Beginners Gains

Training
761

thanks nadia. i did wonder if lower weight increases would be more appropriate for me. i will give it a go with that. want to run it for front squats and for back squats (so i can squat 2x per week). urm… would it be better to start both at the same time (so deload both together) or start one a couple weeks in?? any thoughts on that are welcome.

i have a lot of work to do on mind-muscle connection. then… once i’ve got it… i need to do an awful lot of work on keeping it or else it goes away. i’m actually very excited indeed to hear of a program that doesn’t make me feel like a wuss for spending so much time on submaximal quality reps! so very happy indeed :slight_smile:

762

5/3/1

my deads are going well so I’ve kept the 10lbs increase on those.

my bench is OK so far so I’ve kept the 5lbs increase although that might change with time

and for my squats I dropped to 5lbs increase since I’m struggling with form and such.

be smart about your increases. as many have mentionned this is a long term program, not an 8 week blitz.

763

[quote]alexus wrote:
thanks nadia. i did wonder if lower weight increases would be more appropriate for me. i will give it a go with that. want to run it for front squats and for back squats (so i can squat 2x per week). urm… would it be better to start both at the same time (so deload both together) or start one a couple weeks in?? any thoughts on that are welcome.

i have a lot of work to do on mind-muscle connection. then… once i’ve got it… i need to do an awful lot of work on keeping it or else it goes away. i’m actually very excited indeed to hear of a program that doesn’t make me feel like a wuss for spending so much time on submaximal quality reps! so very happy indeed :-)[/quote]

Hey Alexus, if you have a problem with taking a week off you might prefer having you deloads happen at different times that way you never have a full deload week and always feel like you have a challenge. I tried it the other way but I was bored with a light week, this also means you can kind of save a little of yourself for the challenging lifts if at least one is a deload. Although I have heard that some ladies deload when they are pmsing which makes sense also(water retention can make my back grumpy). I think it is basically what works for you.

When you consider how many reps you do where you are yelling it seems silly that he would have a problem with it. It’s not like your running around the place the entire time roaring your head, although now I’m giggling because I’m imagining you doing just that. Keep yelling because obviously you are not scary enough for him to mind his own business.

764

Screw the mofo who complained about the yelling. If guys can do it, why can’t women? I can drown out noises from weights clanking and yelling and grunting so that doesn’t bother me, but no one says anything when a guy does it.

765

The yelling conversation is funny. I wonder how he feels about yelling in the bedroom. Perhaps he’s never been able to make a girl cum. I would posit that theory to him.

Re 5-3-1 front squat/back squat and when to start them–tough call–if you start really light you might be ok to start with both. If you want to start heavier, maybe just start with one and give your body time to adjust? I don’t really know.

766

Haha. Nadia’s suggestion about the anti-yeller’s inability to make a girl come is hilarious.

I agree with Nikki. There are so many other noises in the gym that you doing your thing shouldn’t be a problem. It’s cool to see a women’s olympic-lifting log.

767

[quote]
i think i need to train a bit more like a bodybuilder with respect to the mind-muscle connection on basic movement patterns. pretty sure i used to have it down, but it is something i need to keep up with practicing or my body forgets. my body has forgotten a lot.[/quote]

I’ve been thinking a lot about the mind-muscle connection, too. I can do squats without really activating my glutes, pull-ups which are mostly a bicep move, on and on. I’ve been thinking more about flexing my back, especially my lats. I have a hard time getting my lats and hammies to FIRE. It’s a lack of neurological connection, but I know it’s improved a lot since I started. I was surprised to hear you complaining about the same thing. The OLY stuff requires so much coordination and control, and you seem to really take time with warmups and stretching.

As for feeling grateful for the support of the other women, (and the guys too)…I’m with you. It helps me to stay excited about what I’m doing, and makes me want to do more. So…here’s some love right back at ya Lex. You are one of the most inspiring people here.

768

Cal - I hear you on going back to basics. I think it is often massively underrated. Another thing I’m finding about the beginner to beginning intermediate transition is that I didn’t have ego problems being a beginner (I know I’m weak!) but I’m starting to have ego problems now in my reluctance to lower the weight from max and work on form. Maybe not ego problems… So hard to find the appropriate balance between not being a pussy / underestimating my ability on the one hand, and letting my ego get in the way / overestimating my quality of movement on the other.

Nadia, Nimain - thanks for the 5/3/1 advice. I will start out front and back squats with 85% max (rather than 90%). All out weights are in kilos and since 5 pounds is 2.27kg I’ll reset my maxes by 2.5kg since my squats are sucky sucky suck.

Charlie - thank you. I remember you asking about deloads for 5/3/1 but I couldn’t remember the upshot of the conversation (since I didn’t really understand the program I didn’t get that you could run it with different lifts starting them together or staggered). My body is very much in favor of deloading when I’m PMSing whether I like it or not, so I’ll run them simultaneously.

Nikki, Nadia, Ironcross (welcome!) - I asked one of the guys on the desk today about yelling. Have known him for a while and know he is sympathetic to my training. Seems that there isn’t a ‘no yelling’ policy, the heavy weights room is supposed to be for serious training, and both him and a guy who seems to do a bit more managing stuff thought that it was totally fine - so long as I wasn’t rude to the guy. So… That aspect of the issue is resolved, at least. He can’t intimidate me by appealing to non-existent ‘no yelling’ policies.

On the other hand…

In the spirit of everyone being right (at least a little bit)… I think I will aim to train without yelling sometimes. Try and mimic whatever the yelling does for my core support / breathing / explosion. Think there may be benefits to learning to train both ways.

Powerpuff - Debra got me thinking about the mind-muscle connection most recently. She said something about it in her log. About how she started out training with that kind of mindset. It spoke to me…

I find the Oly Lifting is just the same as chin-ups and squats… In the sense that there might not be very much visible difference at all in the movement… But one can do them activating the muscles properly… Which feels like one is making it harder for oneself… Or one can sort of kind of cheat.

I’m finding the cheating on the Oly Lifting results in a forwards bar path. The cheating on the Front Squats results in folding / crumpling forwards. The cheating on the chin-ups results in not much progress on the chin-ups.

I do do long warm-ups… But instead of thinking of my warm-ups as not real work… I need to really focus on the quality of movement / muscular contraction for my warm-ups. Do them PROPERLY. Take a bit longer, even. There was a time (once upon a time a couple months back) where I could do a solitary chin-up from a dead hang with my glutes clenched hard, really using my lats to pull my elbows down. It WAS hard. But… It felt strong. Like I could have strengthened that movement and been able to do reps. Now… Since I haven’t kept up with regular practice… I’m back to not clenching my glutes, leaning forwards a bit, not contracting my lats properly, and muscling up with my biceps :frowning: It feels easier… Don’t seem to be able to do it properly anymore… Time for me to go back to basics…

The thing that surprises me about going back to basics… Is that to start with it is HARD and feels SO VERY WEAK. But… If you really do it properly progress really does come pretty quickly! It really is worth it.

TRAINING

usual warm-up.
took longer than usual with my bar warm-up.

the work I did yesterday with the light weights on positions really was helpful! felt very much easier to get the positions today! i should remember this and take more time with my warm-ups being much stricter about getting into those positions properly / activating my muscles properly. I have some bruises on the front of my thighs which suggests the bar is hitting too low. need to see about whether I need to alter my grip or something… need the bump for the party!

35kg - no yelling.
0,
8x1

some of these were good. most of these were forwards (not finishing the pull)

a little bit of position work / pulling work with 20kg.

done.

i’ll do stuffs tomorrow.

769

Whoa, I’m gonna have to come back to really catch up in here. Looks like things are going pretty well for you. Lots of interesting gym stuff.

Just letting you know that I stopped by :slight_smile:

770

I’d really love to hear excrutiating detail when (if!) you decide to start 5/3/1. And definitely you should increase in smaller increments between cycles. I don’t think Wendler has a 100# bench in mind when he offers advice on how much to increase. I think I chose a 5 or 10% increase per week and it still added up pretty quick.

Also I recommend muttering “fuck that’s hard” over yelling. It just works for me.

771

Good to hear that you’re going back to the basics. I have no doubt that progress will come quickly.

772

Wow lot’s to catch up on!

As far as the screaming goes?, if it helps you, do it!! If that miserable old git doesn’t like your noise, he can put earphones in. That’s what they’re for.

Life is too short to ‘stifle’ yourself because of member imposed ‘non policy’ gym rules. I’d much rather lift in a gym full of grunting and screaming than the sound of people chatting. Far more conducive to hard work. I don’t know what his problem is.

Personally, I’m not much of a screamer, but on rare occasion I have shocked myself and let rip a roar that I didn’t know was coming and it felt great!

I’m sure this won’t be popular, but I don’t think 5/3/1 is the way to go for you (as an O lifter). It’s too infrequent and takes far too long to progress. If you work off a 90% 1rm and then start the cycle with 90% of that (as suggested), it’s going to be ages before you are using challenging poundages. If I were you I’d cut your O lifts back for 4-6 weeks and run the RSR (the RSR was designed to be used by weightlifters to bring up their squat while still doing their other lifts) or the base mesocycle of smolov. Those 6x6’s and 5x5’s at specific percentages, 3-4 times a week will really bring up your squat quick and let’s face it, you’re not too far away from being able to snatch your max squat and where do you go from there?.

Great work and dedication as ususal Alexus.

773

Veggie - don’t worry about catching up. i’m been particularly wordy lately. anything i’ve said that is worth saying is bound to be repeated :slight_smile: thanks for letting me know you stopped by.

Arachne - thank you. i’d have to say it super-fast, but some kind of acknowledgement might well be what is needed.

thanks Nikki :slight_smile:

aw Brett… i’m so very torn. on the one hand most oly lifters do indeed seem to do smolov or RSR… on the other hand, i do think i will make gains from backing off the weights and drilling proper muscle activation / technique… i don’t want to be a wuss… but i don’t want to be too gung ho…

after much angst (sorry my logging has been so wordy lately)…

i’ll do the RSR for one cycle and then reassess things. definately take vids at that point and see if my form has turned to shit. i think i need to be less gung ho about everything aside from squats but if i’m really careful to warm up properly i am actually reasonably comfortable with my squat form (especially after taking so much time getting comfortable first position for my snatches). hard and heavy on squats. light and mind-muscle connection on everything else.

I WILL DO THIS (i need to stick with it and not be schizophrenic about my squat training)

Front squat (since I’m not very comfortable / practiced with back squat)
1RM 45kg.

RUSSIAN SQUAT ROUTINE:
Week 1
A 36kg 6x2
B 36kg 6x3
C 36kg 6x2

Week 2
A 36kg 6x4
B 36kg 6x2
C 36kg 6x5

Week 3
A 36kg 6x2
B 36kg 6x6
C 36kg 6x2

Week 4
A 38.5kg 5x5
B 36kg 6x2
C 40kg 4x4

Week 5
A 36kg 6x2
B 42.5kg 3x3
C 36kg 6x2

Week 6
A 45kg 2x2
B 36kg 6x2
C 47.25 (max at 105%)

i’m scared :-/

TRAINING:

usual warm-up.

was hoping to try for 40kg snatch but my pulls were crappy. did a bunch of work on first pull, again. it really does seem to be the case that if i pull the bar properly in that first inch from the floor that determines whether the rest of the lift will go alright or not. got some work to do on doing it properly and then doing it fast. quite a few reps of just that first bloody inch lol.

774

I’m excited for your recounts of the RSR. Looks fun!

I caught up on the yelling conversation… LOL! People are fucking nuts!

775

Don’t be scared! Believe in the program you have chosen. It looks good to me. I’ll be following along.

776

The RSR looks like an awesome program. I look forward to seeing how your squats improve!

777

I think picking a program really depends on your goals and your personality. If you want to bring your squat up fast, I agree with Brett. If you have 4-6 months to do so and want to take your time and check your ego at the door, maybe 5/3/1 is the way to go.

I’ve run Smolov Jr. a few times. It is very difficult both physically and mentally.

778

nobody minded the guys doing it. but then women start and it becomes ‘attention seeking’ and sexualized.

:frowning:

EDIT: actually, I have to take that back. maybe in the publics eye but in the history of the sport there were complaints about a guy who grunted and it only seems to be more of an issue in womens tennis because there are more female grunters. opponents claim that it hinders their game and the ref is allowed to intervene if one of the players hinders the others game. amazing how much controversy there is over this… about what it does etc.

In fact… There were complaints about the NZ Rugby team (All Blacks) with the Haka, too. That it was intimidating to the opponents. Lol. Of course it was. Er… It is sports - right?

779

YES to ego struggles!! That’s the way it should be, no?

(what i want to say is, “you’ve tasted the snatch and now you want more.” lol! but that would be crass)

That’s great that you’re recognizing when you break the lifting pattern! An inch off the floor though? What do you think goes wrong?

And yes, RSR does look fun! I like programs.

Also, have you ever thought to ramp less on the snatch? Maybe try 2.5kg increases? you might surprise yourself :slight_smile:

Vids look interesting! I’ll have to have a look.

Good stuff!

780

Hey Alexus
I found this youtube vid with Mark Rippetoe talking about holding your breath during a lift, he explains that it is like the yelling during karate(I think), and he explains the importance of either holding your breath or the yell. So it you are looking for an alternative to the yell you could try this.
Clip