if it has a variation of 6 - 7%, why is speakman constantly getting 20%
speakman, how does getting down to 165lbs from 169lbs in one week sound? how about adding a pull up to your routine in just one week? maybe two… pm me and ill send you a one week program for you to try.
Zeus, why dont you go do that awesome program of yours for 4 or 5 weeks so you will actually look like you lift and weigh about the same as the guy youre trying to advice.
Hell, if you got up to that massive 170, you might have to give up your youth sized tshirts and graduate to an adult small.
lol you just talk shit when you dont know what you are talking about. and you know you cant fool me like you’ve been fooling speakman for over a month.
so why hasn’t speakman lost ANY weight
you forgot to school me about your tanita scale knowledge
why can speakman only do one more pull up than he did at the beginning of the program
and uh what certifications do you have…???
why do you care how i look? i lift more than you in every category even though i weigh less than you.
swallow your ego and read a book
Speakman has gotten stronger and seen changes in the mirror.
In case you havent read the thread (imagine that), he said he went from getting 5 questionable reps to 6 solid ones. Sounds alright to me. This isnt a pull-up program. He has very large progress in his lifts so far and youre focusing on his pull-ups?
Certifications dont mean SHIT. You are living breathing proof of this. I, along with others, tried to have a professional discussion with you regarding methods and your views about loading in another thread and it quickly turned into you throwing out insults because you didnt know what you were talking about. All it takes to get certified is $600 and the ability to regurgitate what you read in a book.
Are you getting these stats for how much I lift the same place youve been getting everything else youre saying about me? Perhaps you are getting them from my log from a year or two ago. I checked out your log and I definitely lift more than you. Dont talk about your hitched bullshit, scarred cat, dieselweasel deadlift either. You keep talking about how you “pulled 415” and if thats what you count as a legit lift, then Im doubting the legitimacy of the rest of your numbers.
I dont care how you look. I feel that it would be important though for someone looking to make changes to their physique to note that YOU DONT LOOK LIKE YOU LIFT before taking your advice. Simple as that.
I am not the one with the ego problem. You are the one who is unable to accept that your advice was not taken and are continuously clogging up this thread with your bullshit and trolling.
You are obviously and egomaniac, as you tried to tell newb that his 700 lb raw squat at 17 years old is a lesser lift than your bullshit 415 deadlift attempt. When you realized that you didnt have a leg to stand on because relative strength is bullshit, you broke out the personal attacks once again.
Your advice sucks. Your attitude sucks. Your physique sucks. Your lifts suck. Please remove yourself.
lol all you do is crack jokes when you cant back yourself up
just read what you wrote. all i see is wahhh wahhh
anywayz im done trying to get any answers from you. i just feel really bad for speakman.
i mean come on, no weight loss or fat loss in over a month, almost two. hes taking a good amount of supplements and still not getting results with your ‘help’. and while this is happening, you’re stuck talking about my body. lol. stop trying to train someone if you hate trainers so much. basically you are regurgitating info because you have no experience you dumb fuckin klutz. jeez. name 3 people you helped lose fat or gain strength or muscle under your supervision. you cant. im not boasting, just proving a point that all your fucking insults are invalid.
speakman, offers still on the table. i am a douchebag for cluttering your thread. sorry.
All of MY fucking insults? Go back and read your behavior in this thread and others. You act like a scorned toddler. Iv actually gotten PM’s from people saying they agree with me but that they didnt want to post in the threads because you act like such an asshat.
I am upset with you because you are STILL trolling this thread and trying to degrade the progress this guy has made. Iv spelled that out for you numerous times now but you are either too thick or too arrogant to catch that. Im going to go with a combination of both since you are still trying to push your lame duck training methods on him after he has politely declined them.
I am regurgitating what? I have no experience? Once again, making shit up because you DONT KNOW SHIT and you HAVE NO ARGUMENT. I train people at my gym at school. I am vice president of the Barbell Club there and I have taken beginners and brought them to the point at which they are bigger and stronger than you. I am not going to post names on here (obviously, thats stupid), but one of these people is my younger brother who is currently 5’10", 200 lbs, 12% bf squats 400, benches 275, and power cleans 260 at 17 years old.
Who have you trained Zeus? 50 year old women is the only thing Iv heard you talk about. So far, it looks like I have more applicable experience, I train guys who want to be bigger and stronger, you train geriatrics who want to avoid breaking their hips. No one is going to go to the Kia dealership looking to buy a Ferrari. This is part of why Speakman hasnt taken your advice. I think the other part deals with your inability to communicate with others and the fact that you cant have a discussion without making personal attacks.
You HAVE been a douchebag and you HAVE been cluttering up this thread. Please refrain from doing that from now on. I am done dealing with your childish, ignorant ass.
[quote]ZeusNathan wrote:
let me tell ya that if any of my clients had the same experience, in 5 weeks of labor, id be out of work. i notice you’re a level 4 meaning you use many of Biotest’s products… this further complicates things because supplements are supposed to not only keep you healthy, but also accelerate your progress.[/quote]
Hmmm… Everywhere else on T-Nation (whether forum threads or articles), the consensus seems to be that supplements are maybe 5% of the equation, and probably less than that for a “beginner” like me. I’m keeping my supplements simple – protein powder, Surge, Creatine, Flameout – and I only expect these to complement the things that really count: my diet and lifting…
[quote]ZeusNathan wrote:
im going to judge your progress by the bodyfat, and your chinups because i think you started light in every other category.
the chinup is the only mode, ‘stable weight’. just like calisthenic people judge progress by the number of push ups they can do.[/quote]
My BF% is slightly “discouraging”, though even when I starved myself down to 145 pounds I still had the same gut – in fact, even more so than now. This is almost certainly due to the 2 billion extra fat cells I have from being 100 pounds overweight five years ago (see my initial post that started this thread).
Lipo might be the only solution for this in my case, but I’m not going to do that… So, more interested in putting on muscle now.
As for your chinup comment, dude, I’m confused! (And I’m concerned that this may be your intent.) Why do you say this is my only “stable weight” exercise?
What about dips, which I’ve almost doubled in six weeks? What about hanging leg raises, which I’ve likewise almost doubled? And I have improved on chinups: From 2x5 really weak ones to 2x7 (as of this week) really pretty strong ones. That’s improvement, I think…
And my biggest concern: Why would you purposely choose to judge my progress by the exercise that I seem to have had the least progress on? This doesn’t make sense. Improving on the squat by 33% in six weeks doesn’t count?
Improving on the deadlift by 33%? And what about an almost 20% improvement on the bench press, which, BTW, I’d been doing for two years already before Rippetoe? Etc., etc… The fact that you would purposely ignore these gains and hone in on the one exercise that doesn’t look as good makes me question your motives. Or am I missing something?
And by the way, the Rippetoe program doesn’t actually include the chinup! This (as well as dips and hanging leg raises) is mentioned as optional on the site where I first learned about the Rippetoe program:
I guess the guy who posted this figured the additional exercises would be good supplements to the basic Rippetoe program. I’m not even sure I should be doing them, as maybe I should assume that Rip’s program works the biceps enough (no chinups necessary?).
In fact, by the time I get to the chinups my biceps are already pretty sore from the preceding exercises. Maybe the fact that I’m adding weight every week to everything else explains perfectly why my chinups have been slow to improve!
[quote]ZeusNathan wrote:
what im seeing is no fat loss or weight loss in over one month, which i believe is your immediate goal? and virtually no significant gains in strength also.
That is a blatant red alert that something is out of place. your carbs are nice and low and your protein and fat intake is just fine… but the workout is where i see weakness.[/quote]
“And virtually no significant gains in strength”?? Dude, I don’t get that comment at all. I’m a “beginner” with the bodybuilding stuff, sure, but I’m not a beginner in life! Up to 33% gains on several lifts (and notable improvements on the others) in six weeks just can’t be called “insignificant” by anyone who’s really being honest…
Either you need to explain this comment to me so it seems reasonable or, sorry man, you’re not coming across as credible to me…
One more note about my gains: The Rippetoe program is very specific about adding only 2.5% to all lifts per week. Because of my low starting weights, I can’t do this (no plates small enough) – instead I’ve been adding about twice this amount each week to most lifts. So, I’m already excelling faster than I’m “supposed to”…
As for my physique, I’m taking everyone’s advice about not staring at the scale every morning. The mirror, in the meantime, is giving me very positive feedback. And so is my wife! Coincidentally, we were at lunch today and I asked her about my gut.
She said it is definitely smaller than a couple of months ago. Then I asked her about my muscles, and she says I’m looking a little too bulky, like I’m puffed up and flexing all the time. Then she tried to include an insult by saying that my clavicles look like those Cardassian guys’ off Star Trek… Talk about great feedback!! LOL
So, sticking with Rippetoe’s for now, and definitely sticking with Strongman. I can see that you two don’t get along, but he’s really working hard to help me – not pushing his own program, but an extremely tried, true and well-respected one by a world renown strength training coach. Sorry to choose sides, but at my age I have to go with the sure bet…
[quote]speakman wrote:
Hmmm… Everywhere else on T-Nation (whether forum threads or articles), the consensus seems to be that supplements are maybe 5% of the equation, and probably less than that for a “beginner” like me. I’m keeping my supplements simple – protein powder, Surge, Creatine, Flameout – and I only expect these to complement the things that really count: my diet and lifting…
[/quote]
ZN: Ok�?�[quote]
My BF% is slightly “discouraging”, though even when I starved myself down to 145 pounds I still had the same gut – in fact, even more so than now. This is almost certainly due to the 2 billion extra fat cells I have from being 100 pounds overweight five years ago (see my initial post that started this thread).
Lipo might be the only solution for this in my case, but I’m not going to do that… So, more interested in putting on muscle now.
[/quote]
ZN: �??In any event, in the course of trying to solve my body fat percentage problem (currently somewhere around 20%) by supplementing my lame efforts with Carbolin 19 for about four months, I came to realize (thanks to a few guys who responded to my posts with some decent criticism) that I’m pretty much wasting six hours a week at the gym.
I believe that I can gain some serious muscle weight, get my fat % down to 10%, and actually look and feel like someone who lifts weights. But I need some advice.�??
I guess you�??ve changed your goal a little bit.
ZN: Because you can�??t adjust the weight on the chinups. It was 169lbs and still is 169lbs. And although you�??ve been steadily improving in other departments, your chinup has been staggering. The reason why I believe rippetoe didn�??t include pull ups in his routine is because basically, not everyone can perform them�?� such as yourself. So even though you didn�??t do the complete 5, you still wrote it down as such.
Should I just return a rebuttal to your suspicious query, or can I offer a possible solution? Substitute the chin ups for lat pulldowns. Sounds simple enough but you would not believe how many people, or rather trainees, overlook this exercise. If you can perform 169lbs 7 times, I think you should try 100 �?? 110lbs 4 x 12. The volume of your current lat workout is 2028lbs total. With the 4 x 12 you get a whopping 5280lbs. I wouldn�??t be surprised if you add two pull ups in a week�?�
ZN: Hey man, great job.
ZN: And yet another excuse. You do bench presses before dips, but you still almost doubled the reps.
ZN: 33% gain from where you started, yea. I think you started very light in every category, except for the chin ups of course. It�??s like starting someone off at 3lbs pink dumbbells and moving upto 10lbs for shoulder presses.
And you�??re talking about credibility? You�??re taking advice from a kid over the internet who has no certifications, and who takes pride in being the vice president of his barbell club. The same kid who�??s been training you over T-Nation and yielded no results. Let me repeat myself NO RESULTS in terms of fat loss or weight loss. You could�??ve gotten the same results you have now from printing out rippetoe�??s program and doing it yourself.
ZN: hey, my philosophy is if you enjoy what you�??re doing, keep at it.
I really wish the OP could ban certain people from posting on his thread.
Anyway I’ve just read pretty much this whole post and Speakman I gotta say. Good on you. I started Rippetoes 3 weeks ago myself and I’m 37. My squat went up from 225 to 255 in 3 weeks I’m pretty shocked.
The only concern I have is sometimes it feels like I need an extra day of rest, I guess it’s an age thing. Are you finding this at all? I was also thinking of adding in a 1 week de-load of basically no compound movements and just periodization movements every 4 weeks. Oh and I chose the power cleans over the pendalay rows.
You should give em a shot. They really kick your ass. I also think it’s pretty awesome that Stronghold has kind of taken you under his wing the way he has. Good luck! I just saved this thread in my favorites.
I said I was done with you Zuess, but I want to pint something that I feel is important out.
If I have zero credibility and dont know what I am talking about, then what does that say about you…who has lost on every point we have ever argued about? Calling me “kid” is retarded since we are close to the same age and pointing out that you are “certified” makes as much a sense as saying that someone is a good driver simply because they have a driver license. You want to know why Im not certified? Because I dont have $600 to spend on a piece of paper that says I could pass a test that an autistic chimpanzee could pass.
From now on, when you feel the need to speak, why dont you just go into your bathroom and talk to yourself. That way, you can hear your own voice (which we all know is the only reason you continue to post here) and you wont be annoying the rest of us.
[quote]ZeusNathan wrote:
speakman wrote:
I believe that I can gain some serious muscle weight, get my fat % down to 10%, and actually look and feel like someone who lifts weights. But I need some advice.
ZN: I guess you’ve changed your goal a little bit.[/quote]
Good point… I guess I can get a bit wishy-washy with all of this, which is probably the best argument for me committing to one workout/diet plan and sticking to that 100% until instructed otherwise. I’m not even getting on my scale anymore. Just doing Rippetoe’s and the diet/cardio plan that Stronghold has me on. And, as stated, I’m seeing improvements to my muscle/fat ratio in the mirror, and the wife is seeing it also. And I’m getting stronger (no debating this) in the gym. So, I’m trusting the process and not my own wishy-washiness… Thanks for the observation…
[quote]
Speakman: As for your chinup comment, dude, I’m confused! (And I’m concerned that this may be your intent.) Why do you say this is my only “stable weight” exercise?
ZN: Because you can’t adjust the weight on the chinups. It was 169lbs and still is 169lbs. And although you’ve been steadily improving in other departments, your chinup has been staggering. The reason why I believe rippetoe didn’t include pull ups in his routine is because basically, not everyone can perform them such as yourself. So even though you didn’t do the complete 5, you still wrote it down as such.[/quote]
But I can do them, I am doing them, and (as stated previously) I’m improving on these. Just like the other “stable weight” exercises (dips and hanging leg raises).
Funny, I was doing lat pull-downs to failure 3 times per week for the two years leading up to Rippetoe’s and I really plateaued on these. Hey, maybe that’s the real reason I’m a little stagnant on chin-ups! Amazing I’ve improved at all on them in the last seven weeks. Maybe Rippetoe’s is making my whole body stronger!
[quote]In fact, by the time I get to the chinups my biceps are already pretty sore from the preceding exercises. Maybe the fact that I’m adding weight every week to everything else explains perfectly why my chinups have been slow to improve!
ZN: And yet another excuse. You do bench presses before dips, but you still almost doubled the reps.[/quote]
Just trying to figure all this out. But you’re trying to confuse me again!! I’ve almost doubled my reps on dips, another “stable weight” exercise (like chin-ups), so doesn’t this prove that Rippetoe’s is working? ZN, you’re contradicting yourself…
Not a fair statement. Each week (starting with the very first one), it’s taken SERIOUS effort to complete my sets on all exercises. In other words, I’ve been lifting the most I possibly can each week. And yet still progressing very well. Rippetoe’s claims to increase strength. This is precisely what it’s done so far, consistently, each week…
Also not fair. Someone on another thread I’d started over in Supplements and Nutrition (called “Carbolin 19 Trial”) suggested Rippetoe’s. I started this thread with a couple of posts that ended with the following question:
“What do you guys know about Rippetoe’s program?”
Stronghold is one of maybe a dozen guys who have spoken very highly of this program and encouraged me to go on it. Stronghold didn’t describe the program to me… I learned the details from a post on Bodybuilding.com. Then I bought Rippetoe’s book. Stronghold did help me to get my nutrition in order (you seemed to agree with his advice in your last post) and to fine-tune my cardio (which you also haven’t seemed to disagree with)…
It sounds to me like your real beef is with Mark Rippetoe, and I don’t understand why. Do you know him personally? What’s your real problem with him? Seems like a very nice guy, and I haven’t found anyone anywhere (except you) who disagrees with his program. Strange!
There are many reasons why I’m sticking with Stronghold and his advice, but a major one, to be frank, is that half a dozen guys on T-Nation have told me to. Conversely, a bunch of guys have told me to ignore what you’re saying. Don’t mean to hurt your feelings, but I just can’t think of any reason at all to take your advice over every other single person I talk to or hear from!
Okay, I’ll take this one piece of advice from you!
P.S. Last week’s progress posted above…
the whole point speakman, is that if you started 169lbs and 20%bf, and you remained the same, your “muscle/fat ratio” is the same.
Funny, I was doing lat pull-downs to failure 3 times per week for the two years leading up to Rippetoe’s and I really plateaued on these. Hey, maybe that’s the real reason I’m a little stagnant on chin-ups! Amazing I’ve improved at all on them in the last seven weeks. Maybe Rippetoe’s is making my whole body stronger!
pulldowns to failure 3 times a week for two years and you are at 2 x 7…
im sorry but that is pure bullshit. utter bullshit. me personally lat pulldowns got me doing pull ups with 90+lbs. for about… 7 reps. shit how long did it take?.. like 3 months? good luck speakman. maybe one day you’ll wake up and realize something.
Maybe something like “wow I sure am a lot bigger and stronger now thanks to Mark Rippetoe”
[quote]youngguns35 wrote:
The only concern I have is sometimes it feels like I need an extra day of rest, I guess it’s an age thing. Are you finding this at all? I was also thinking of adding in a 1 week de-load of basically no compound movements and just periodization movements every 4 weeks. Oh and I chose the power cleans over the pendalay rows.
You should give em a shot. They really kick your ass. I also think it’s pretty awesome that Stronghold has kind of taken you under his wing the way he has. Good luck! I just saved this thread in my favorites.[/quote]
In all the excitement with ZN, I forgot to respond to this… First of all, thanks for your support. T-Nation has been and remains just a great group of guys!
I know what you mean about the “extra day of rest” thing… However, the program Stronghold has me on has me working every day: Lifting and light cardio three days a week, light cardio the rest of the week except for Saturday, when I do about 45 minutes of interval training. The trick for me is sneaking in a nap here and there, getting my full 8 hours (sometimes slightly more) every night, and sitting on my rear-end typing away on a computer the rest of the time… LOL
Regarding Power Cleans, those things scare me a bit… I’ve had two hernias (same spot) in my life, the most recent just a couple of years ago. I had the mesh repair this time around, which is holding up great, but I think PC’s might push the envelope a bit too much for me… So, sticking with the Bent-over Rows for now…
Congrats on your progress, and keep me posted!
Sorry Speakman, hijack
[quote]youngguns35 wrote:
The only concern I have is sometimes it feels like I need an extra day of rest, I guess it’s an age thing. Are you finding this at all? I was also thinking of adding in a 1 week de-load of basically no compound movements and just periodization movements every 4 weeks.[/quote]
I am currently on my second round of Rippetoe. I recommend a light week every four weeks. That’s actually what the next progression uses:
The first time through, I went eight weeks without stopping. At the end I was burned out. Even if you don’t do a complete deload, I think that dropping the weight and doing 3x3 for a week could be effective. Honestly though, I would not deload or take a week off unless something wasn’t moving - weight or reps. If you can consistently add weight, then do so.
/hijack
Speakman, I think I mentioned it in another thread, but nice job so far. You have made consistent progress.
[quote]ZeusNathan wrote:
the whole point speakman, is that if you started 169lbs and 20%bf, and you remained the same, your “muscle/fat ratio” is the same.
[/quote]
Wow, I didn’t realize that you’d been sneaking into speakman’s house and doing bf% measurements on him. If he’s looking leaner and maintaining the same weight while getting stronger, I’d put down good money that he’s decreasing his bf% while gaining muscle.
Speakman? You still hanging in there?
[quote]youngguns35 wrote:
Speakman? You still hanging in there?[/quote]
No… Zeus scared me off…
Joke! Sorry for the delayed report this week. Had to go out of town on business for a couple of days. (Left town right after Friday’s workout and just got back…)
In any event, last week’s progress is posted above. Feeling stronger all the time in the gym. A few notes:
-
I may be stalled on the Bench Press for a couple of weeks. Got to that chapter in Rip’s book and realized that I haven’t been lowering the bar properly (stopping a couple of inches above my chest instead of touching the chest). I want to do this right, so I’m going to stay at 165 until I can bench according to instructions…
-
I feel kind of stalled with the Military Press. As mentioned in a previous post, I had been doing these for two years prior to starting Rippetoe, so this probably has something to do with it. That said, my shoulders look and feel bigger than when I started the program, and my suspicion is that my strength will start to increase on this as my other muscle groups catch up. Hoping for the best…
-
Actually making faster progress on Chin-ups than in the first month… Last week, I was able to do one 2x8 set, but only about 2x7 and a half on the second set. So, not ready to report 2x8 quite yet, but Chin-ups feeling stronger every week…
That’s it for now. Just staying consistent with lifting, diet and cardio, and I swear my body looks better than it ever has!!
Little heads-up: This week, I’ve actually decided to shave 10 (or more?) pounds off my bench press until I can get my form just right.
Again, I’d been lowering the bar to an inch or two above my chest before the rebound, but then read in Rippetoe’s book that the bar must touch the chest or it’s not proper form. So, at the risk of more heckling, my next report will show a DROP in my bench press weight. This doesn’t mean I’ve gone down in strength (per se), just that I’m committed to doing things the right way… But if anyone (not naming names) can get some pleasure out of pointing out my apparent digression (however illusory), by all means enjoy… LOL