and what does Wendler feel about it?
Why not ask him directly? He has a forum on this site.
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It’s just a redundant way to manipulate your training max. If you want more reps on the last set (the one that matters, not splitting hairs on the warmups), all it takes is a lower training max, not pretending to come up with a variation.
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I read the article…what the hell ! The guy whom wrote it obviously knew jack and shit about 5/3/1 since his whole point was about lack of volume.
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Lol thank you.
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I was just about to submit my article entitled: 7/4/2 for those that think 5/3/1 isn’t enough volume and 8/6/3 is too much. I was hoping it would lead to a book deal and my own sub-forum on T-Nation, but based on the comments on this thread now I’m not so sure.
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Is your 7/4/2 okay for curls?
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It’s funny to see people bash 8/6/3 like it’s garbage. It’s not 5/3/1. The author doesn’t claim to reinvent 5/3/1. He also suggests running 5/3/1 for awhile to gain an understanding of it.
8,6,3 reminds me of pyramid training. If I were concerned with volume then I’d consider it as an option. I never cared for 5 x 10 assistance work.
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Yeah. 8/6/3 looks like a solid program. It should have nothing to do with 5/3/1 though. Like others have said - you can always manipulate your TM.
Gotta love Wendler
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FYI… not bashing it. Just dont agree regarding the whole volume thing.
I don’t look to 5/3/1 for volume. At best I’ll run 5/3/1 for a main lift and something else for my bodybuilding needs. In my mind, I completely separate hypertrophy/size training from 5/3/1.
I’m not saying that 5/3/1 doesn’t work for size; I just don’t enjoy it.
I know this isn’t the Flame Flame thread but I must admit that I bookmarked the 8/6/3 program for future consideration.
Wendler + Smolov = Super Program!
My chest isnt growing with 531 for flat bench cos i do BBB for upper chest hence when i came across 863 i was interested ! But i hope a lot of people arent dogmatic about training. 863 looks similar to matt ogus’ 753 or something, im guessing for muscle and strength 863 should work but i wanted more feed back on it before i jump onto it.
I’ve heard that if you do 1/3/5, you will be able to hear satanic messages from the plates.
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You can literally manipulate numbers and percentages however you want to fit your training style. 531 follows the same principles as most quality programming which can be endured for an extended period of time, the heavy light medium approach. Once you understand this fully, you will start seeing it everywhere. Sam Byrd wrote an article years ago about how he does extremely sub maximal explosive 5x5 with his squat and dead (around 60%) one day and works up to a heavy 3 or 5 in a sub taxing lift (rack pulls and front squats) another day. To me this is not so different from 531 with 5x5 fsl work. Bill Starr popularized HLM and if you just took the 3 week wave from 531 and layed it out over 1 week instead of 3 it wouldnt look dissimilar from his intermediate programs. The texas method isnt so different from 531 with SSL work done on different days and Westside could be 5s pro with jokers and fsl on dynamic day (conjugating with load rather then exercise selection). Hell if you liked arnolds methods and wanted to use info jim has put out for progression you could take the 5x531 approach and go
week 1: 12 at 70, 10 at 75, 8 at 80, 6 at 85
week 2: 12 at 75, 10 at 80, 8 at 85, 6 at 90
week 3: 12 at 80, 10 at 85, 8 at 90, 6 at 95
Heavy Light Medium
Just set your training max low enough.
The cube method: Heavy Light Medium
Juggernaut Method: Heavy Light Medium
Strength Lab: Heavy Light Medium
Sheiko: He really changed it up and did an extremely extended version going medium light medium heavy lol
Jim has said in multiple interviews that he set up 531 using a solid foundation of principles based on how HE likes to train which is working up to a heavy set and backing off and getting a ton of reps in. He has also made variations in his books for people that like to train differently then he does. In the end you need to find out how you like to train but take the principles from proper programming to ensure stimulus recovery and adaptation is occuring.
One other point ill make is for the volume for the sake of volume crowd. Go look at Eddie Hall, Brian Shaw and most of the other worlds strongest man competitors training programs. Generally its a bro split with 3 to 4 exercises each day working up to a single heavy top set on each exercise. Nothing special. Eat food and train hard and consistently for a long period of time.
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Just dont ask Jim what he thinks because if its different then his method, he has made it pretty clear over the course of all the books he has written. It is not the way HE would train. So why and how could he reccomend it.
if you play Judas Priest backwards it tells you to do Starting Strength
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What’s worse though is that, if you read Starting Strength forwards, it ALSO tells you to do Starting Strength.
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