mighty Stu wrote:

[quote]Professor X wrote:
I have noticed this with many people, even Stu. Lately, it is like you have a clique that only wants the competitors to ever speak on anything.
[/quote]

I initially called you on your overall egotistical attitude, and I still stand by that.
[/quote]

That’s the point…this forum is about getting huge, strong and in good shape.

It is NOT about my ego or anyone else’s.

Please take those issues to the Get a Life forum.

thank you.[/quote]

I’m assuming good shape in this forum is being right at or under a 40 inch waist.
[/quote]

I competed in bodybuilding, I competed in olympic lifting and trained for powerlifting. I trained with strongman competitors, have trained pro hockey players and pro football players (among other athletes). I also trained many high level bodybuilders, including a few pros, 3 of who made the Olympia at some point. I will tell you that except for a few exceptions, the bodybuilders I train didn’t train harder than the other guys. But they bragged about it more. I’ve never seen a strongman competitor (including Canada’s strongest man), powerlifter or pro athlete brag about how “hardcore” hey were and how the other guys sucked. When you are secure you do not need to do that. And in my mind, if you have to say that you are something… then you aren’t.

And while I love all strength sports and respect the achievement of everybody, I always hated the bodybuilding milieu because it is the most elitist of them all. Powerlifters or strongmen competitors do not make fun of people who do not plan on competing in their sport. And they know that someone can decide not to pursue an actual competitive “career” and train harder than many competitors.

Only in bodybuilding d we see that … maybe because bodybuilding attracts insecure people… maybe it’s because it attracts extreme personalities. I don’t know, but it always turned me off, even if I was involved in it and respect the achievement of the guys who compete.[/quote]

I honestly don’t see that on this forum at all. All of the people who compete on this board seem to recognize that it’s not for everyone.

The only instance I can think of that you MAY be referring to is zraw saying some of the “full house” guys are fat…he’s not saying they should be competing (most of them were powerlifters, anyway), he’s just saying they’re not at a level of leanness that he desires. I don’t think he’s saying people have to get competitively lean, but walking around at 25% for your entire lifting career and calling yourself a bodybuilder ain’t gonna cut it, either.

FTR, I don’t think they’re fat, I’d love to have that look if I could build enough muscle and I’ve never gotten really lean, either. So I don’t have a dog in this fight.
[/quote]

I agree, while other places there may be competitive bbers that brag etc like CT states, I really haven’t seen it either on this forum. Guys like Stu, Myosin, timmmcbride and swolle and others give some of the best advice with probably the least amount of bragging or shit talking than anyone on these forums. If there are problems caused by people on the forums, it not due the competitive bbers imo. I don’t think I have seen anyone actually make fun of someone for not competing.

150

What would someone who was 20% at 150lbs look like? He’d have to be like 5’5" or so lol.

151

[quote]zraw wrote:

[quote]usmccds423 wrote:
zraw, are you like 5 years old dude, let it go, fuck. There is a whole thread dedicated to this garbage. Do you think we need to fuck up every single thread???[/quote]

Im just waiting for the bodybuilding forum to be clean my man

As far as I’m concerned I just asked a question which I can ask again

What is the difference between a young kid thats 165lbs and wants to be 155with abs and a guy that is going for “full house” look

Why should one be “ridiculised” while the other one shouldnt if bodybuilding is about “transforming” your body to something that you like[/quote]

I think that there is a major difference, zraw. Getting to the point of ‘full house’ is a point on the bodybuilding continuum for most people, where they build that initial base of size and strength while learning their bodies. Looking at the Bodybuilding board on this website, it is first and foremost involved with discussing how to train to maximize muscular hypertrophy.

Even someone looking for the ‘full house’ look is interested in this same goal. Your obsession with the fact that some (e.g. PX) get to that point and then do not diet down is frankly bewildering to me–I can only think that it’s your way of trying to feel ‘above’ or separate from we common folk who aren’t regularly competing in BBing shows.

If a kid comes on here at 165, 6 feet tall and wants to lose 10 pounds, then I would just say that there are other forums that are better suited to that sort of goal. This is a bodybuilding forum, a sport that is interested in building muscle mass first and foremost. If he wants a muscular hypertrophy program, then this place is great. If he wants to just lose 10 pounds, then not so much.

Whether either type of person should be ‘ridiculed’ is neither here nor there. Personally, I think the only people who deserve ridicule are those who make posts that clearly show themselves to have never read any of the threads on the forums. Though I’m starting to think that people who instigate childish arguments may deserve some as well :). On a related note, I thought you had put X on ignore, and I’m disappointed to see that you can’t help yourself in that regard. Your post quality has suffered accordingly.

152

[quote]The3Commandments wrote:

[quote]zraw wrote:

[quote]usmccds423 wrote:
zraw, are you like 5 years old dude, let it go, fuck. There is a whole thread dedicated to this garbage. Do you think we need to fuck up every single thread???[/quote]

Im just waiting for the bodybuilding forum to be clean my man

As far as I’m concerned I just asked a question which I can ask again

What is the difference between a young kid thats 165lbs and wants to be 155with abs and a guy that is going for “full house” look

Why should one be “ridiculised” while the other one shouldnt if bodybuilding is about “transforming” your body to something that you like[/quote]

I think that there is a major difference, zraw. Getting to the point of ‘full house’ is a point on the bodybuilding continuum for most people, where they build that initial base of size and strength while learning their bodies. Looking at the Bodybuilding board on this website, it is first and foremost involved with discussing how to train to maximize muscular hypertrophy.

Even someone looking for the ‘full house’ look is interested in this same goal. Your obsession with the fact that some (e.g. PX) get to that point and then do not diet down is frankly bewildering to me–I can only think that it’s your way of trying to feel ‘above’ or separate from we common folk who aren’t regularly competing in BBing shows.

If a kid comes on here at 165, 6 feet tall and wants to lose 10 pounds, then I would just say that there are other forums that are better suited to that sort of goal. This is a bodybuilding forum, a sport that is interested in building muscle mass first and foremost. If he wants a muscular hypertrophy program, then this place is great. If he wants to just lose 10 pounds, then not so much.

Whether either type of person should be ‘ridiculed’ is neither here nor there. Personally, I think the only people who deserve ridicule are those who make posts that clearly show themselves to have never read any of the threads on the forums. Though I’m starting to think that people who instigate childish arguments may deserve some as well :). On a related note, I thought you had put X on ignore, and I’m disappointed to see that you can’t help yourself in that regard. Your post quality has suffered accordingly.[/quote]

x 2.

153

[quote]yolo84 wrote:

i thought he was on ignore for fucks sake you made a thread about it lol

[/quote]

I see all his replies in quotes so its pointless

154

[quote]The3Commandments wrote:

Your obsession with the fact that some (e.g. PX) get to that point and then do not diet down is frankly bewildering to me–I can only think that it’s your way of trying to feel ‘above’ or separate from we common folk who aren’t regularly competing in BBing shows.

[/quote]

I have enough good things going on in my real life so that if I felt a need to feel above (which I dont) I could just focus on that

I personally cannot give a shit wether someone likes to be a bloofy marshmallow or as lean and dry as they can be

What I do care about is when someone starts spewing random BS about how what they did is the best way

AKA : “Accepting this full house look is the best way to make progress faster”

Which I fucking quoted 3 times in another thread and it was ignored 3 times by that said poster because well there isnt a single thing backing this up

But then when someone goes about how insulin sensitivity increases as you lean down that same poster goes about how we need study to prove that and broscience is being spewed all over the place yada yada

That is my problem

Also, fuck you with your personal attacks trying to psychanalyze me over the web lmao

I do not need T Nation to feel good about myself, thx

155

[quote]zraw wrote:
What I do care about is when someone starts spewing random BS about how what they did is the best way

AKA : “Accepting this full house look is the best way to make progress faster”

Which I fucking quoted 3 times in another thread and it was ignored 3 times by that said poster because well there isnt a single thing backing this up

But then when someone goes about how insulin sensitivity increases as you lean down that same poster goes about how we need study to prove that and broscience is being spewed all over the place yada yada

That is my problem
[/quote]

Yeah, I’m doing my best to stay the hell out of any potential nonsense in the new forum out of respect for the powers that be and other members, but I’ve been watching this as well the last couple of days, and scratching my head. If the goal is to bring some better sensibilities and intelligence back to the forums, what reads as hypocrisy surely isn’t doing it in my opinion.

It’s almost like quoting a highly respected coach when he eyeballs your bf levels, citing his word as fact, but then ignoring the same expert opinion when he publicly (repeatedly) states that the approach you constantly tout as being best to pack on muscle may indeed not be.

(no personal animosity in this response, but it just seems silly to me. If I’m reading things incorrectly, someone please explain)

S

156

[quote]zraw wrote:
I personally cannot give a shit wether someone likes to be a bloofy marshmallow or as lean and dry as they can be

What I do care about is when someone starts spewing random BS about how what they did is the best way

AKA : “Accepting this full house look is the best way to make progress faster”[/quote]

This was not stated unless in regards to my own personal progress…so what are you talking about?

What was stated is that the guy working on all out size for years first will make more progress than the guy constantly throwing on the breaks just to keep his abs.

Since you seem to not grasp what is being stated, let’s see if you get it this time.

157

[quote]The Mighty Stu wrote:

[quote]zraw wrote:
What I do care about is when someone starts spewing random BS about how what they did is the best way

AKA : “Accepting this full house look is the best way to make progress faster”

Which I fucking quoted 3 times in another thread and it was ignored 3 times by that said poster because well there isnt a single thing backing this up

But then when someone goes about how insulin sensitivity increases as you lean down that same poster goes about how we need study to prove that and broscience is being spewed all over the place yada yada

That is my problem
[/quote]

Yeah, I’m doing my best to stay the hell out of any potential nonsense in the new forum out of respect for the powers that be and other members, but I’ve been watching this as well the last couple of days, and scratching my head. If the goal is to bring some better sensibilities and intelligence back to the forums, what reads as hypocrisy surely isn’t doing it in my opinion.

It’s almost like quoting a highly respected coach when he eyeballs your bf levels, citing his word as fact, but then ignoring the same expert opinion when he publicly (repeatedly) states that the approach you constantly tout as being best to pack on muscle may indeed not be.

(no personal animosity in this response, but it just seems silly to me. If I’m reading things incorrectly, someone please explain)

S[/quote]

You are reading things incorrectly and the last post should clear that up for you.

158

[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]zraw wrote:
I personally cannot give a shit wether someone likes to be a bloofy marshmallow or as lean and dry as they can be

What I do care about is when someone starts spewing random BS about how what they did is the best way

AKA : “Accepting this full house look is the best way to make progress faster”[/quote]

This was not stated unless in regards to my own personal progress…so what are you talking about?

What was stated is that the guy working on all out size for years first will make more progress than the guy constantly throwing on the breaks just to keep his abs.

Since you seem to not grasp what is being stated, let’s see if you get it this time.[/quote]

Doesn’t the time all add up though? For example geoleeman spent a good amount of time just bulking and disregarding bodyfat…When it was time to lean , it took him about a year to lose all of that bodyfat and it would had most likely taken longer if he knew how to diet properly at the time(he states he didn’t really know much about it and lost a ton of muscle in the process)

159

[quote]TheDon12 wrote:

[quote]Professor X wrote:

[quote]zraw wrote:
I personally cannot give a shit wether someone likes to be a bloofy marshmallow or as lean and dry as they can be

What I do care about is when someone starts spewing random BS about how what they did is the best way

AKA : “Accepting this full house look is the best way to make progress faster”[/quote]

This was not stated unless in regards to my own personal progress…so what are you talking about?

What was stated is that the guy working on all out size for years first will make more progress than the guy constantly throwing on the breaks just to keep his abs.

Since you seem to not grasp what is being stated, let’s see if you get it this time.[/quote]

Doesn’t the time all add up though? For example geoleeman spent a good amount of time just bulking and disregarding bodyfat…When it was time to lean , it took him about a year to lose all of that bodyfat and it would had most likely taken longer if he knew how to diet properly at the time(he states he didn’t really know much about it and lost a ton of muscle in the process)
[/quote]

Dude, it takes YEARS to get really big. Even if it did take a really big guy a full year to diet down (something that implies he was way fatter than anything I have seen anyone think is good), you would have to understand it took ten to twenty years to reach that size in the first place.

Simply put, if you are carrying so much fat it takes a full year to lose it all just to get “relative lean”, you gained way too much body fat. That is not what we are talking about here.

I am not speaking of “disregarding” body fat completely. It is simply an understanding that to build all of the mass it takes to really stand out (unless drugs are used early on) will require some time worrying more about BIG MUSCLES and BIG STRENGTH than abs alone.

Dieting down is something that should take months especially if the goal is to just do some damage control.

160

Does this new forum mean that when anyone posts about something is working for them they wont get barked at to supply proof by posting pics? I mean this forum is for those who just want to improve along their own paths and not necessarily get nineteen inch arms right?