I don’t know what to expect, but civil war seems more likely every day. You have those who respect facts and those who make up their own and stick to them with a religious fervor. Then you have a majority stuck in an optimism bias and both-sides-ism. They don’t get it until they taste their own blood.
It can happen here. We can lose this country, it can be divided and everything is currently trending that way.
This is Nietzsche’s death of God essay being animated in real time.
I don’t know what’s going to happen. I know it’s not going to look like what we think it does.
I have been doing a deep dive into the first Civil War and the rhythmic beats from that time are in lock step with what we are experiencing now. People just don’t understand the war at all. There were fairly sizable minorities in the North and the South, who actually agreed with the other’s cause. Most people did not fight in it. Most people were never in physical proximity to it. It affected them proximately, but not actually. Most people did not even die in the actual conflicts neither in Shiloh or Antietam. But there were loads of dead. Most people survived and were fine. The biggest take away is that the condensation of history prevents people from seeing that the battles happened with big gaps in between. It was a grind. And the North who was losing the first 2 years, was grinding the South into dust.
Most of all, most people did not believe it was possible. People went to Manassas to picnic and watch the battle because they thought it too absurd to be possibly really be happening. People believed the first sign of blood and the side that looked out match would throw up their hands and walk away, not believing any cause would be worth such a high price as actual war.
The armies were not prepared, it was piece meal, people signed up for 3 month enlistments. That was to train “fight” and go home. Soldiers on both sides ended up in the same uniforms are their enemies, colors and banners and pomp and circumstance were the order of the day, until the first shots were actually fired. And then the near instantaneous escalation. And never have more people barfed at a picnic then on that day.
Under estimate your enemy’s resolve at your own peril.
The day of the Mar-lago raid, all I could think of was Fort Sumter. Some were gleeful, even giddy. Other’s pissed off, really pissed off. Then there are those of us who were just solemn. We understand what is, what it means and what it stands for. We know “it” has begun, even if we cannot define “it”. I know this much, revenge is coming and what then? When does “owning” turn into killing?
Factoring in the global situation’s with Russia and China and you have the potential to make the first civil war look like a school yard rumble.
Soon people will not be able to engage in “bothsides-ism” and optimism bias, or normalcy bias. There is nothing normal about the times we are living in.
If this sounds morose or even impossible, fair enough. I would never revel in being wrong, more than now. But unless someone can show me where unity and peace and coming together is occurring and over coming the increasing division, well then I welcome it and eat my crow with ketchup, or hell raw if I have to.
Millions could know and the majority could still not know. The mistake people are making is overestimating how many Americans are preoccupied with thoughts of killing other Americans over politics. They assume there are only two sides. Most Americans are not on either of those two sides.
Think about Antifa and the people who stormed the Capitol. When you see how small both groups are, it tells you how motivated most Americans are when it comes to politically motivated violence.
I and others, including the author of the book I linked, do not think there are two sides and unless someone says what two sides they refer to in conversation I won’t know what they’re talking about. They have to state something like “leftists/liberals versus (so-called) conservatives”.
So what? Civil war does not require all adults In a country fighting. Most people who die in wars are noncombatants. One can expect war or even think it’s necessary without wanting it and one can want it with no intentions of participating. Many Americans cheered for or think wars have been necessary while they watched people being bombed on television.
What do these relatively tiny groups of people have to do with thousands or millions of people who expect or want civil war but did not go to the Capitol or aren’t members of antifa? Many Americans lack self control, act prematurely, and are just plain dumb. Others don’t want to have their lives destroyed in prison and will wait to take action when a war starts.
I expect civil war in about 50 years. If it doesn’t happen and I’m still alive by then, I’ll accept predicting wrong.
A really big factor on any internal conflict would be food supply. During the first civil war 80% of the country were farmers. Now, 1% are. Way more people would starve to death today should something like that ever happen. We’re completely reliant on other people for our food and a backyard garden ain’t gonna cut it when the shtf.
It would require those with power do. If two sides made up of a minority of citizens go to war, then it is not a civil war but a glorified gang war.
Where did you get that number from? Your source polled fewer than 10,000 people. The headline was also clickbait as their own findings don’t support it.
I think a majority of people who support the idea of a civil war have no fucking clue what they’re in for. It’s something that should be avoided unless absolutely necessary.
Because of the red/blue divide currently in the US, I think a possible war would more resemble the Revolution than the civil war. No defined boundaries between “warring nations.” Brother vs brother, home vs home, loyalist vs rebel.
As in how terrifying and dangerous one would be? I’ve never experienced one, but as you can see, I’ve given considerable thought to it. Of course one would be awful, as all are. I’m well aware I can likely die in.
If a man concludes voting is unviable, political correctness is stifling his grievances and rational desires, and his country is unmanageable, beyond repair, do you think such a thought is plausible?
No. At least not the kind of war people predict. I could see the possibility of citizens vs the government but not citizens vs citizens over things like abortion, transgenderism, crt, religion, etc. The people who claim they want to fight a war over those issues are like the WNBA.
The largest contributing factor is the failure to realize how very dangerous this current state of highly tense limbo we find ourselves in, is. The prevalence of the biases towards normalcy, the belief that the crazy only remains on the fringes, rather than the realization that it has absolutely captured our highest power structures and is in the active and very efficient proliferation of crushing most human life. In other words, too many people, even those who are against this neo-marxist-like post modernism still refuse to believe ‘it’ can happen here. This country can fall, as we know it or knew it. And once the flaming boot is in your ass, it’s too late to do anything about it.
What I do know is when the government sends the bus to my house, I will not get on.
Realize that the US justice department has actually said that ‘ultra-right wing’ and ‘white nationalism’ is the country’s greatest threat above all others. Really? I mean it’s a bad ideology, but how can a category so small, with so few in it’s ranks, rise above the most infamous terrorists of our time? What are we missing? Oh, btw, they redefined those terms, they just forgot to tell people.
To few have put together that these loosely defined terms apply to anybody who disagrees with the current establishment.
It can happen here. It’s happening. I only know one thing about tomorrow, it’s going to be worse than today. It’s not fringe anymore.
We’re very close to not being able to vote it right again, or at least better. If we have a repeat of voting irregularities in the midterms or in 24, I think it’s game over. At that point you’ve back the dog into the corner. But will it lay down and beg, or bite? Without ballots being an option, people will resort to bullets. It’s history on repeat.
I just wanted to stress the realities of what an internal war would look like. Too many people are gung ho “let’s start fighting boys,” without considering the real ramifications. They come , you run out the back door with your rifle and they take your family into custody, likely to a camp. You get into a shootout with authorities, and everyone dies. Millions of people starve to death since no one is capable of providing for themselves anymore. How many people are going to be willing to fight when without a grocery store, they die?
I think you understand the gravity of the choices, but many people don’t. I have my convictions, and I pray to God they never have to be tested.
Civil war will only be possible if someone will profit from it. Like every war that has ever been fought. How many wars have been fought over ideological differences? Even the religious wars were about money. You go to war to take the other guy’s stuff, not to change his mind on some political view.
I’m supposed to believe a politician can fix this, that politicians didn’t enforce policies that lead to this, and that I should “unite” with people who supported policies that lead to this.
When the author of that article refers to one as a “Leftist,” do you think that’s anyone who votes for Democrats? Genuinely curious what your interpretation was.