Hey everyone,
I was wondering something: Shouldn’t you actually push your into the bench when doing barbell bench presses and all of its variations (incline, dumbbell, etc)? I’ve watched this video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9S58KxZwbBw
I’m aware that you should always take advice from people with a grain salt, HOWEVER, I think what they say in the video actually makes sense!
Could any of you please express your views on this subject?
Edit: Also, is this one bullshit? Anyone tried this?
[quote]GetBigs wrote:
I was wondering something: Shouldn’t you actually push your into the bench when doing barbell bench presses and all of its variations (incline, dumbbell, etc)? I’ve watched this video .
…
I’m aware that you should always take advice from people with a grain salt, HOWEVER, I think what they say in the video actually makes sense![/quote]
Actually, I don’t think that makes much sense at all. BPak is a pretty smart guy, but if we’re trying to increase pec recruitment, then I think it’s counterproductive to focus on “pressing your body into the bench away from the weights.” Now, if we’re talking about increasing strength, then certainly that stability and counterforce can be beneficial.
If we’re talking about how they said to use lighter weight, slow down the movement, and feel the muscle contract, then yes, that can be a good idea. But by saying “focus on pushing yourself away in order to increase pec recruitment”, I think they’re off-track.
I wouldn’t say it’s bullshit, but if it does have an effect, I’d say it’s going to be relatively-minor and any increase in pec recruitment will come with an increased amount of stress on the front delts as well. More front delt work is something few people need, so it’ll vary person to person depending on how much (or how little) you actually feel the difference.
[quote]Chris Colucci wrote:
[quote]GetBigs wrote:
I was wondering something: Shouldn’t you actually push your into the bench when doing barbell bench presses and all of its variations (incline, dumbbell, etc)? I’ve watched this video .
…
I’m aware that you should always take advice from people with a grain salt, HOWEVER, I think what they say in the video actually makes sense![/quote]
Actually, I don’t think that makes much sense at all. BPak is a pretty smart guy, but if we’re trying to increase pec recruitment, then I think it’s counterproductive to focus on “pressing your body into the bench away from the weights.” Now, if we’re talking about increasing strength, then certainly that stability and counterforce can be beneficial.
If we’re talking about how they said to use lighter weight, slow down the movement, and feel the muscle contract, then yes, that can be a good idea. But by saying “focus on pushing yourself away in order to increase pec recruitment”, I think they’re off-track.
I wouldn’t say it’s bullshit, but if it does have an effect, I’d say it’s going to be relatively-minor and any increase in pec recruitment will come with an increased amount of stress on the front delts as well. More front delt work is something few people need, so it’ll vary person to person depending on how much (or how little) you actually feel the difference.[/quote]
Hey Chris, thanks very much for your time and reply!
Yeah, I knew the reply was going to be something like this. I find it funny that such a big and experienced bodybuilder as BPak would actually do something like this, because if you watch his chest training videos, he NEVER REALLY does what he says in these ‘training tips’ videos… funny, isn’t it?
BTW Could any of you please answer this question?
Question: Everybody talks about you having to try to bring your humerus as close to the body and across as possible in order to maximize chest contraction. My question is, what if you bench press just like you would do cable crossovers, lol? So instead of pushing straight up, why not push your hands in the opposite direction, that is, for instance, your right arm to the left, across your body, if you can see what I’m talking about?
[quote]GetBigs wrote:
So instead of pushing straight up, why not push your hands in the opposite direction, that is, for instance, your right arm to the left, across your body, if you can see what I’m talking about?[/quote]
Trying to squeeze the hands inwards, without actually moving them, during a bench press is one way to try to recruit more pec work. Thibaudeau talked about it a long time ago here:
This is also one reason why some people feel dumbbell benching works their pecs better than barbell work, because the arms can go “up and in” instead of just “up”. So, yep, it can be a good cue.
[quote]Chris Colucci wrote:
This is also one reason why some people feel dumbbell benching works their pecs better than barbell work, because the arms can go “up and in” instead of just “up”. So, yep, it can be a good cue.[/quote]
Incline DBs with this “Up and In” technique is amazing. I usually do (light) sets of them in between my barbell pressing of any angle.
[quote]GetBigs wrote:
BTW Could any of you please answer this question?
Question: Everybody talks about you having to try to bring your humerus as close to the body and across as possible in order to maximize chest contraction. My question is, what if you bench press just like you would do cable crossovers, lol? So instead of pushing straight up, why not push your hands in the opposite direction, that is, for instance, your right arm to the left, across your body, if you can see what I’m talking about? [/quote]
This is one of the tips BPak gives in one of his videos; from experience, yes it does work in recruiting more chest, grip the bar hard and “mash the bar together.”
[quote]Chris Colucci wrote:
[quote]GetBigs wrote:
So instead of pushing straight up, why not push your hands in the opposite direction, that is, for instance, your right arm to the left, across your body, if you can see what I’m talking about?[/quote]
Trying to squeeze the hands inwards, without actually moving them, during a bench press is one way to try to recruit more pec work. Thibaudeau talked about it a long time ago here:
This is also one reason why some people feel dumbbell benching works their pecs better than barbell work, because the arms can go “up and in” instead of just “up”. So, yep, it can be a good cue.[/quote]
Oh lol didn’t think this would be answered so quickly lol thanks guys you rock
I’ll definitely incorporate that into my routine next time…
Also, has any of you tried what BPack also suggests: Work your pecs literally at every angle of the bench! So you start with shoulder presses, and go down one angle until you reach flat bench (or decline if your bench has that option)? I just tried it, did 6 reps on each angle, this was one set, did 3 sets, killed me… I did pre exhaust the upper pecs before by doing incline flyes on the pec deck machine though (how? Just place your hands above than you would, it shifts the emphasis onto the upper pecs, but beware of your shoulders, so go slow!)
Curb your enthusiasm a bit.
While there are many many ways to stimulate a muscle, more isn’t always better.
The more you read about this stuff, the more videos you watch, and the more excited you are about it… the easier it is to get yourself sidetracked away from making genuine progress. Been there, done that; many of us have.
Here’s what’s going to happen:
Didn’t mean for that to sound so pessimistic…
It is very cool that you’re learning this stuff. But certain things like that, you should just file away for now.
For now, focus first and foremost at getting good at benching. While doing that, find a way to bench so that you get a good chest contraction without putting your shoulders at risk. This is where a lot of people use dumbbells or various inclines.
Eventually you will get a good feel for what works for you, and you’ll get a good idea when you need to incorporate some more advanced techniques. For example, pre-exhaust is a good tool, but there are times to use it and times not to use it.
You have a long journey ahead of you. Trying to sprint to the finish line won’t get you there any faster.
Best of luck.
^Yeah, alright, no problem mate, I do agree! Basics is the key, and I’m always open to learn from the more experienced lifters! Thanks! I’ll take heed of your advice
[quote]Chris Colucci wrote:
[quote]GetBigs wrote:
So instead of pushing straight up, why not push your hands in the opposite direction, that is, for instance, your right arm to the left, across your body, if you can see what I’m talking about?[/quote]
Trying to squeeze the hands inwards, without actually moving them, during a bench press is one way to try to recruit more pec work. Thibaudeau talked about it a long time ago here:
This is also one reason why some people feel dumbbell benching works their pecs better than barbell work, because the arms can go “up and in” instead of just “up”. So, yep, it can be a good cue.[/quote]
No, I was talking about doing a cable crossover sort of thing with dumbbels on flat bench. Basically, it’s a press, but instead of pressing UP, you use one arm at a time with one dumbbell in your hand and press it up while trying to bring your humerus as much across your body as you can, almost like in a cable crossover… What do you think?
[quote]GetBigs wrote:
Also, has any of you tried what BPack also suggests: Work your pecs literally at every angle of the bench! So you start with shoulder presses, and go down one angle until you reach flat bench (or decline if your bench has that option)?[/quote]
Actually, the reverse method (starting flat and gradually increasing the incline) is one way to emphasize the pecs. Starting with the shoulder press and working down to flat will leave the shoulders most fatigued by the time you get to flat pressing.
Sounds kinda-sorta like a one-arm dumbbell fly. Not necessarily a bad movement, only trouble is, when you’re lying on a bench, there’s minimal resistance when your arms are perpendicular, which is why the cable crossover is sometime preferred. So, yeah, don’t sweat it. If anything, you’d be better off with “basic” flyes, “basic” crossovers, and the “squeezing in and up” cue when pressing.
[quote]LoRez wrote:
The more you read about this stuff, the more videos you watch, and the more excited you are about it… the easier it is to get yourself sidetracked away from making genuine progress. Been there, done that; many of us have.[/quote]
^ Can. Not. Be. Emphasized. Enough. ^
You can read car magazines all day and read up on the newest rims, nitrous injection systems, and custom windshield wipers, but if you don’t have your license yet, it makes no sense to start buying accessories. (I’m not a car guy and always seem to trip myself up with these kind of analogies, but hopefully that made sense anyhow.)
[quote]Chris Colucci wrote:
custom windshield wipers[/quote]
[quote]Claudan wrote:
[quote]Chris Colucci wrote:
custom windshield wipers[/quote]
[/quote]
[quote]LoRez wrote:
[quote]Claudan wrote:
[quote]Chris Colucci wrote:
custom windshield wipers[/quote]
[/quote]
[/quote]
well played LoRez.
Is this common now? Seems superfluous
[quote]Claudan wrote:
[quote]LoRez wrote:
[quote]Claudan wrote:
[quote]Chris Colucci wrote:
custom windshield wipers[/quote]
[/quote]
[/quote]
well played LoRez.
Is this common now? Seems superfluous[/quote]
I’ve never actually seen it. But the idea of adding lights to make it even harder to see in the rain (due to the additional glare) amuses me.
[quote]Chris Colucci wrote:
I’m not a car guy and always seem to trip myself up with these kind of analogies[/quote]
Alright thanks guys
One question though: I just want to maximize the effectiveness of my bench press. So are you supposed to “shove your hands together” on the concentric as well as on the eccentric portion of the rep, OR would I be better off by only doing it on the eccentric?
So:
much lower weight (maybe?), but on the concentric as well as the eccentric VS only on the eccentric?
Thanks a lot
I have a couple of questions with regard to the bench press grip width. According to Joe Defranco, he says that he prefers to use a grip width that is 14"-18" apart on the barbell when training on max-effort and dynamic days. However, a couple of days ago, I ordered a copy of Rippetoe’s Starting Strength book because I have been wanting to improve and check my technique on all my lifts.
According to Rippetoe, he says that when doing the bench press to develop upper body strength and muscle mass that you should use a grip width on the barbell that is 22"- 24" apart, measured between your left and right index fingers. During the past several months, I have been using a 18" apart grip because I have been following DeFranco’s WS4SB program and methods (at least for the most part).
I have been stalling on the bench press with 180 lbs. x 3 x 5 for a few weeks. Also, I realize that even though my height is 5’9", my wingspan is actually 6’1". Is having such a wingspan along with using a closer grip 14"-18" apart on the barbell one major reason why I am stalling? Furthermore, which grip width are novices on the barbell bench in general suppose to use, the range that DeFranco says or the one that Rippetoe instructs?